On Feb 4, 9:42*am, Graeme wrote:
In message
* * * * * ticketyboo wrote:

On Feb 4, 9:03 am, Graeme wrote:

While we all accept you were doing it for purely altruistic reasons you
obviously haven't thought it through.

I once spotted a lonely Oyster card on an LU train. Everyone else
ignored it as the journey out of London proceeded, until there were
only about 5 of us in the coach. As I got off, I also ignored it...
Does this thread really have much point about it now?

You didn't try and chat it up, make it feel less lonely?

The risks of that action (being seen or otherwise logged in possession
if it) probably figured in personal risk assessment...

On Feb 4, 10:02*am, Chris Tolley (ukonline
really) wrote:

One of the things that is axiomatic in my line of business is that
nobody is perfect, and that we have a tendency (memorably crystallised
in a comment about motes and beams) to ignore our own defects while
overplaying defects in others. If one accepts that there is some truth
in that view, where do you think people are going to be found who will
always carry out their duties 100% accurately, especially in
circumstances where they may be confronted by people who are out to
subvert the process? You seem to be expecting as high a standard (of
capability, let alone integrity and knowledge of the law) as gets people
called saints in circumstances I am more familiar with.

A friend who recently (after many years of being a master craftsman
working for businesses that kept on being killed off by recessions)
became a bus driver with (name redacted to protect the downtrodden) is
very worried that he will be sacked peremptorily because on an early
turn he forgot that he was driving the nnnA route and not the more
normal nnn route. It seems that such sackings have been happening. He
tells me that the depot staff didn't warn him about the route as he
was taking the bus out that first week on that turn, which warning
would be best practice by an employer.

ticketyboo wrote:

A friend who recently (after many years of being a master craftsman
working for businesses that kept on being killed off by recessions)
became a bus driver with (name redacted to protect the downtrodden) is
very worried that he will be sacked peremptorily because on an early
turn he forgot that he was driving the nnnA route and not the more
normal nnn route. It seems that such sackings have been happening. He
tells me that the depot staff didn't warn him about the route as he
was taking the bus out that first week on that turn, which warning
would be best practice by an employer.

Back in the day when I earned a living programming mainframes, one of my
colleagues was summoned to the boss's office as soon as she arrived for
work. The boss had a somewhat ogre-ish reputation. What had happened was
that a program that she had written had corrupted the company's records
overnight*. As a result, the data was having to be restored from the
previous day's backup, and the overnight run was going to have to be
restarted, meaning that company-wide, all the info on the screens would
be one-day behind. Once she had understood why she was being summoned to
the office, she feared it was to be sacked. He said something like, "do
you realise how much this has cost us?" Someone had told the boss that
the problem caused by the program would effectively cost the company
about GBP100,000 (don't know where they got the figure from, BTW). After
being told, she *knew* she was for the chop. Then he said, "... so given
that we've invested all that money in your training, you won't make the
same mistake again, will you?" We were all surprised by that.

* in fact, while the error in the program was her doing, the fact that
it had been run against production data, rather than test data, which
was the real cause of the problem that needed sorting out, was somebody
else's error.

--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p13857146.html
(D100 at Tyseley, 4 Oct 1987)

On Thu, 04 Feb 2010 09:48:22 +0000
David Hansen wrote:
However, because of the power this involves they must be very
carefully controlled to keep abuses to a minimum. That is missing at
the moment, as demonstrated by many examples I have given.

I think the main problem is the bylaws councils can make up on a whim and
then have the legal right to enforce. Fining people for not putting their
rubbish in the correct recycle bins for example or changing parking times
and not telling anyone then ticketing hundreds of cars and making a fortune.

If you want to see incompetance , inflexibility, thwarted ambition, delusions
of grandure, money worship and general spite and vindictiveness all wrapped up
in one bitter little package just go and say hello to a local councillor.

B2003

d wrote:

I think the main problem is the bylaws councils can make up on a whim and
then have the legal right to enforce. Fining people for not putting their
rubbish in the correct recycle bins for example

That doesn't seem a particularly good example of something made up on a
whim. It's part of a policy that has probably taken years to develop.

Do you have any actual examples of a byelaw made up on a whim?
--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p9633103.html
(56 050 at Reading, Jul 1985)

On Feb 4, 10:59*am, wrote:

If you want to see incompetance , inflexibility, thwarted ambition, delusions
of grandure, money worship and general spite and vindictiveness all wrapped up
in one bitter little package just go and say hello to a local councillor.

I can think of just one or two like that in my local Council, but very
much not true in my Ward or neighbouring Wards. They tend to be very
worried about having to fight the officers. Relevance? The officers
don't work anywhere near effectively enough at making the rail
services here work for us (like doing the Local Authority's part in
enabling and overseeing connecting bus services that do the job that
we need).

On Thu, 4 Feb 2010 11:05:57 +0000
Chris Tolley (ukonline really) wrote:
wrote:

I think the main problem is the bylaws councils can make up on a whim and
then have the legal right to enforce. Fining people for not putting their
rubbish in the correct recycle bins for example

That doesn't seem a particularly good example of something made up on a
whim. It's part of a policy that has probably taken years to develop.

Years my arse. They jumped on the greenwash bandwagon and in the process saved
themselves employing people to do it. Get the public to do it and fine them
if they don't. And then in a lot of cases all the "recycled" material just
goes to landfill or gets incinerated anyway. If you need examples google them.

Do you have any actual examples of a byelaw made up on a whim?

See above.

B2003

d wrote:

On Thu, 4 Feb 2010 11:05:57 +0000
Chris Tolley (ukonline really) wrote:
wrote:

I think the main problem is the bylaws councils can make up on a whim and
then have the legal right to enforce. Fining people for not putting their
rubbish in the correct recycle bins for example

That doesn't seem a particularly good example of something made up on a
whim. It's part of a policy that has probably taken years to develop.

Years my arse. They jumped on the greenwash bandwagon and in the
process saved themselves employing people to do it. Get the public to
do it and fine them if they don't. And then in a lot of cases all the
"recycled" material just goes to landfill or gets incinerated anyway.
If you need examples google them.

I don't need examples. I need to know that you are making a valid point.
Unfortunately, when challenged on specific points you often melt away
into the background. Looks like you're doing so again.

--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p14486554.html
(43 062 at Reading, 13 Jul 1999)

On Wed, Feb 03, 2010 at 02:38:21PM -0800, MIG wrote:

Then the next day I handed it to a woman in a travel information
office. She did make a point of saying that I couldn't use it, which
I hadn't suggested doing.

Of course you couldn't use it, as you'd just handed it in!

--
David Cantrell | Nth greatest programmer in the world

Compromise: n: lowering my standards so you can meet them

On Wed, Feb 03, 2010 at 11:56:01AM -0800, MIG wrote:

Assuming the former, it is beyond doubt that there are physical
opportunities to get the refund.

There are also physical opportunities to bugger sheep. Of course, to do
that you have to first go to Wales, but the opportunities exist.
Similarly, to get the refund, you first have to get to one of the few
places that deal with them, and then get home afterwards, paying the
cash penalty fare for doing so. So yeah, the opportunity exists. But
it might as well not exist.

--
David Cantrell | Official London Perl Mongers Bad Influence

What a lovely day! Now watch me spoil it for you.