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On 21/03/2012 06:51, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 23:51:45 on Tue, 20 Mar 2012, The Real Doctor remarked: You forget that Polson was Morton's right hand man on the project and therefore knows everything about it. iirc he was involved in one of the rival bids (and unsuccessful) bids to build a bridge instead. [citation require] http://groups.google.com/group/uk.ra...5dfe76b6edfa72 Sorry, I knew he'd posted about the bridge option, but I had the context reversed. There were other postings where he claimed that the Euroroute (bridge) option was so much better and all those working on the tunnel agreed with him. -- Graeme Wall This account not read, substitute trains for rail. Railway Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail |
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On 20/03/2012 23:54, The Real Doctor wrote:
On 16/03/12 11:50, Graeme Wall wrote: Difficult to disentangle all his myriad claims but IIRC he was allegedly working on the tunnel project Remember that he has also claimed to have managed an opencast mine, worked in every nuclear power station in Britain, run shops in Preston and North Yorkshire, been a civil servant, written the transport section of the Labour Manifesto in 1997, supervised the Piccadilly Line tunnel under Heathrow and taken cover photographs for Vogue. I suppose it's possible that some of these claims might be true. Well he might have taken a photo of the cover of Vogue... -- Graeme Wall This account not read, substitute trains for rail. Railway Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail |
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On 21/03/12 06:51, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 23:51:45 on Tue, 20 Mar 2012, The Real Doctor remarked: You forget that Polson was Morton's right hand man on the project and therefore knows everything about it. iirc he was involved in one of the rival bids (and unsuccessful) bids to build a bridge instead. [citation require] http://groups.google.com/group/uk.ra...5dfe76b6edfa72 Sorry, I knew he'd posted about the bridge option, but I had the context reversed. Sorry, Roland, I wasn't clear. The [citation required] applied to Polson's claim, not yours. Ian |
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On Mar 21, 8:25*am, 77002 wrote:
On the Contrary, the route to Farringdon (Street) would be more direct, have less stations, and be aboard, faster, higher capacity, trains. I read it the wrong way - but there is talk of those trains being connected to WCML stopping trains to relieve capacity at Euston for the rebuild for HS2. Neil |
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On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 07:55:54 +0000
Graeme Wall wrote: On 20/03/2012 21:13, Arthur Figgis wrote: On 20/03/2012 09:54, d wrote: On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 19:44:37 +0000 Arthur wrote: Personally I'd look at doing a deal with the French. AIUI they know they only have to be able to nuke Berli^H^H^H whatever the target might be once, rather than Moscow 137 times or whatever. Apparebntly french nukes are highlyh sophisticated. The warhead splits at the apex of its trajectory into individual bombs and then at lower altitude each bomb releases a white flag that also doubles as a parachute so they don't get hurt when they land. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Battle_of_the_Marne http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Verdun I suspect Boltar has been influenced by the Republican Party's tantrum when the French sensibly declined to join in Bush's "Let's not worry about catching Bin Laden and get Saddam instead for the hell of it." http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/france.html B2003 |
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On Mar 21, 9:04*am, Neil Williams wrote:
On Mar 21, 8:25*am, 77002 wrote: On the Contrary, the route to Farringdon (Street) would be more direct, have less stations, and be aboard, faster, higher capacity, trains. I read it the wrong way As was apparent down thread. :-) but there is talk of those trains being connected to WCML stopping trains to relieve capacity at Euston for the rebuild for HS2. That ought to be permanent IMHO. |
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On 21/03/2012 11:40, d wrote:
On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 07:55:54 +0000 Graeme wrote: On 20/03/2012 21:13, Arthur Figgis wrote: On 20/03/2012 09:54, d wrote: On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 19:44:37 +0000 Arthur wrote: Personally I'd look at doing a deal with the French. AIUI they know they only have to be able to nuke Berli^H^H^H whatever the target might be once, rather than Moscow 137 times or whatever. Apparebntly french nukes are highlyh sophisticated. The warhead splits at the apex of its trajectory into individual bombs and then at lower altitude each bomb releases a white flag that also doubles as a parachute so they don't get hurt when they land. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Battle_of_the_Marne http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Verdun I suspect Boltar has been influenced by the Republican Party's tantrum when the French sensibly declined to join in Bush's "Let's not worry about catching Bin Laden and get Saddam instead for the hell of it." http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/france.html Simplistic and inaccurate, though slightly amusing. -- Graeme Wall This account not read, substitute trains for rail. Railway Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail |
