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Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse
catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Not a million miles from the mezzanine 'catering floor' being provided at the new KX western ticket hall really. Details he http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co...egoryID-8.aspx Paul S |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message , Paul Scott
writes NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Thanks for the link. It does seem extraordinary, though, that over a million pounds a year is being spent in maintaining the unused Eurostar platforms and terminal at Waterloo. I should have thought that bringing them back into use would have been more of a priority. -- Paul Terry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message , at 15:19:12 on
Mon, 15 Nov 2010, Paul Scott remarked: NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse mid-concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Those retail outlets should never have been allowed to clutter up the concourse in the first place! ps What happened to the lower level Eurostar mini-concourses, next to the check-in and around the side where you emerged off a train? Are they being used for extra retailing. -- Roland Perry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message , at 16:28:38 on Mon, 15
Nov 2010, Paul Terry remarked: NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Thanks for the link. It does seem extraordinary, though, that over a million pounds a year is being spent in maintaining the unused Eurostar platforms and terminal at Waterloo. I should have thought that bringing them back into use would have been more of a priority. It's been reported that the bottleneck at Waterloo isn't platform capacity, but tracks outside the station. -- Roland Perry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
"Roland Perry" wrote in message
... In message , at 15:19:12 on Mon, 15 Nov 2010, Paul Scott remarked: NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse mid-concourse Yes, perhaps a better description. catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Those retail outlets should never have been allowed to clutter up the concourse in the first place! ps What happened to the lower level Eurostar mini-concourses, next to the check-in and around the side where you emerged off a train? Are they being used for extra retailing. There are other applications to use the lower parts for retail purposes but those lower areas are BRB residuary's responsibility, rather than Network Rail. This has led to previous media articles suggesting that whole international 'station' would be turned over to retail, which TTBOMK has never been a possibility... Paul S |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Mon, 15 Nov 2010 15:19:12 +0000, Paul Scott wrote
NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Not a million miles from the mezzanine 'catering floor' being provided at the new KX western ticket hall really. Details he http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co...TERLOO-RETAIL- BALCONY -OFFERS-MORE-ROOM-WITH-A-VIEW-15e5/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx Sounds a bit like the two-storey glass enclosed food court on the Lawn at Paddington |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On 15/11/10 15:19, Paul Scott wrote:
NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Ultimately this will be financed out of the pockets of travelling passengers or taxpayers (or both), for I suspect little actual benefit apart from the introduction of new bottlenecks between the concourse and the mezzanine, a longer journey through the station if you want to shop, and less revenue for some of the outlets due to loss of passing trade and impulse purchases, so prices will go up or outlets will cease trading and fares will go up to cover the drop in revenue from letting the outlets. In my opinion this is not the time to be undertaking this sort of capital project. Rgds Denis McMahon |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message , at 17:30:04 on
Mon, 15 Nov 2010, Paul Scott remarked: There are other applications to use the lower parts for retail purposes but those lower areas are BRB residuary's responsibility, rather than Network Rail. This has led to previous media articles suggesting that whole international 'station' would be turned over to retail, which TTBOMK has never been a possibility... If you demolished the check-in gates and security area (I expect they've been robbed of all their equipment by now) you'd have quite a big area, and extending into the original departure lounge if you wanted to. What's going on "upstairs wouldn't be relevant. -- Roland Perry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 15, 9:39*am, Stimpy wrote:
On Mon, 15 Nov 2010 15:19:12 +0000, Paul Scott wrote NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Not a million miles from the mezzanine 'catering floor' being provided at the new KX western ticket hall really. *Details he http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co...TERLOO-RETAIL- BALCONY -OFFERS-MORE-ROOM-WITH-A-VIEW-15e5/SearchCategoryID-8.aspx Sounds a bit like the two-storey glass enclosed food court on the Lawn at Paddington IMHO, retail and other passenger facilites should be moved below the concourse. That would allow two platform lines to become a thru route to the South Eastern |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
It seems that this is another example of Network Rail wanting to turn
