On Feb 15, 12:17*am, "Richard J." wrote:
Duncan wrote on 14 February 2012 22:21:08 ...

In articlea4d85cb8-8e31-4fbd-a44c-
, says....

If the prevarication on reinstating arch 4 hasn't been enough over the
last 20+ years, hapless commuters are now in for a treat. Yet more
rebuilding works for CrossRail will cause chaos at not only Paddington
but every station on the GW main line between London and Reading.

At Paddington the re-siting of the taxi rank - kind of above platform
12 and ONLY accessible from platform 12

It's also accessible from the footbridge, but never lets the facts get
in the way of a good rant.

It's not YET accessible from the footbridge.
--
Richard J.
(to email me, swap 'uk' and 'yon' in address)

Yeah but ... this morning was hilarious. Thousands of commuters all
trying to get to work along platform 12 from platforms 13 & 14 and off
the Connect on platform 12, v.v. all the jet lagged tourists (confused
by a lack of signs) from the Heathrow Express on platforms 6 & 7 all
trying to get past them to get to the new taxi rank. And of course no-
one keeps to the left. And there a\re no touch-in touch-out barriers
for platform 12 so CJB is right in one thing you can now ride the
Connect for free. Definitely a zero lose - lose situation for
everyone. SB.

"SB" wrote in message
...
...And there a\re no touch-in touch-out barriers
for platform 12 so CJB is right in one thing you can now ride the
Connect for free. Definitely a zero lose - lose situation for
everyone. SB.

Just like CJB then, you don't expect the pretty obvious barrier line you
walked past to be brought into service?
WTF is it there for if it isn't getting installed?

Paul S

Paul Scott wrote on 15 February 2012
17:02:44 ...
wrote in message
...
...And there a\re no touch-in touch-out barriers
for platform 12 so CJB is right in one thing you can now ride the
Connect for free. Definitely a zero lose - lose situation for
everyone. SB.

Just like CJB then, you don't expect the pretty obvious barrier line you
walked past to be brought into service?
WTF is it there for if it isn't getting installed?

I'm not sure which barrier line you're talking about. There are some
unused gates near the buffer stops, but I don't see how they can be used
to control access to platforms 12-14 as the area needs to be available
to passengers heading for the taxi rank.

See map from the HEx website at
http://www.heathrowexpress.com/Image..._Cross_web.jpg

It really needs the buffer stops for platforms 11 & 12 moving down to
create a wider pedestrian route, if the current rolling stock can fit
into a shorter platform.
--
Richard J.
(to email me, swap 'uk' and 'yon' in address)

"Richard J." wrote in message
...

It really needs the buffer stops for platforms 11 & 12 moving down to
create a wider pedestrian route, if the current rolling stock can fit into
a shorter platform.

There is to be an array of ticket gates across P12, at an angle and just
past the new 'taxi' escalators and the lifts. The intention is then to have
a barrier along the length of P12, about 2m back from the platform edge and
as far as the new barrier line. At the end of last week the new barrier
line was present but you could walk round the end of it on the platform
side.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7208/6...9afce29e_z.jpg

This is also shown in the planning drawings for the taxi deck and associated
work packages..

I agree with the idea of moving the buffer stops to give a larger
circulation area though - but as you say this would be highly dependent on
the max train lengths used in P12.

Paul S

On Feb 15, 5:02*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

"SB" wrote:

...And there a\re no touch-in touch-out barriers
for platform 12 so CJB is right in one thing you can now ride the
Connect for free. Definitely a zero lose - lose situation for
everyone. SB.

Just like CJB then, you don't expect the pretty obvious barrier line you
walked past to be brought into service?
WTF is it there for if it isn't getting installed?

Far be it for me to criticise anyone's choice of usenet 'handle' - I
think it'd be a bit rich if I did - but I'd think it would probably be
prudent to ensure one signs off one's usenet posts with the same name
that appears in the handle.

The following examples, where the poster's handle identifies them as
"SB" (s_byers666@yahoo etc), yet they sign themselves off as "CJB",
are particularly befuddling...

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.railway/msg/38cf1f349632b381
http://groups.google.com/group/uk.railway/msg/cfa92a0b70eb7cb2
http://groups.google.com/group/uk.railway/msg/9452820449026631

"Paul Scott" wrote

I agree with the idea of moving the buffer stops to give a larger
circulation area though - but as you say this would be highly dependent on
the max train lengths used in P12.

Platform 12 is only 171 metres, and if trains are to get in and out of 12,
only 165 metres of 11 can be used (length to mid-platform signal), so you
couldn't chop much off them without making them unusable.

Peter

On Feb 15, 10:04*pm, "Peter Masson" wrote:
"Paul Scott" wrote

I agree with the idea of moving the buffer stops to give a larger
circulation area though - but as you say this would be highly dependent on
the max train lengths used in P12.

