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In article ,
(solar penguin) wrote:

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In article
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(Dr. Sunil) wrote:

On 21 May, 00:47, wrote:
In article
,

Also why the "Do not alight here" signs on a platform with seats
on it?

Could they be temporary? Maybe Spanish Solution (two platforms
serving the same track) is to be implemented?

Doubt it, though I notice there is also a sign indicating train
departures as well.

They probably just haven't got around to removing the seats and
indicator yet. The main priority has got to be getting the new
platforms ready, not tidying up the one that's being taken out of
use.

OIC. So that was the platform in use but they are abandoning it? Why adopt
a more costly option like that?

I think the main practical reason might be to allow them to provide one less
lift when they get round to the access improvments. A single lift to access
(newly renumbered) P5/6 can easily be provided at the same level as the P1/2
footbridge and the lift to P3/4.

There's also a possibility that easy cross platform interchange was a
separate aim, arriving from Gypsy Hill (into new P6) it might potentially be
the best place to transfer to a waiting LO service standing in new P5 -
depending on your final destination.

Paul S

On Fri, 21 May 2010 17:48:44 +0100, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

Not at all likely as [IIRC from discussions in uk.railway] current mainline
stock door controls only allow opening on one side.

Really? I'd be surprised if you couldn't open both sides
separately[1]. Unless the "close" buttons close all doors regardless
of size, in which case you'd need more staff to watch the "wrong" side
when closing.

[1] You definitely can on 321s, as these can often be seen in
Bletchley CS with all doors open on both sides, presumably during
cleaning.

Neil
--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
To reply put my first name before the at.

Neil Williams wrote:
On Fri, 21 May 2010 17:48:44 +0100, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

Not at all likely as [IIRC from discussions in uk.railway] current
mainline stock door controls only allow opening on one side.

Really? I'd be surprised if you couldn't open both sides
separately[1]. Unless the "close" buttons close all doors regardless
of size, in which case you'd need more staff to watch the "wrong" side
when closing.

[1] You definitely can on 321s, as these can often be seen in
Bletchley CS with all doors open on both sides, presumably during
cleaning.

Yes - in the general case I think it's probably to do with a single guard or
driver (when in one man operation mode) only being able to sight one side
clear at a time, but I'm sure we've also been told here before that on stock
like Desiros or Electrostars the position of the guard's key defines the
only side that will open.

Of course that may be overidden in depots somehow.

Paul S

On 21 May, 17:48, "Paul Scott" wrote:

Could they be temporary? Maybe Spanish Solution (two platforms serving
the same track) is to be implemented?

Not at all likely as [IIRC from discussions in uk.railway] current mainline
stock door controls only allow opening on one side.

Why would that be the case' I'm not saying that it isn't? At some
busy locations having separate entrance and exit platforms on opposite
sides, and opening the exit doors first seems like a good idea, though
it seems unlikely that they would want to do it here. Isn't this what
they're doing on the Central Line at Stratford?

I was at Crystal Palace today; came into the new platform 5, and
departed from platform 2 on a train to croydon. The now disused old
platform 4 is clearly not intended to be used anytime soon, though I
did read somewhere that it was going to be kept in a state such that
it could be re-instated if an extra platform was ever needed. The end
of the footbridge leading to this platform has been blocked by
decorative railings. there is a locked gate in them, but it is too
narrow to be intended for public use. Strangely, the steps to this
platform Seem to have new handrails, including a lower rail for use by
children, as with he steps to the new centre platform.

The steps leading down onto the trackbed of the long-disused bay on
the other side of this platform do indeed provide access to a S&T
cabinet. Beyond this cabinet the old stop block still exists in this
bay, despite that it's had no track in it for many years.

Climbing up the stairs to the footbridge to the footbridge from the
recently re-built cebtre platform I'm rather puzzled. I'm pretty sure
that there used to be two tracks between what is now platform 6, and
the recently disused platform, and I think the new centre platform has
been built wider than the old one was, though I never saw the old
one. I can't quite make out what the old arrangement was. As I was
climbing the stairs I thought they looked rather wider than they used
to be, and assumed that they had been widened. However, once I
reached the footbridge, I saw that right next to these stairs was what
I had seen in the past, and assumed to be the stairs to the then
demolished centre platform. This if fact seems to be a steep slope,
about as steep as a staircase, but with no steps, just strips of woo
fixed across it, and it doesn't go right down to the platform, only
about half way. Was this the old staircase, cut back at some time, or
something else? I'm pretty sure that there were some rooms on the
short stub of the old centre platform which used to be there under the
bridge,so staff must have had access to them somehow.