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On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 05:03:08 -0700 (PDT), 77002
wrote: That ought to be permanent IMHO. I hope not. It is far more civilised to board at a terminus. Neil -- Neil Williams, Milton Keynes, UK |
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In message , at
19:53:39 on Wed, 21 Mar 2012, Neil Williams remarked: That ought to be permanent IMHO. I hope not. It is far more civilised to board at a terminus. Depends. Being given only ten minutes notice of which platform you have to scurry down at Kings Cross to find your seat eight or nine carriages away isn't very civilised. At intermediate stations like Peterborough and Grantham you know exactly which platform, and where the relevant carriage will stop (they have signs). -- Roland Perry |
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On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 20:00:38 +0000, Roland Perry
wrote: Depends. Being given only ten minutes notice of which platform you have to scurry down at Kings Cross to find your seat eight or nine carriages away isn't very civilised. Indeed not. But most of the time platforms at Euston for LM services are posted early, and where not regular users can guess as they are very consistent. Neil -- Neil Williams, Milton Keynes, UK |
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On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 12:21:17AM -0700, 77002 wrote:
Whether the idiots at TfL have chosen the right rolling stock is another question. Why would any sane railway run trains from Reading to Shenfield, sans half-bathrooms? By "half bathrooms" do you mean "bogs"? It makes sense to me. An awful lot of journeys will be a hell of a lot shorter than Maidenhead (not Reading) to Shenfield, and even for those few people going all the way, it's only an hour and a half, as near as damnit the same as Richmond to Upminster, which also has no bogs and no-one seems to mind that. -- David Cantrell | Bourgeois reactionary pig If you have received this email in error, please add some nutmeg and egg whites, whisk, and place in a warm oven for 40 minutes. |
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On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 11:10:06 +0000
David Cantrell wrote: It makes sense to me. An awful lot of journeys will be a hell of a lot shorter than Maidenhead (not Reading) to Shenfield, and even for those few people going all the way, it's only an hour and a half, as near as damnit the same as Richmond to Upminster, which also has no bogs and no-one seems to mind that. I suspect the central bit will be packed as people use it as an alternative to the tube (assuming Oyster will be valid and they're not going to try it on with special fares). I don't think you'd want smelly , possibly blocked toilets in the carraige in that scenario. B2003 |
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On Mar 21, 6:53*pm, Neil Williams wrote:
On Wed, 21 Mar 2012 05:03:08 -0700 (PDT), 77002 wrote: That ought to be permanent IMHO. I hope not. *It is far more civilised to board at a terminus. However, many folks have travelled to the terminus by subway. Ascending escalators, waiting for a train, and accessing one's platform all add to the journey time. |
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On Mar 22, 11:47*am, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 11:10:06 +0000 David Cantrell wrote: It makes sense to me. *An awful lot of journeys will be a hell of a lot shorter than Maidenhead (not Reading) to Shenfield, and even for those few people going all the way, it's only an hour and a half, as near as damnit the same as Richmond to Upminster, which also has no bogs and no-one seems to mind that. I suspect the central bit will be packed as people use it as an alternative to the tube (assuming Oyster will be valid and they're not going to try it on with special fares). I don't think you'd want smelly , possibly blocked toilets in the carraige in that scenario. By the time Crossrail is built, Paddington to Reading will be electrified. Crossrail will run to Reading. Thameslink has on board facilities. Thameslink's central section is extremely well utilized. |
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On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 05:23:19 -0700 (PDT)