a prime site into a shopping centre, but just about tolerating passengers (as being the prime source of customers for the shops). What's really needed is small booths selling coffee etc. at platform level for those of us compelled to use the trains - at a position convenient to the trains. Who, in a rush to get their cattletruck home, is going to go up escalators into a "shopping experience" in search of a cup of tea? Interesting to note that the one ground-floor level shop remaining in the artist's impression is some sort of fashion emporium. That says it all really! I've just to GOT to get my latest Gucci handbag en route to platform 19 for the 18.20 to Staines! Marc. |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
"Paul Terry" wrote in message ... In message , Paul Scott writes NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Thanks for the link. It does seem extraordinary, though, that over a million pounds a year is being spent in maintaining the unused Eurostar platforms and terminal at Waterloo. I don't believe for one minute it's costing that to maintain. That's just the nominal amount that it could make if it were being used (but there isn't a use for it) tim |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
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Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 15, 4:33*pm, Roland Perry wrote:
Those retail outlets should never have been allowed to clutter up the concourse in the first place! Absolutely. The current proposals merely move what should not be there. But you can see whats going to happen here. Clear concourse so then they rent it out to ad hoc stalls like mobile phone proms. They do this at St.Pancras all the time. And SPI is cited at the bottom of the press release as an example for Waterloo to follow. -- Nick |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Mon, 15 Nov 2010 17:30:04 -0000, "Paul Scott"
wrote: "Roland Perry" wrote in message ... In message , at 15:19:12 on Mon, 15 Nov 2010, Paul Scott remarked: NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse mid-concourse Yes, perhaps a better description. catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Those retail outlets should never have been allowed to clutter up the concourse in the first place! ps What happened to the lower level Eurostar mini-concourses, next to the check-in and around the side where you emerged off a train? Are they being used for extra retailing. There are other applications to use the lower parts for retail purposes but those lower areas are BRB residuary's responsibility, rather than Network Rail. Is BRB Residuary being abolished as part of the government's 'cull' on quangos? |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 15, 8:34*pm, Scott wrote:
On Mon, 15 Nov 2010 17:30:04 -0000, "Paul Scott" wrote: "Roland Perry" wrote in message ... In message , at 15:19:12 on Mon, 15 Nov 2010, Paul Scott remarked: NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse mid-concourse Yes, perhaps a better description. catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Those retail outlets should never have been allowed to clutter up the concourse in the first place! ps What happened to the lower level Eurostar mini-concourses, next to the check-in and around the side where you emerged off a train? Are they being used for extra retailing. There are other applications to use the lower parts for retail purposes but those lower areas are BRB residuary's responsibility, rather than Network Rail. Is BRB Residuary being abolished as part of the government's 'cull' on quangos? Yes ... it was listed ... .... but winding up BRBR does not imply the responsibility passes to NR ... and just winding up the quango may well complicate Waterloo use issue. Perhaps thats why its been avoided ? -- Nick |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
"tim...." wrote in message ... I don't think that the "shops" will discover this at all. They are large national chains. They know that the footfall on the upper floor of a railway station will be a fraction of the concourse level and will only agree to the appropriate rent in the first place. Also, doesn't exactly the same setup already exist at Liverpool St and Victoria? Surely NR aren't exactly breaking new ground here, it's a tried and tested idea? Paul |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On 15/11/10 21:01, tim.... wrote:
"Denis McMahon" wrote in message ... On 15/11/10 19:55, wrote: It seems that this is another example of Network Rail wanting to turn a prime site into a shopping centre, but just about tolerating passengers (as being the prime source of customers for the shops). What's really needed is small booths selling coffee etc. at platform level for those of us compelled to use the trains - at a position convenient to the trains. Who, in a rush to get their cattletruck home, is going to go up escalators into a "shopping experience" in search of a cup of tea? Interesting to note that the one ground-floor level shop remaining in the artist's impression is some sort of fashion emporium. That says it all really! I've just to GOT to get my latest Gucci handbag en route to platform 19 for the 18.20 to Staines! Exactly. Not to mention the bottleneck that the escalators / lifts will be. So the shops will lose revenue, and go bust or inflate their prices and lose more revenue, and eventually go bust. So then there will be this expensive white elephant project that needs to be paid for, but which isn't generating revenue. NR aren't worried though, if the government won't bail them out (taxpayers pockets) they can simply charge the TOCs more to use the station (which will come from taxpayers pockets). Commuters don't spend 30 minutes each time they visit Waterloo wandering round the shops, and it's not like Victoria which is (a) the London end of some of a busy airport's main rail links (b) In a much more touristy area and (c) better served by Underground services for visitors to the capital. So, who is going to use these new shops, and how where is the extra shop turnover going to come from that will pay for the increased rents that will be used to pay off the bank loans that the developers will, doubtless, require NR to indemnify. The only ways that NR will be able to pay for the white elephant when the developer discovers that the shops can't afford the higher rents on their reduction in passing trade induced lower turnovers will be to either dip into taxpayers pockets or force the TOCs to dip into passengers pockets! I don't think that the "shops" will discover this at all. They are large national chains. They know that the footfall on the upper floor of a railway station will be a fraction of the concourse level and will only agree to the appropriate rent in the first place. In which case, will the actual revenue to NR or the developer from what the shops are prepared to pay (and are the franchise stores involved as good at doing the projections as the national chains), or will NR / the developer discover when they start renting properties that their income is much less than expected, and start looking to raid passenger or taxpayer pockets to cover the costs of the development. I'll bet the NR / developers projections assume that retailers will pay the same (or even more) per sq foot for "shiny new mezzanine" than they currently pay for "dirty drafty concourse", when anyone with half a brain can see that the reverse is more likely true because "shiny new mezzanine" will have a greatly reduced turnover. Rgds Denis McMahon |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
Denis McMahon wrote: Commuters don't spend 30 minutes each time they visit Waterloo wandering round the shops, and it's not like Victoria which is (a) the London end of some of a busy airport's main rail links OTOH that's probably not relevant. Tourists laden down with suitcases and in a hurry to catch a plane, are less likely to go upstairs and look around shops. Plenty of time for that in the departure lounge later. But a commuter who's just missed his one-an-hour train back home to somewhere on the south coast might want to kill time in the shops while waiting for the next one. (b) In a much more touristy area and (c) better served by Underground services for visitors to the capital. And these probably aren't even true. Yes, Victoria has Buckingham Palace. But Waterloo has the London Eye (or whatever it's calling itself this week) as well as the Aquarium and the IMAX. And it's probably more convenient for Big Ben and Trafalgar Square too. Meanwhile Victoria is on three Underground lines while Waterloo is on four. Last time I checked three was less than four. |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
"Paul Scott" wrote in message ... "tim...." wrote in message ... I don't think that the "shops" will discover this at all. They are large national chains. They know that the footfall on the upper floor of a railway station will be a fraction of the concourse level and will only agree to the appropriate rent in the first place. Also, doesn't exactly the same setup already exist at Liverpool St and Victoria? Surely NR aren't exactly breaking new ground here, it's a tried and tested idea? At Vic and LS there is road level access into the shopping area and many people on their way to/from their only train of the day walk past. There wont be to an upper floor at Waterloo and only people interchanging between Main and East will be on that level, and even then they wont need to walk past these shops tim |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On 15/11/2010 21:32, Denis McMahon wrote:
I'll bet the NR / developers projections assume that retailers will pay the same (or even more) per sq foot for "shiny new mezzanine" than they currently pay for "dirty drafty concourse", when anyone with half a brain can see that the reverse is more likely true because "shiny new mezzanine" will have a greatly reduced turnover. And property companies, retail chains etc etc would not be aware of this aspect of their business? They have never heard of Victoria, St Pancras or Liverpool Street stations? -- Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On 15/11/2010 17:40, Denis McMahon wrote:
On 15/11/10 15:19, Paul Scott wrote: NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Ultimately this will be financed out of the pockets of travelling passengers or taxpayers (or both), for I suspect little actual benefit apart from the introduction of new bottlenecks between the concourse and the mezzanine, But fewer bottlenecks for people not wanting the mezzanine. People who are, say, catching trains. a longer journey through the station if you want to shop, But shorter - or at least easier - journeys for those catching trains. London isn't short of shops, it is short of terminal station capacity. and less revenue for some of the outlets due to loss of passing trade and impulse purchases, so prices will go up No-one goes to a station shop expecting a bargain. or outlets will cease trading and fares will go up to cover the drop in revenue from letting the outlets. They will probably kill some kittens too. -- Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
Paul Scott wrote:
NR have announced their initial ideas about moving the concourse catering/retail outlets at Waterloo up to first floor level, with escalator connections etc, freeing up space for passenger circulation. Not a million miles from the mezzanine 'catering floor' being provided at the new KX western ticket hall really. Details he http://www.networkrailmediacentre.co...egoryID-8.aspx Presumably this is an interim solution - or have long-term plans to extend the platforms across the existing concourse and relocate the concourse area been abandoned? |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In uk.railway solar penguin wrote:
OTOH that's probably not relevant. Tourists laden down with suitcases and in a hurry to catch a plane, are less likely to go upstairs and look around shops. Plenty of time for that in the departure lounge later. But a commuter who's just missed his one-an-hour train back home to somewhere on the south coast might want to kill time in the shops while waiting for the next one. I wonder whether Waterloo's shopping fortunes have declined significantly since the departure of Eurostar? The various clothing shops (Monsoon etc) seem to fit more with the international traveller market than commuters (though perhaps TM Lewin for the 'need a clean shirt for the office' market) Yes, Victoria has Buckingham Palace. But Waterloo has the London Eye (or whatever it's calling itself this week) as well as the Aquarium and the IMAX. And it's probably more convenient for Big Ben and Trafalgar Square too. But do tourists lurk around railway stations for shopping purposes? Mosey around stalls on the South Bank, perhaps. I can't see them popping upstairs at Waterloo to buy a T-shirt depicting a Routemaster then taking a trip on the London Eye. St Pancras can get away with it as it's a shopping hub for residents of the Railway Lands development around KX plus (to some extent) the area around the station - Old St Pancras, Bloomsbury, etc. The housing around Waterloo is (AFAICS) mostly social housing - not exactly prime targets for upmarket shopping malls. Theo |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 15, 5:46*pm, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 17:30:04 on Mon, 15 Nov 2010, Paul Scott remarked: There are other applications to use the lower parts for retail purposes but those lower areas are BRB residuary's responsibility, rather than Network Rail. This has led to previous media articles suggesting that whole international 'station' would be turned over to retail, which TTBOMK has never been a possibility... If you demolished the check-in gates and security area (I expect they've been robbed of all their equipment by now) you'd have quite a big area, and extending into the original departure lounge if you wanted to. What's going on "upstairs wouldn't be relevant. IIRC at least some of the security kit (scanners etc) went to Ebbsfleet - I think the gates (or some thereof) may have done so too. |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 15, 4:33*pm, Roland Perry wrote: [...] ps What happened to the lower level Eurostar mini-concourses, next to the check-in and around the side where you emerged off a train? Are they being used for extra retailing. They all closed when Eurostar moved out - which, I've just realised, was a little over three years ago now on 13 Nov '07, with them transferring to the the 'new' St Pancras the next day. |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 15, 11:52*pm, Theo Markettos theom wrote: In uk.railway solar penguin wrote: OTOH that's probably not relevant. *Tourists laden down with suitcases and in a hurry to catch a plane, are less likely to go upstairs and look around shops. *Plenty of time for that in the departure lounge later. But a commuter who's just missed his one-an-hour train back home to somewhere on the south coast might want to kill time in the shops while waiting for the next one. I wonder whether Waterloo's shopping fortunes have declined significantly since the departure of Eurostar? *The various clothing shops (Monsoon etc) seem to fit more with the international traveller market than commuters (though perhaps TM Lewin for the 'need a clean shirt for the office' market) Yes, Victoria has Buckingham Palace. *But Waterloo has the London Eye (or whatever it's calling itself this week) as well as the Aquarium and the IMAX. *And it's probably more convenient for Big Ben and Trafalgar Square too. But do tourists lurk around railway stations for shopping purposes? *Mosey around stalls on the South Bank, perhaps. *I can't see them popping upstairs at Waterloo to buy a T-shirt depicting a Routemaster then taking a trip on the London Eye. St Pancras can get away with it as it's a shopping hub for residents of the Railway Lands development around KX plus (to some extent) the area around the station - Old St Pancras, Bloomsbury, etc. *The housing around Waterloo is (AFAICS) mostly social housing - not exactly prime targets for upmarket shopping malls. Plenty of wealthy enough folk around Waterloo - obviously those who travel into Waterloo from 'Surrey stockbroker belt' etc, but also those who work nearby - many media and other businesses in the area on and around the South Bank, and indeed play nearby - multiple cultural attractions such as the Old and Young Vic, the South Bank Centre, the NT, the NFT, plus all the various upper end eateries e.g. Anchor & Hope gastro pub on The Cut, Baltic just off it etc. Plus I can assure you there are some rather affluent residents around there too. |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
" wrote:
Who, in a rush to get their cattletruck home, is going to go up escalators into a "shopping experience" in search of a cup of tea? In quite a number of CBD stations globally, a lot of people do find "shopping" for a variety of goods/service in a railway station on their way to from/work to be a worthwhile thing to do. Just because the value proposition doesn't appeal to you is no general indication that others may not find it adequately valuable for them! Bill Bolton Sydney, Australia |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message , tim....
