On Jan 17, 8:19*am, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 18:23:48 on
Mon, 16 Jan 2012, Paul Corfield remarked:

The exit route will be off the south end of the concourse as expected.
The footbridge and escalators will be for those using the upper level
of the new concourse. I took a little walk round and I think there
will a large circulating area between the buffer stops and exit
gateline. *While I take your point about the potential for mixed flows
I wonder if the new way of working will be any worse than people
pouring off trains on to a small jam packed concourse with people
simultaneously heading on to trains.

One of the changes they've made in the last year or two (I can't say
exactly when) was to rope off a corridor across the old concourse in
front of the departure board. I suppose that directs people towards the
newish stairs down to the tube station, but it does reduce the number of
people filtering through the waiting crowds.

I didn't really spot that but then I was more looking for what's new
rather than what will disappear.

Although that begs the question of the waiting crowds. Years ago they
used to have queue "lanes" marked on the floor of the concourse and
people would more or less stand in lines waiting for their train to be
ready. Now it's just one chaotic scrum because no-one is told which
platform the train is leaving from until the very last minute.

I did notice people were congregating by a small destination display
near platform 8, which you can see as you come up from the tube,
rather than standing on the main concourse. I suppose there might be a
marginal sprinting advantage if your departure is from P6-8. I also
noticed that there was a fenced off area behind some of the buffer
stops - I assume this is related to some of the ticket gates being in
service (given comments from other posters in this thread).

It's been a long time since I used KX Mainline but can well recall the
old queue lanes. Always seemed a decent enough idea given the vast
numbers of people who wait for trains. The last time I caught a train
there I was caught up in a big delay with half the trains cancelled
which meant an absolute stampede once a platform was announced. I was
quite shocked at how aggressive people were at getting on the train
and then (almost) fighting for a seat (even in First Class). I can
understand why there might be problems in releasing the platform info
in such circumstances but there should not (IMO) be a delay in normal
circumstances.

Presumably they'll be trying to encourage people to wait on the new
concourse for the platform announcement, rather than filtering through
the barriers to the platform area and then waiting. That's the scheme at
StPancrasMML, assisted by a lack of platform information beyond the
barriers. Of course, what that does is create a long queue for the
barriers as soon as the platform is announced, with people increasingly
anxious that the train's going to leave without them.

I suspect you may be correct that that will be the tactic. However the
announcement of platforms / trains need to be in sufficient time to
allow people through the gates and then to reach their platform and
train. I can imagine they will have a riot on their hands if they hold
everyone back until 4 mins before departure when the train is on
platform 0. They seem to be able to manage Euston OK - I know there
are not automatic gates (for Virgin) but there is more often than not
(IMLE) a visual ticket inspection before you're allowed on the
platform. I know you can queue on the ramp but you still need a
proper time margin to get everyone through and for them to find their
carriage / seat.

I don't wish to debate the rights or wrongs of St Pancras. I would
merely comment that neither station is a green field site and
therefore there will inevitably be some compromises about how you deal
with flows when dealing with intensive train services and the related
floods of passengers.

The first set of escalators for the MML platforms should have been
turned through 90 degrees, to end near their ticket office. As it is,
the MML concourse is needlessly remote from that ticket office, the main
departure board (which seems a bit lost where it is at the moment) the
toilets, SPILL barriers and the Northern ticket hall for the tube. Even
if the rest of the design remained, that one small change would make
quite a difference.

I can see what you mean. I doubt anyone will want to contemplate such
changes to St Pancras given people have been "managing" with the
current layout for a number of years.

Kings Cross will be an interesting "experiment", because I can't think
of another big terminus where there's not a substantial concourse beyond
the buffers. I know they realise they have issues at Kings Cross with
persuading passengers toward the Piazza (doubtless vainly when it's
pouring with rain outside).

Indeed and we shall see what happens in due course when Network Rail /
East Coast / FCC have got used to how the public do / want to use the
place and how many complaints there are from people walking out into
April showers ;-) Let's hope all the ticket gates are reversible and
signage is switchable!

--
Paul C
via Google