On 2010\09\28 11:57, Walter Briscoe wrote:

Piccadilly: EW except NS at Finsbury Park

Unless it's changed recently, it was N/S at every station from
Cockfosters to Russell Square, and N/W at Holborn (the Aldwych platform
was called southbound from Holborn).

Incidentally, my spell-checker tries to turn Cockfosters into, well,
French MEPs.

On 28 Sep, 09:01, David Hansen wrote

That would be a problem, though not a great one.

Two of the larger exceptions down south to up and down referring to
London are South Wales, where up is up the valley, and former
Midland Railway lines where up is towards Derby.

Thanks, that's very interesting. Did the Midland definitions of up/
down remain after grouping, indeed if you travel from Trent jk to
StPan, are you still heading down? Wasn't the former MS&L line was
"up" into Cleethorpes.

Rgds/Ted

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 04:48:57 -0700 (PDT) someone who may be tedjrr
wrote this:-

Did the Midland definitions of up/down remain after grouping,

They remain to this day. Changing designation would be a fraught
task, I can see why it would be put off even if it was thought to be
a good idea.

Lines presumably change designation somewhere in Derby Midland
station. Perhaps there is some sort of object which marks the spot.

Also some designations might not be logical with the current railway
map. I don't know if it happens anywhere, but the designations may
have been set originally via a route which is now closed, such as
the former route from London to Nottingham via Corby and Melton
Mowbray.

indeed if you travel from Trent jk to StPan, are you still heading down?

I should have been more explicit. Up to Derby applied to lines not
going to London. The result of this is that a train from Birmingham
approaching Derby is running on the Up Main, while a train from
London, which will end up at the same platform, is running on the
Down Main. Both will depart on the Down Main, according to my 1980
Quail map.




--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000...#pt3-pb3-l1g54

In message
"Graham Harrison" wrote:


"Graeme" wrote in message
...
In message
"Graham Harrison" wrote:

On the "Main Line" trains are usually referred to as going "up" or "down"
by
the staff. However, it seems that, even "London Transport" refer to
Underground lines by their geographic direction; it's not just the public
signs that say "Northbound" etc. Is that correct? Did they ever use
up/down? I've seen it suggested that the reason for using "Southbound"
etc. is related to the American involvement in the building of some of
the
tube lines; comments?


The main line use of up/down is not applicable to the UndergrounD so the
geographic system is more appropriate. I believe such useage predates
Yerkes
involvement.

--
Graeme Wall

This address not read, substitute trains for rail
Transport Miscellany at www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail
Photo galleries at http://graeme-wall.fotopic.net/


Yes, when I read it I did think that (a) up/down wasn't appropriate and (b)
what happened before Yerkes.

But

I also wondered about the Metropolitan given its' grand plans and whether
the line through Rickmansworth was ever up/down?


The brief history of the Metropolitan Line published in 1973 makes no mention
of the terms. Neither does the contemporary How the Underground Works in its
description of four tracking of the line north(!) of Harrow on the Hill.
Negative evidence I know.

--
Graeme Wall

This address not read, substitute trains for rail
Transport Miscellany at www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail
Photo galleries at http://graeme-wall.fotopic.net/

In message , at 13:15:36 on
Tue, 28 Sep 2010, David Hansen
remarked:
indeed if you travel from Trent jk to StPan, are you still heading down?

I should have been more explicit. Up to Derby applied to lines not
going to London. The result of this is that a train from Birmingham
approaching Derby is running on the Up Main, while a train from
London, which will end up at the same platform, is running on the
Down Main. Both will depart on the Down Main, according to my 1980
Quail map.

Assuming the Birmingham train is going to Sheffield, perhaps. If instead
it heads for Long Eaton and Nottingham, presumably that's up to start
with, then down past Trent Junction?
--
Roland Perry

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 13:27:34 +0100 someone who may be Roland Perry
wrote this:-

Assuming the Birmingham train is going to Sheffield, perhaps. If instead
it heads for Long Eaton and Nottingham, presumably that's up to start
with, then down past Trent Junction?

According to my 1980 Quail it will arrive at Derby on the Up Main,
change direction, depart on the Up Main, and from Trent East
Junction run on the Down main, then the Down Fast to Nottingham.
However, the designations may have been changed now, BR having a
fetish at the time for "fast" lines rather than "main" or "through"
lines as they used to be called in some places.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000...#pt3-pb3-l1g54

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 10:40:30 +0100
Steve Fitzgerald ] wrote:
Regarding an earlier comment about why the Picc uses east-west when it
'patently isn't'. Well it's safety; the Picc has been defined as an

Oh BS. It was perfectly safe using north & southbound on the line north of
kings X for 100 years. Why suddenly (apart from nanny state elf-n-softies) is
is suddenly unsafe?

eastbound but it would be silly to keep changing the references as that
would just cause confusion. Once we know which is the eastbound or
westbound road it doesn't matter which actual direction it goes; we
could call them direction Fred and direction John for all it matters as
long as everyone knows what we're talking about.

Then why not do as almost every other metro system does and just use the
termini as the direction?

B2003

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 11:57:58 +0100
Walter Briscoe wrote:
From a customer perspective, all Piccadilly platforms are Eastbound or

From people who live in the area its north and south. LU can use whatever
compass points they want , no one will take any notice.

Waterloo & City: NS

This line uses Waterloo and Bank as its direction of travel. Which makes a lot
more sense IMO.

B2003

On 2010\09\28 14:04, d wrote:
On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 11:57:58 +0100
Walter wrote:
From a customer perspective, all Piccadilly platforms are Eastbound or

From people who live in the area its north and south. LU can use whatever
compass points they want , no one will take any notice.

Waterloo& City: NS

This line uses Waterloo and Bank as its direction of travel. Which makes a lot
more sense IMO.

Really? Not Waterloo and City?

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 14:37:50 +0100
Basil Jet wrote:
This line uses Waterloo and Bank as its direction of travel. Which makes a
lot
more sense IMO.

Really? Not Waterloo and City?

I haven't used it for years but I'm pretty sure it said "To Bank" or something
like that tho perhaps it does say "City". At any rate , it doesn't use compass
directions.

B2003