77002 wrote: By the time Crossrail is built, Paddington to Reading will be electrified. Crossrail will run to Reading. Well yes, thats part of the scheme. Thameslink has on board facilities. Thameslink's central section is extremely well utilized. But not really in the same league. Its nowhere near as long and is (was) very slow with a poor service. Speaking as someone who used to work at blackfriars for a couple of years I can safely say that it was often quicker to walk to farringdon and get the tube to KX than wait for a thameslink train to show up and crawl its way up there. B2003 |
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On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 14:18:40 +0000
Recliner wrote: On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:46:55 +0000 (UTC), d wrote: On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 05:23:19 -0700 (PDT) 77002 wrote: By the time Crossrail is built, Paddington to Reading will be electrified. Crossrail will run to Reading. Well yes, thats part of the scheme. Is it? When was that announced? Unofficially. Maidenhead is hardly the most logical place for a terminus. Presumably improved now that the Moorgate branch is no more? But Perhaps, I haven't been on it since that closed. Though given that section didn't have much traffic there's still the need to change voltage at Farringdon, something that won't be needed with XRail. That takes seconds. The main issue when I used it was the slow speed on the line itself and the constant stopping. B2003 |
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On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 05:19:58 -0700 (PDT), 77002
wrote: However, many folks have travelled to the terminus by subway. Ascending escalators, waiting for a train, and accessing one's platform all add to the journey time. True. But to me fastest is not necessarily best. Neil -- Neil Williams, Milton Keynes, UK |
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On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 11:10:06 +0000, David Cantrell
wrote: By "half bathrooms" do you mean "bogs"? Yes he does. He has this curious obsession with the use of the US term in here, largely I think because it winds people up. Neil -- Neil Williams, Milton Keynes, UK |
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On Mar 22, 3:50*pm, Neil Williams wrote:
On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 05:19:58 -0700 (PDT), 77002 wrote: However, many folks have travelled to the terminus by subway. Ascending escalators, waiting for a train, and accessing one's platform all add to the journey time. True. *But to me fastest is not necessarily best. Rather wise words Mr. Williams. Thank you. |
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On Mar 22, 4:00*pm, Neil Williams wrote:
On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 11:10:06 +0000, David Cantrell wrote: By "half bathrooms" do you mean "bogs"? Yes he does. *He has this curious obsession with the use of the US term in here, largely I think because it winds people up. There are some depths to which I will not stoop. |
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On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 15:03:36 +0000 (UTC), d
wrote: On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 14:18:40 +0000 Recliner wrote: On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:46:55 +0000 (UTC), d wrote: On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 05:23:19 -0700 (PDT) 77002 wrote: By the time Crossrail is built, Paddington to Reading will be electrified. Crossrail will run to Reading. Well yes, thats part of the scheme. Is it? When was that announced? Unofficially. Maidenhead is hardly the most logical place for a terminus. So it hasn't been announced, and isn't part of the plan, but is just your presumption. Given that it's a TfL managed project, and is ordering sans-toilet trains, Maidenhead may be as far west as it should go. Presumably improved now that the Moorgate branch is no more? But Perhaps, I haven't been on it since that closed. Though given that section didn't have much traffic there's still the need to change voltage at Farringdon, something that won't be needed with XRail. That takes seconds. The main issue when I used it was the slow speed on the line itself and the constant stopping. Maybe also connected with the rebuilding of Blackfriars station? Certainly, it should be much quicker once the project is complete (including London Bridge and the new tracks between the two). |
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On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 21:06:09 +0000
Recliner wrote: Unofficially. Maidenhead is hardly the most logical place for a terminus. So it hasn't been announced, and isn't part of the plan, but is just your presumption. Given that it's a TfL managed project, and is ordering sans-toilet trains, Maidenhead may be as far west as it should go. AFAIK the line to reading is "protected". Whatever that means in practice. That takes seconds. The main issue when I used it was the slow speed on the line itself and the constant stopping. Maybe also connected with the rebuilding of Blackfriars station? They hadn't even started on that when I worked down there. This was 2006-2007. Certainly, it should be much quicker once the project is complete (including London Bridge and the new tracks between the two). Given the money spent one would hope so. B2003 |