Something I didn't think to check while I was there; access to trains
from the new platform 6 is now from the opposite side to when it was
from the old platform 4. Has the conductor rail on this track been
moved to the opposite side?

The site of the stop blocks for the old Croydon bays has been covered
by some large green boxes; site huts for the building works possibly?

wrote:
On 21 May, 17:48, "Paul Scott" wrote:

Not at all likely as [IIRC from discussions in uk.railway] current
mainline stock door controls only allow opening on one side.

Why would that be the case' I'm not saying that it isn't? At some
busy locations having separate entrance and exit platforms on opposite
sides, and opening the exit doors first seems like a good idea, though
it seems unlikely that they would want to do it here. Isn't this what
they're doing on the Central Line at Stratford?

As I've mentioned in another post tonight I think it's more to do with the
staff not being able to safely check the doors on both sides prior to
departure - but I'm basically going by previous posts that reckon modern
stock doesn't allow more than one door control panel to be used at the same
time. I guess LU must have much better CCTV - just how many doors are there
are on both sides of a Central Line train?

Climbing up the stairs to the footbridge to the footbridge from the
recently re-built cebtre platform I'm rather puzzled. I'm pretty sure
that there used to be two tracks between what is now platform 6, and
the recently disused platform, and I think the new centre platform has
been built wider than the old one was, though I never saw the old
one. I can't quite make out what the old arrangement was.

I never saw the central platform arrangements, although I've seen photos of
the more recent wide open space with a couple of sidings in the middle, but
as the tracks go through the main building there seem to be faces on both
sides of the single through track. Might these platform faces have continued
so that the two through tracks had double faces, and there were two bays in
the centre? There's bound to be someone along soon with the facts...

..... This if fact seems to be a steep slope,
about as steep as a staircase, but with no steps, just strips of woo
fixed across it, and it doesn't go right down to the platform, only
about half way. Was this the old staircase, cut back at some time, or
something else? I'm pretty sure that there were some rooms on the
short stub of the old centre platform which used to be there under the
bridge,so staff must have had access to them somehow.

Is that stub of the stairs which would have gone down in line with the new
platform 5 tracks? They appear to have been cut off at some time to allow
for a traction supplies building to be built on the disused platform end.
It's right in front as you emerge into the main shed from platform 2.

Does the photo here help?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dolly_d...7594122920191/

Paul S

On May 23, 9:41*pm, wrote:
[snip]

I was at Crystal Palace today; came into the new platform 5, and
departed from platform 2 on a train to croydon. *The now disused old
platform 4 is clearly not intended to be used anytime soon, though I
did read somewhere that it was going to be kept in a state such that
it could be re-instated if an extra platform was ever needed. *The end
of the footbridge leading to this platform has been blocked by
decorative railings. *there is a locked gate in them, but it is too
narrow to be intended for public use. *[snip]

The gate wasn't actually locked today.

Mizter T wrote:
On May 23, 9:41 pm, wrote:
[snip]

I was at Crystal Palace today; came into the new platform 5, and
departed from platform 2 on a train to croydon. The now disused old
platform 4 is clearly not intended to be used anytime soon, though I
did read somewhere that it was going to be kept in a state such that
it could be re-instated if an extra platform was ever needed. The end
of the footbridge leading to this platform has been blocked by
decorative railings. there is a locked gate in them, but it is too
narrow to be intended for public use. [snip]

The gate wasn't actually locked today.

Maybe they had a few drivers opening up on the wrong side!

Paul S

On 23 May, 22:23, "Paul Scott" wrote:

Is that stub of the stairs which would have gone down in line with the new
platform 5 tracks? They appear to have been cut off at some time to allow
for a traction supplies building to be built on the disused platform end.
It's right in front as you emerge into the main shed from platform 2.

