On 31 May, 14:54, "Andrew Heenan" wrote:
"Richardr" wrote ...



"Andrew Heenan" wrote
Thameslink already has two quite separate services, the metro (via the
Sutton Loop), and the Bedford to Brighton. It would make perfect sense
for LOROL to control the metro service, but not the long distance. LOROL
would then take a chair at the timetabling meetings and negotiate paths
liek everyone else. *LOROL can share lines with other services just like
the other TOCs do.
But then that doesn't solve the revenue allocation question, which is what
this discussion is about, it just moves it.
You have even more shared journeys between the privately owned and run
Bedford to Brighton service and the TfL service.
What's more, it is then in the interests of the privately run Bedford
trains to stop at, say, Mill Hill, Hendon, West Hampstead, and Kentish
Town, for example, purely to share in the revenue from those stations,
even though that pattern isn't optimal for anyone outside of Greater
London.

The post I responded to widened the discussion (as have others and your
post), to cover the effects on service.

The divvying of fares is currently an issue because TfL and NR have
historically assesed fares in very different ways; Oyster with zones, NR
with cheap day returns, etc., etc., It's an issue because the different
stakeholders unsurprisingly want the best outcome.

But it really isn't a make or break for London's railways; eventually
they'll come up with a formula (sadly much more complex than those proposed
in this thread), and life will go on, with Oysters for all.

The eventual outcome will almost certainly be that all fares totally within
the zones will be based on the TfL system, and at a common price;

Southern have stated previously that they didn't want to make the
fares the same as TfL zonal fares, and I believe they were considering
having different single fares for the South London TOCs, especially
SWT which was refusing to accept oyster at all unless the condition of
them being able to set different fares was met, hence the slow take-up
of Oyster in SWT-land. Not to mention SWT's own brand of smartcard
which is being rolled out soon.

I hope that they drop the argument that fares should be independent,
because this complicates issues further if they don't follow the same
fares as TfL has set in North London for Tube, NR and combinations.

journeys
reaching outside the zones will continue as now - and, either way, the
Railway_Clearing_House's successors *will continue to divide the spondulux
successfully they have continuously since 1842 on the national network.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railway_Clearing_House

Whether TfL takes on more metro services is quite separate, and will (almost
inevitably) happen at some point.

Yes, I agree