German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators - The Guardian
 

Hans-Joachim Zierke wrote

Although Germany is generally thought of as an obedient nation,

So Germany has a much lower crime rate than Britain? Or does it just
happen, that the writer couldn't be bothered to check facts?

Perhaps the German criminal are obedient to a different set of rules ?


But the kind of evidence for "obedience" I think of would be conduct
similar to someone's report from Canada of the good citizens waiting in
the snow for the green man before crossing the street in spite of the
complete lack of traffic.


--
Mike D

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators- The Guardian
 

On 04/02/2012 22:58, Michael R N Dolbear wrote:
Hans-Joachim wrote

Although Germany is generally thought of as an obedient nation,

So Germany has a much lower crime rate than Britain? Or does it just
happen, that the writer couldn't be bothered to check facts?

Perhaps the German criminal are obedient to a different set of rules ?


But the kind of evidence for "obedience" I think of would be conduct
similar to someone's report from Canada of the good citizens waiting in
the snow for the green man before crossing the street in spite of the
complete lack of traffic.

Yup. I was in Mannheim (or was it Heidelberg?) last year, and some old
bloke was shouting "denken Sie an die Kinder" (or whatever) at anyone
who crossed when the road was clear rather than when the light was green.


--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators- The Guardian
 

Am 05.02.2012 00:31, schrieb Arthur Figgis:
I was in Mannheim (or was it Heidelberg?) last year, and some old bloke
was shouting "denken Sie an die Kinder" (or whatever) at anyone who
crossed when the road was clear rather than when the light was green.

One finds such admonitions on signs posted at street crossings here
in Germany.

So when kids are waiting with me at the red light, I sometimes do
wait for the green...


Cheers,
L.W.

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators- The Guardian
 

On Feb 4, 11:58*pm, "Michael R N Dolbear" wrote:

Perhaps the German criminal are obedient to a different set of rules ?

I think so. They don't cross on a red pedestrian light, but there is
a major graffiti problem in the way there isn't in the UK (say).

Neil

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators- The Guardian
 

On Feb 5, 1:33*pm, Neil Williams wrote:
On Feb 4, 11:58*pm, "Michael R N Dolbear" wrote:

Perhaps the German criminal are obedient to a different set of rules ?

[...]*They don't cross on a red pedestrian light,

They don't?!

Perhaps they really do put those "The children are watching - wait for
the green" signs up in shacksvilles at the end of branch lines solely
for the benefit of any passing British track-bashers - but I rather
suspect not!

R.

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators- The Guardian
 

On Feb 5, 2:23*pm, Ross-a-travelling wrote:

They don't?!

Not to the extent that people do in the UK, where they are an entirely
optional aid to pedestrianism, to be used only when the traffic is too
heavy not to use them.

Neil

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators- The Guardian
 

On Feb 5, 9:25*pm, Neil Williams wrote:
On Feb 5, 2:23*pm, Ross-a-travelling wrote:

Why did you delete the context, Neil? Not everyone will necessarily
receive every post...

[Reinstated: On Feb 5, 1:33 pm, Neil Williams wrote:
On Feb 4, 11:58 pm, "Michael R N Dolbear" wrote:
Perhaps the German criminal are obedient to a different set of rules ?
[...] They don't cross on a red pedestrian light, ]

They don't?!

Not to the extent that people do in the UK, [...]

That's surely rather different to the categoric "they don't", though?

R.
(Currently in Romania, where crossing one road at junctions involves
crossing one side of it then waiting for the lights to go through
almost a full cycle with you stuck in the small central reservation
before they finally change to let you finish crossing. Crossing more
than one road legally takes an eternity. No wonder everyone treats the
pedestrian lights as guidance...)

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transportoperators- The Guardian
 

On Feb 5, 8:44*pm, Ross-a-travelling wrote:

[...] They don't cross on a red pedestrian light, ]
They don't?!
Not to the extent that people do in the UK, [...]

That's surely rather different to the categoric "they don't", though?

True. I would however go so far as to say that most don't.

(Currently in Romania, where crossing one road at junctions involves
crossing one side of it then waiting for the lights to go through
almost a full cycle with you stuck in the small central reservation
before they finally change to let you finish crossing. Crossing more
than one road legally takes an eternity. No wonder everyone treats the
pedestrian lights as guidance...)

Interesting... will be going there myself (and then on to Moldova via
the overnight train) at the end of Feb...

Neil

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transport operators - The Guardian
 

En el artículo , Bruce
escribió:

About 3.5% of journeys on German public transport are not paid for,

You could turn that round and say that 96.5% of journeys are paid for.
Given the (apparent) low levels of inspection, that seems pretty high to
me.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

German fare dodgers cause headache for public transport operators- The Guardian
 

Am 06.02.2012 07:42, schrieb Mike Tomlinson:
About 3.5% of journeys on German public transport are not paid for,

You could turn that round and say that 96.5% of journeys are paid for.
Given the (apparent) low levels of inspection, that seems pretty high to
me.

And please note that the 3.5% is a statistical estimate with some
margin of error, or even a bias resulting from the interest of the
transport companies to increase their income.

A transit organisation will have to find an optimum within the
constraints of maximising the income from fares plus penalty fares on
the one hand and the minimising of the costs of controlling the payment.
A city in Belgium found that to dispense with collecting fares for their
public transit was the optimum. Society through their administrations
have also to consider how the usage and hence cost of alternative modes
of transports change caused by modifying the fares for public transit.

There is no single dimension, and one has to be able to calculate
with more than one single variable.


Cheers,
L.W.