writes "Paul Terry" wrote in message ... Thanks for the link. It does seem extraordinary, though, that over a million pounds a year is being spent in maintaining the unused Eurostar platforms and terminal at Waterloo. I don't believe for one minute it's costing that to maintain. The figure quoted in parliament earlier this month, obtained as the result of a freedom of information request, was a cost to the tax payer of more than four million pounds for keeping the platforms mothballed for the last three years. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-11683932 http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMDe...36&SESSION=905 -- Paul Terry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message
, at 12:40:39 on Mon, 15 Nov 2010, D7666 remarked: but winding up BRBR does not imply the responsibility passes to NR It's in the category: "some or all functions transferred to civil service, local government, other quango, expert committee, charity or private sector" without saying which applies to each individual Quango. In the original leaked list it was in the "Retain (Technical)" category. -- Roland Perry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message , at 21:32:32 on Mon,
15 Nov 2010, Denis McMahon remarked: I'll bet the NR / developers projections assume that retailers will pay the same (or even more) per sq foot for "shiny new mezzanine" than they currently pay for "dirty drafty concourse", when anyone with half a brain can see that the reverse is more likely true because "shiny new mezzanine" will have a greatly reduced turnover. It seems a little unkind to assume they are as ignorant as that. It is their day-job, after all. -- Roland Perry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
Bill Bolton wrote:
" wrote: Who, in a rush to get their cattletruck home, is going to go up escalators into a "shopping experience" in search of a cup of tea? In quite a number of CBD stations globally, a lot of people do find "shopping" for a variety of goods/service in a railway station on their way to from/work to be a worthwhile thing to do. Just because the value proposition doesn't appeal to you is no general indication that others may not find it adequately valuable for them! What every retailer needs is footfall. There is nowhere better for footfall than a large London terminal station, and Waterloo's footfall is the highest of any station by far. Attracting only a tiny proportion of the 88 million passengers a year who use Waterloo will provide a huge opportunity for retailers. So even if the vast majority turn their noses up and refuse to buy, there will be more than enough business to justify this proposed development. The scheme looks good. It does not detract from the fine architecture of the listed building and it will free up the concourse and allow much easier circulation. No-one is being forced to shop there, and the current shop units are very much in the way. It appears to me to be a good thing for passengers, shoppers, retailers and Network Rail. Win/win/win/win. What's not to like? |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
"Jack Taylor" wrote in message ... Presumably this is an interim solution - or have long-term plans to extend the platforms across the existing concourse and relocate the concourse area been abandoned? Difficult to pin down what they intend now, isn't it. I can find references to closing platforms 1 and 2 to allow 3 and 4 to be lengthened, and taking over the international terminal with all existing platform allocations being 'moved over by two' to compensate. But I also found an annual NR report that reckons they can extend 1 and 2 to ten car 'in situ', without any problems. However there are other platforms in the middle of the station that also need lengthening eventually. There are some references to the 'Waterloo Buffer Stop project' although I've never found a description of it. (Anyone else got any idea?) There is also the distinct possibility that extending any platforms over the concourse is long abandoned, because it predates Eurostar's decision to withdraw from the station completely. It first came to the fore in the days of the SRA and long franchise extensions - so it might be history by now. Paul S |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Mon, Nov 15, 2010 at 04:28:38PM +0000, Paul Terry wrote:
Thanks for the link. It does seem extraordinary, though, that over a million pounds a year is being spent in maintaining the unused Eurostar platforms and terminal at Waterloo. I should have thought that bringing them back into use would have been more of a priority. It seems extraordinary to me that it would cost that much to clean up pigeon **** a few times a year. -- David Cantrell | Enforcer, South London Linguistic Massive For every vengeance, there is an equal and opposite revengeance. -- Cartoon Law X |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
