On 13 Nov, 12:32, Jamie Thompson wrote:
On Nov 13, 11:45 am, wrote:

On Nov 13, 11:27 am, Mizter T wrote:

(snip)

If anyone does have any knowledge of this upcoming change to zones 7-9
please do feel free to share it!

Quite.

Jonn

When I bought my ticket from Harrow & Wealdstone this morning, there
was a tube map stuck to the top of the machine with zones 7, 8 and 9
shown on it. It was relatively small though, and there was a queue, so
all I managed to see was what was already confirmed, namely that Hatch
End is in 6, Carpenders Park in 7, Bushey and Watford HS in 8, and
Watford Junction in 9. I still think it's almost criminal that zone 6
is so narrow around those parts...Carpenders Park should be in 6, if
indeed not Bushey as Moor Park and West Ruislip somehow manage it.

I'll see if I can spot anything else of use this evening.


Perhaps I haven't been following things closely enough but I wasn't
aware that the zonal changes up to Watford Junction had in fact been
confirmed - though this map you've seen would appear to confirm it.

That'd appear to put paid to my elaborate fantasy plan of having
lettered zone suffixes (zone 9M, 7G and so on - described upthread)!

Zones 7-9 thus appear to be a new device so as to include the Watford
Junction line into the zonal system - so whilst the original
speculation that it might be included in zone A isn't accurate, it
will join the zonal system albeit in a slightly different manner.

Regarding the thinness of zone 6 - there used to be only 5 zones, but
AIUI the sixth was created largely because of pressure from Network
SouthEast (as was). The logic behind this move is explained in chapter
10 of the 1991 Monopolies and Mergers Commission report on London
Underground...

-----
source (PDF):
http://www.competition-commission.or...ext/305c10.pdf
-----
10.15. The outer boundary of Zone 5 reflected the old GLC area. The
zone extended considerably further from Central London in some
directions than others. This was of particular concern to NSE as it
meant that fares on some of its radial routes from points at or just
outside the Zone 5 boundary had to be held down below their normal
level related to mileage from the Central London terminal because of
the need to relate fares to the standard all-zones Travelcard. In the
January 1991 fares increase the opportunity was taken to split Zone 5
into two zones, thereby creating a Zone 6. Fares from stations in Zone
6 to other zones were increased by slightly more than fares from Zone
5. The current fares structure is summarised in Table 10.1.
-----


In the past the logic for including stations that fall outside of
Greater London in the 6 zones has apparently been because they serve
communities that fall within the Greater London boundary. With regards
to the early 90's change to Zone 6 so that it stretches up to Epping
on the Central line, this is reputedly because Essex County Council
agreed to contribute a sum of money towards LUL (I don't know whether
they still do so).

However the more recent changes along the southern periphery don't
follow this logic. Perhaps the TOC in question (Southern and for one
station SWT) doesn't get an extra slice of the Travelcard cake simply
as a result of extending the zones (i.e. Greater London money isn't
being spent on supporting services outside of Greater London), but
instead the TOC is possibly relying on bringing in more revenue by
means of increased ticket sales from these stations.

Various pronouncements certainly suggest that it is the DfT who is
ultimately responsible for sanctioning any changes to the zones (such
as any extensions to zone 6), at least as far as National Rail routes
are concerned - though presumably there is a degree of interplay with
Transport for London as well.

All of the above could of course be a load of cobblers. I'd be very
interested to know more about how the zoning of London actually works
though, if anyone knows.