Platform 12 is only 171 metres, and if trains are to get in and out of 12,
only 165 metres of 11 can be used (length to mid-platform signal), so you
couldn't chop much off them without making them unusable.

Peter

Pardon me for stating the obvious, however, surely the whole point of
crossrail is to effectively divert all ex-Heathrow Connect and FGW-
Local services into tunnels. Therefore, platform 12 will be largely
redundant (as will 13 and 14, however they are not in the immediate
vicinity...). Unfortunately Platform 11 would also be cut short if the
buffers were to be relocated. Interestingly enough, platform 11's
length is limited to 8 carriages unless platform 12 is out-of-use
because of the placement of the points to access platform 12.
Therefore, if platform 12 was permenantly closed, then the length of
platform 11 would be increased from 8 to 14 carriages permanently. If
it was shortened by 2 carriage lengths then it would still have a
total length of 12 carriages, the same length as platforms 4-10.

So I would propose that 12 could be closed and 11 kept at a length of
approximately 12 carriages.

Regardless, if the buffers were relocated tomorrow, platform 12 would
still be usable for day-to-day operations because it is almost solely
devoted to serving Heathrow Connect services formed of 4 cars (and the
current platform length is 8 cars).

Of course, if you really want to go all in and get maximum platform
lengths, you could perform some serious trackwork changes and merge
platforms 12 and 13 to make use of the face of platform 12, without
jeopardising platform 11's length.

Cheers,

TSM

On Wed, 15 Feb 2012 07:34:25 -0800 (PST)
SB wrote:
the Connect on platform 12, v.v. all the jet lagged tourists (confused
by a lack of signs) from the Heathrow Express on platforms 6 & 7 all

Frankly , any tourists dumb enough to pay a fortune to use the heathrow
express service only to be dumped at paddington deserves all they get.

B2003

On Feb 15, 6:06*pm, "Richard J." wrote:
Paul Scott wrote on 15 February 2012
17:02:44 ...

*wrote in message
....
...And there a\re no touch-in touch-out barriers
for platform 12 so CJB is right in one thing you can now ride the
Connect for free. Definitely a zero lose - lose situation for
everyone. SB.

Just like CJB then, you don't expect the pretty obvious barrier line you
walked past to be brought into service?
WTF is it there for if it isn't getting installed?

I'm not sure which barrier line you're talking about. *There are some
unused gates near the buffer stops, but I don't see how they can be used
to control access to platforms 12-14 as the area needs to be available
to passengers heading for the taxi rank.

See map from the HEx website athttp://www.heathrowexpress.com/Images/Paddington_Cross_web.jpg

It really needs the buffer stops for platforms 11 & 12 moving down to
create a wider pedestrian route, if the current rolling stock can fit
into a shorter platform.
--
Richard J.
(to email me, swap 'uk' and 'yon' in address)

On that HEX map it is where the small 12 is marked that the major
pinch point occurs. This is where there a

1/ supporting pillars for the roof (road) above
2/ a coffee bar and seating
3/ two ATMs
4/ roller doors into a major storage area
5/ other access doors

And the area is littered with gauze covered water buckets because the
roof still leaks when it rains

Near this pinch-point there is also:

6/ a new Cornish pasty shop
7/ the entrance to the Bakerloo line

At this pinch-point there will be three major conflicting streams of
passengers:

a/ those to/from HEX as per the image above - confused tourists
b/ those going to/from HConn on platform 12
c/ those going to/from platforms 13 / 14 - mainly commuters

Moving the ends of platforms 12 and 11 further away from the Praed
Street entrance isn't an option. There are two huge ex-GWR hydraulic
buffers there. I would guess that they are listed fixtures.

The diagonal gate-line half-way down platform 12 is obviously for
those using platforms 13 and 14; and it rather cleverly directs these
commuters directly into the paths of those tourists going to/from the
escaltors and lifts for the taxi rank. However it does not control
passengers arriving on HConn. Which is probably why they haven't been
commissioned.

Having a dividing barrier - presumably glass - down the length of
platform 12 would only leave a very narrow path along the edge of
platform 12 for passengers to/from HConn - hardly meeting health and
safety requirements.

As I said the confusion and chaos continues ...

CJB.

"SB" wrote in message
...

I see CJB is writing as SB again, despite it being pointed out...

Having a dividing barrier - presumably glass - down the length of
platform 12 would only leave a very narrow path along the edge of
platform 12 for passengers to/from HConn - hardly meeting health and
safety requirements.

A dividing barrier is what the planning drawings include. (Checked them
again this morning.) But what with you being a renowned 'health and safety'
critic, I'm sure the designers will have got it all wrong.

Paul S