In message , at 12:00:07 on
Tue, 16 Nov 2010, Bruce remarked: It does not detract from the fine architecture of the listed building and it will free up the concourse and allow much easier circulation. No-one is being forced to shop there, and the current shop units are very much in the way. It appears to me to be a good thing for passengers, shoppers, retailers and Network Rail. Win/win/win/win. What's not to like? Are there still some shops/kiosks as you go through the barriers, or were those a casualty of the automatic barriering? And if so, will they be kept. Those are the only ones I used to buy from, and I wouldn't be very impressed with having to detour upstairs. -- Roland Perry |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 16, 4:54*pm, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 12:00:07 on Tue, 16 Nov 2010, Bruce remarked: It does not detract from the fine architecture of the listed building and it will free up the concourse and allow much easier circulation. *No-one is being forced to shop there, and the current shop units are very much in the way. It appears to me to be a good thing for passengers, shoppers, retailers and Network Rail. *Win/win/win/win. What's not to like? Are there still some shops/kiosks as you go through the barriers, or were those a casualty of the automatic barriering? And if so, will they be kept. Those are the only ones I used to buy from, and I wouldn't be very impressed with having to detour upstairs. -- Roland Perry Roland, that's my point exaxctly. I usually want a quick snack or bottle of water, en route to the train, and I will certainly not ne detouring up escalators in search of this. If they remove all the small refreshment kiosks that will be a severe detriment to passengers who actually use the station as a station and not as a shopping centre! Marc. |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
"Roland Perry" wrote in message ... Are there still some shops/kiosks as you go through the barriers, or were those a casualty of the automatic barriering? Yes there are. Not quite so many, but most of the usual suspects are still there. Paul S |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Tue, 16 Nov 2010 09:41:06 -0800 (PST), "
wrote: Roland, that's my point exaxctly. I usually want a quick snack or bottle of water, en route to the train, and I will certainly not ne detouring up escalators in search of this. If they remove all the small refreshment kiosks that will be a severe detriment to passengers who actually use the station as a station and not as a shopping centre! IIRC, that hasn't happened at Liverpool Street. Last time I was there I'm sure there were food kiosks on the lower level, and a Starbucks outside the Bishopsgate entrance. |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
"Roland Perry" wrote in message ... Are there still some shops/kiosks as you go through the barriers, or were those a casualty of the automatic barriering? And if so, will they be kept. Those are the only ones I used to buy from, and I wouldn't be very impressed with having to detour upstairs. PS to earlier reply, the NR 'stations made easy' is relevant to this. IF it is correct, there is only one food outlet in the _centre_ of the concourse. So posters worried about the loss of catering en route to their trains seem to be 'misremembering' the current situation... http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/statio.../WAT/plan.html Paul |
Waterloo concourse ideas - NR press release
On Nov 16, 5:43*pm, "Paul Scott" wrote: "Roland Perry" wrote: Are there still some shops/kiosks as you go through the barriers, or were those a casualty of the automatic barriering? Yes there are. Not quite so many, but most of the usual suspects are still there. I was at Waterloo station this evening, and took the opportunity to count them - there are five food and drink kiosks in breaks in the gateline array (i.e. in line with the barriers to the platforms) - there are four breaks/spaces as one such space hosts two kiosks side- by-side - this is all between platforms 6 and 11 (and indeed I've just seen your other post re the NRE 'stations made easy' page which appears accurate in this regard - not so sure it is w.r.t. the stuff in the centre of the concourse though). Notably-ish there isn't a 'Sweet Express' (is that what they're called?) kiosk amongst them - I recall there used to be one before the gating, though I'm I think there's such an establishment elsewhere there. |
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