Does the photo here help?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dolly_d.../set-720575941...

Paul S

Yes, that looks like it. The building just visible on the right, with
what looks like yellow tape on it is the TP hut, or whatever it is,
with the track feeder cables coming out of the side, isn't it? If
these were the original steps to the old centre platform, then where
was the access to the room which can be seen behind the signal head?
Maybe a narrow staircase was built where the new one is, and widened
for the new service. Does anybody know when the old centre platform
was removed? I suspcet it was long ago, The Palace was in decline
years before it burned down, so some of the platforms were probably
already out of use by that time.

wrote in message
...
On 23 May, 22:23, "Paul Scott" wrote:

Is that stub of the stairs which would have gone down in line with the
new
platform 5 tracks? They appear to have been cut off at some time to allow
for a traction supplies building to be built on the disused platform end.
It's right in front as you emerge into the main shed from platform 2.

Does the photo here help?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dolly_d.../set-720575941...

Paul S

Yes, that looks like it. The building just visible on the right, with
what looks like yellow tape on it is the TP hut, or whatever it is,
with the track feeder cables coming out of the side, isn't it? If
these were the original steps to the old centre platform, then where
was the access to the room which can be seen behind the signal head?
Maybe a narrow staircase was built where the new one is, and widened
for the new service. Does anybody know when the old centre platform
was removed? I suspcet it was long ago, The Palace was in decline
years before it burned down, so some of the platforms were probably
already out of use by that time.

From my visits to the station over the last couple of years, I don't think
any significant work has been done to the stairs - other than a good clean,
and as you suggest the handrails. The one you describe using to get from the
new central platform was always there, just gated off.

As I suggested in the my previous post, I don't think there was a central
island, I think it might have been like this, if t works out, where S is
stairs, p is platform and t track:

West ---- East

SSSStttttttttttttttttttttt
pppppppppppppp
ttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt (through line)
pppppppppppppp
SSSSpppttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt
SSSSppptttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt
pppppppppppppp
ttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt (through line)
pppppppppppppp
SSSSttttttttttttttttttttttt

Paul S

On 24 May, 13:33, "Paul Scott" wrote:
wrote in message

...





On 23 May, 22:23, "Paul Scott" wrote:

Is that stub of the stairs which would have gone down in line with the
new
platform 5 tracks? They appear to have been cut off at some time to allow
for a traction supplies building to be built on the disused platform end.
It's right in front as you emerge into the main shed from platform 2.

Does the photo here help?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dolly_d.../set-720575941....

Paul S

Yes, that looks like it. *The building just visible on the right, with
what looks like yellow tape on it is the TP hut, or whatever it is,
with the track feeder cables coming out of the side, isn't it? *If
these were the original steps to the old centre platform, then where
was the access to the room which can be seen behind the signal head?
Maybe a narrow staircase was built where the new one is, and widened
for the new service. *Does anybody know when the old centre platform
was removed? *I suspcet it was long ago, *The Palace was in decline
years before it burned down, so some of the platforms were probably
already out of use by that time.

From my visits to the station over the last couple of years, I don't think
any significant work has been done to the stairs - other than a good clean,
and as you suggest the handrails. The one you describe using to get from the
new central platform was always there, just gated off.

As I suggested in the my previous post, I don't think there was a central
island, I think it might have been like this, if t works out, where S is
stairs, p is platform and t track:

West ---- East

SSSStttttttttttttttttttttt
pppppppppppppp
ttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt * (through line)
pppppppppppppp
SSSSpppttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt
SSSSppptttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt
pppppppppppppp
ttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt * (through line)
pppppppppppppp
SSSSttttttttttttttttttttttt

Paul S- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You could be right. That would give the six tracks that I'm pretty
sure I saw in the old picture, platforms on both sides of most tracks,
to cope with the large crowds. Platforms would have been rather
narrow by todays standards, but that was often the case then.

If you were to remove the two centre tracks, and build a wall down the
centre supporting the roof, then I think you would have the track
arrangement of the high-level station.Of course, at high-level the
tracks extended beyond the station onto the turntable. The low-level
seems to have had no way to release a locomotive from the bay
platforms before the stock was removed, unless things were changed
after electrification.