In message , David
Cantrell writes

So why County Durham instead of Durhamshire?

Possibly because the county had several subdivisions that were in
themselves already "shires" (Islandshire, Bedlingtonshire and
Norhamshire were all exclaves that eventually became part of
Northumberland).

There's a sort of general principle that an area which took its name
from an ancient kingdom or tribe (such as Cornwall, Kent, Sussex,
Middlesex, Essex, Suffolk and Norfolk) didn't get a "-shire" appendage,
while areas based on administrative centres did (such as York/Yorkshire,
Hereford/Herefordshire, Oxford/Oxfordshire and so on). But there are
many exceptions (including Durham and, especially, Berkshire).
--
Paul Terry

On May 10, 10:24*am, Peter Campbell Smith wrote:
On May 9, 6:23*am, 1506 wrote:
[...] Why do our friends across the Irish sea reverse
the word order (e.g. County Carlow) I wonder?

" wrote :

What do you mean, "reverse the word order"? *The point is that
"Hertford County" is completely unidiomatic even in British usage,
precisely because the word order is wrong. [...]

We do 'reverse the word order' though for rivers: River Thames or River
Severn - but Americans have the Hudson River and the Colorado River. *Then
there are Lake Superior and Mount Everest - so there's definitely a
precedent for '[feature] [name]' in geographical names.

Precisely, likewise Jefferson County, Kentucky; Los Angeles County,
California, and Bruce County, Ontario!

If I told my neighbrs in Washoe County, Nevada that I grew up in
Buckinghamshire they would not relate that to a county, "Shire" is
obscure in North America. However, if I refered to Buckingham County,
England they would comprehend.

On May 10, 12:09*pm, Paul Terry wrote:
In message , David
Cantrell writes

So why County Durham instead of Durhamshire?

Possibly because the county had several subdivisions that were in
themselves already "shires" (Islandshire, Bedlingtonshire and
Norhamshire were all exclaves that eventually became part of
Northumberland).

There's a sort of general principle that an area which took its name
from an ancient kingdom or tribe (such as Cornwall, Kent, Sussex,
Middlesex, Essex, Suffolk and Norfolk) didn't get a "-shire" appendage,
while areas based on administrative centres did (such as York/Yorkshire,
Hereford/Herefordshire, Oxford/Oxfordshire and so on). But there are
many exceptions (including Durham and, especially, Berkshire).

Thank you. I had not seen that explained before.

"1506" wrote

If I told my neighbrs in Washoe County, Nevada that I grew up in
Buckinghamshire they would not relate that to a county, "Shire" is
obscure in North America. However, if I refered to Buckingham County,
England they would comprehend.

Which is strange, in that the office of sheriff (shire reeve) is far more
familiar in the USA (and in Scotland) than in England.

Peter

1506 wrote:

If I told my neighbrs in Washoe County, Nevada that I grew up in
Buckinghamshire they would not relate that to a county, "Shire" is
obscure in North America.

It briefly comes to the fore every four years at the start of the
Presidential race.
--
..sig down for maintenance

On May 10, 10:30*pm, 1506 wrote:
Precisely, likewise Jefferson County, Kentucky; Los Angeles County,
California, and Bruce County, Ontario!

Though of course "County of Los Angeles" is not unusual, especially in
legal documents, and in names of institutions. A neighbouring county
calls itself the "County of Orange" on its website alongside the more
familiar usage, and another nearby one has a website at www.countyofkings.com.

--
Abi

On Tue, 10 May 2011 14:30:26 -0700 (PDT), 1506 wrote
in misc.transport.urban-transit:

On May 10, 10:24*am, Peter Campbell Smith wrote:
On May 9, 6:23*am, 1506 wrote:
[...] Why do our friends across the Irish sea reverse
the word order (e.g. County Carlow) I wonder?

" wrote :

What do you mean, "reverse the word order"? *The point is that
"Hertford County" is completely unidiomatic even in British usage,
precisely because the word order is wrong. [...]

We do 'reverse the word order' though for rivers: River Thames or River
Severn - but Americans have the Hudson River and the Colorado River. *Then
there are Lake Superior and Mount Everest - so there's definitely a
precedent for '[feature] [name]' in geographical names.

Precisely, likewise Jefferson County, Kentucky; Los Angeles County,
California, and Bruce County, Ontario!

If I told my neighbrs in Washoe County, Nevada that I grew up in
Buckinghamshire they would not relate that to a county, "Shire" is
obscure in North America. However, if I refered to Buckingham County,
England they would comprehend.

And those in Bucks County PA might twig to it immediately.

On Tue, 10 May 2011 23:06:08 +0100, Chris Tolley
(ukonline really) wrote in misc.transport.urban-transit:

1506 wrote:

If I told my neighbrs in Washoe County, Nevada that I grew up in
Buckinghamshire they would not relate that to a county, "Shire" is
obscure in North America.

It briefly comes to the fore every four years at the start of the
Presidential race.

It may be smaller than some US counties, but no one thinks of the
(clearly misnamed) New Hampshire as a county.

On Tue, 10 May 2011 09:22:59 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On May 9, 6:23Â*am, 1506 wrote:
Technically accurate, thought provoking, and appeals to one who mildly
Aspergers. Â*Why do our friends accross the Irish sea reverse the word
order (e.g. County Carlow) I wonder?

What do you mean, "reverse the word order"? The point is that
"Hertford County" is completely unidiomatic even in British usage,
precisely because the word order is wrong.

Usages would be

Hertfordshire
County of Hertford (obsolete pre-1974 legal usage)

It is still in current use, e.g. in S.I.2009/776 [HIGHWAYS, ENGLAND
The Watford and South of St Albans—Redbourn—Kidney Wood, Luton,
Special Road Scheme 1957 (Variation) Scheme 2009]
THE SCHEDULE
The Route of the Special Road
From a point on the London-Aylesbury-Warwick-Birmingham Trunk Road
(A.41) near Watford in the County of Hertford.......

County of Hertfordshire (modern legal usage)

All that the Irish do is drop the "of", like we do with Durham. (And
even then, "County of Durham" can be found in acts of Parliament)

Even "Hertfordshire County" is more idiomatic than "Hertford County",
which has never been proper usage in Britain in either of our
lifetimes.

On Tue, 10 May 2011 22:44:29 +0100, "Peter Masson"
wrote:



"1506" wrote

If I told my neighbrs in Washoe County, Nevada that I grew up in
Buckinghamshire they would not relate that to a county, "Shire" is
obscure in North America. However, if I refered to Buckingham County,
England they would comprehend.

Which is strange, in that the office of sheriff (shire reeve) is far more
familiar in the USA (and in Scotland) than in England.

.... and different in character in all of them.