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On Mar 23, 9:28*am, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 21:06:09 +0000 Recliner wrote: Unofficially. Maidenhead is hardly the most logical place for a terminus. So it hasn't been announced, and isn't part of the plan, but is just your presumption. *Given that it's a TfL managed project, and is ordering sans-toilet trains, Maidenhead may be as far west as it should go. AFAIK the line to reading is "protected". Whatever that means in practice.. That takes seconds. The main issue when I used it was the slow speed on the line itself and the constant stopping. Maybe also connected with the rebuilding of Blackfriars station? They hadn't even started on that when I worked down there. This was 2006-2007. Certainly, it should be much quicker once the project is complete (including London Bridge and the new tracks between the two). Given the money spent one would hope so. The assumption that Crossrail will run to Reading is a reasonable one. Maidenhead was chosen as the Western Terminus in order to keep the project within budget. If this remains the case, trains for the section beyond Maidenhead will share the reliefs from a flat Junction beyond Paddington to Maidenhead. At Maidenhead Crossrail reversal will have to be handled within the two relief lines which will coping with said thru trains. Meanwhile, the route is being electrified to Reading where ample new platform accomodation is being constructed. This is happening under a budget outwith Crossrails. So, no, the powers that be do not admit that Crossrail will run to Reading. Received wisdom is that it will. |
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On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 04:57:19 -0700 (PDT)
77002 wrote: Meanwhile, the route is being electrified to Reading where ample new Is this going to be the first stage of the electrification of the whole GWR main line or is that still pie in the sky? So, no, the powers that be do not admit that Crossrail will run to Reading. Received wisdom is that it will. If the infrastructure is already going to be there anyway there's no really good reason not to. B2003 |
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On Thu, Mar 22, 2012 at 05:23:19AM -0700, 77002 wrote:
On Mar 22, 11:47=A0am, wrote: On Thu, 22 Mar 2012 11:10:06 +0000 David Cantrell wrote: It makes sense to me. =A0An awful lot of journeys will be a hell of a lo= t shorter than Maidenhead (not Reading) to Shenfield, and even for those few people going all the way, it's only an hour and a half, as near as damnit the same as Richmond to Upminster, which also has no bogs and no-one seems to mind that. I suspect the central bit will be packed as people use it as an alternati= ve to the tube (assuming Oyster will be valid and they're not going to try i= t on with special fares). I don't think you'd want smelly , possibly blocke= d toilets in the carraige in that scenario. Thameslink has on board facilities. Thameslink's central section is extremely well utilized. Brighton to Bedford is nearly an hour longer journey, so there's more reason to have bogs on the trains. -- David Cantrell | Hero of the Information Age I apologize if I offended you personally, I intended to do it professionally. -- Steve Champeon, on the nanog list |
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On Mar 23, 12:44*pm, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 04:57:19 -0700 (PDT) 77002 wrote: Meanwhile, the route is being electrified to Reading where ample new Is this going to be the first stage of the electrification of the whole GWR main line or is that still pie in the sky? This is something about which I have no knowledge. Perhaps someone will stop by with an answer. AFIK, it is HMG's intention to electrify the GW mainline. Although curiously work has started on the northern electrification programs anounced at the same time. I am not aware of any work on the GW mainline in this regard. So, no, the powers that be do not admit that Crossrail will run to Reading. *Received wisdom is that it will. If the infrastructure is already going to be there anyway there's no really good reason not to. |
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"Graeme Wall" wrote in message
... On 23/03/2012 12:44, d wrote: If the infrastructure is already going to be there anyway there's no really good reason not to. AIUI the Crossrail maintenance depot will be at Reading. Crossrail's depot is at Old Oak Common, in the area currently given over to tunnel segment manufacture. The new depot being built at Reading is to replace the existing upper and lower triangle DMU maintenance and stabling sites, and is also intended to provide facilities for the EMUs planned for the route following electrification, i.e. the second hand 319s. Space is also allocated for IEP maintenance. Paul S |
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On 23/03/2012 16:42, Paul Scott wrote:
"Graeme Wall" wrote in message ... On 23/03/2012 12:44, d wrote: If the infrastructure is already going to be there anyway there's no really good reason not to. AIUI the Crossrail maintenance depot will be at Reading. Crossrail's depot is at Old Oak Common, in the area currently given over to tunnel segment manufacture. The new depot being built at Reading is to replace the existing upper and lower triangle DMU maintenance and stabling sites, and is also intended to provide facilities for the EMUs planned for the route following electrification, i.e. the second hand 319s. Space is also allocated for IEP maintenance. I'm sure I have seen at least one plan of the Reading redevelopment with Crossrail depot on it, possibly only sidings. It was the one where the map was a tear-drop shape if that gives a clue to which one I mean, I had a copy on this machine but must have deleted it. -- Graeme Wall This account not read, substitute trains for rail. Railway Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail |
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"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
... i believe Network Rail are in the design phase for Great Western electrification so work is happening even if nothing obvious has turned up "on site". There's plenty of infrastructure clearance work going on now, mainly track lowering and bridge rebuilding. A significant number of overbridge sites on the stretch between Reading and Didcot looked like a disaster zone just after the Christmas and New Year break. Civils work of similar nature has just started between Reading and Newbury as well. The actual wires will only appear much later, but the civils part of the project is definitely underway... Paul S |
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"Paul Scott" wrote There's plenty of infrastructure clearance work going on now, mainly track lowering and bridge rebuilding. A significant number of overbridge sites on the stretch between Reading and Didcot looked like a disaster zone just after the Christmas and New Year break. Civils work of similar nature has just started between Reading and Newbury as well. The bridge rebuilding was done as part of Southampton to Midlands freight gauge enhancement (though was done to giver clearance for OHLE as well). Peter |
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"Peter Masson" wrote in message
... The bridge rebuilding was done as part of Southampton to Midlands freight gauge enhancement (though was done to giver clearance for OHLE as well). The gauge enhancement for W10 had already been competed early last year though Peter, W10 trains were already running by March. These latest works were definitely being announced locally as being for electrification clearance. Discussions elsewhere suggested that at some bridges track lowering was found to allow just enough clearance for the W10, so the work at those was put on the back burner until electrification was fully confirmed. Paul |
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On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 13:57:43 +0100
David Cantrell wrote: On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 12:44:30PM +0000, d wrote: On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 04:57:19 -0700 (PDT) 77002 wrote: Meanwhile, the route is being electrified to Reading where ample new Is this going to be the first stage of the electrification of the whole GWR main line or is that still pie in the sky? It's been approved at least as far as Bristol and Cardiff, but not onwards to Swansea. I don't know about the branch down to Exeter, Penzance etc. I vaguely remember reading something about clearance issues with the severn tunnel wrt overhead wires. B2003 |
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wrote in message
... I vaguely remember reading something about clearance issues with the severn tunnel wrt overhead wires. There is no OHLE clearance issue in the Severn Tunnel. If there was, they wouldn't be wiring through to Cardiff, would they? Paul S |
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On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 15:24:36 +0100
"Paul Scott" wrote: wrote in message ... I vaguely remember reading something about clearance issues with the severn tunnel wrt overhead wires. There is no OHLE clearance issue in the Severn Tunnel. If there was, they wouldn't be wiring through to Cardiff, would they? Wouldn't they? You tell me. There were plenty of gauge issues with containers around the country but they sorted that so why would this be an issue other than money? B2003 |
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On Mar 26, 3:30*pm, wrote:
On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 15:24:36 +0100 "Paul Scott" wrote: wrote in message ... I vaguely remember reading something about clearance issues with the severn tunnel wrt overhead wires. There is no OHLE clearance issue in the Severn Tunnel. *If there was, they wouldn't be wiring through to Cardiff, would they? Wouldn't they? You tell me. There were plenty of gauge issues with containers around the country but they sorted that so why would this be an issue other than money? ISTR the Severn Tunnel had very severe damp problems. |
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