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Oyster Card
I'm not too sure if this is the right place to post this but I was wondering if anyone could help me. What is the maximum amount of times you can use your oyster card in a set period of time? I have just produce a list of things that I need to do on Monday and it will require 9 different uses of my oyster card in a two hour period. Will my oyster card work for all thee journies? I heard that there is a cap of the amount of journeys that can be made in a period of time
Many thanks |
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In article ,
Paul Corfield wrote: On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 16:15:28 +0000, Lewis wrote: I'm not too sure if this is the right place to post this but I was wondering if anyone could help me. What is the maximum amount of times you can use your oyster card in a set period of time? I have just produce a list of things that I need to do on Monday and it will require 9 different uses of my oyster card in a two hour period. Will my oyster card work for all thee journies? I heard that there is a cap of the amount of journeys that can be made in a period of time I have never heard of such a limit. There are journeys in London where nine validations within 2 hours are perfectly possible. I suppose there is the OSI issue where you might in some cases get an unintentional continuation of your previous journey, which may or may not cause problems later on. Is the OP using PAYG or an Oyster travelcard ? Nick -- "The Internet, a sort of ersatz counterfeit of real life" -- Janet Street-Porter, BBC2, 19th March 1996 |
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Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 16:15:28 +0000, Lewis wrote: I'm not too sure if this is the right place to post this but I was wondering if anyone could help me. What is the maximum amount of times you can use your oyster card in a set period of time? I have just produce a list of things that I need to do on Monday and it will require 9 different uses of my oyster card in a two hour period. Will my oyster card work for all thee journies? I heard that there is a cap of the amount of journeys that can be made in a period of time I have never heard of such a limit. There are journeys in London where nine validations within 2 hours are perfectly possible. Further, staff use Oyster cards to open gates time after time without any issue. I am sure there must have been times when I have used an Oyster card as many times as you propose to do, again without any card problems. The only thing I can think of is the fact that the card holds the last 10 transactions but this is not an issue. Once the 11th transaction is made the first one disappears from the card. The system overall captures all the transactions anyway. I'm now the proud possessor of one of the new 60+ not-quite-Freedom Oyster cards, and I notice that it doesn't tell me the fares that I've saved. Do you know if it calculates them at all, or just opens the gates without doing any fare calculations? And does it keep a query-able journey history like a normal Oyster card? [It'll spot me doing some strange ones as I take advantage of my new freedom!] |
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"Recliner" wrote in message ... Paul Corfield wrote: On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 16:15:28 +0000, Lewis wrote: I'm not too sure if this is the right place to post this but I was wondering if anyone could help me. What is the maximum amount of times you can use your oyster card in a set period of time? I have just produce a list of things that I need to do on Monday and it will require 9 different uses of my oyster card in a two hour period. Will my oyster card work for all thee journies? I heard that there is a cap of the amount of journeys that can be made in a period of time I have never heard of such a limit. There are journeys in London where nine validations within 2 hours are perfectly possible. Further, staff use Oyster cards to open gates time after time without any issue. I am sure there must have been times when I have used an Oyster card as many times as you propose to do, again without any card problems. The only thing I can think of is the fact that the card holds the last 10 transactions but this is not an issue. Once the 11th transaction is made the first one disappears from the card. The system overall captures all the transactions anyway. I'm now the proud possessor of one of the new 60+ not-quite-Freedom Oyster cards, and I notice that it doesn't tell me the fares that I've saved. Do you know if it calculates them at all, or just opens the gates without doing any fare calculations? And does it keep a query-able journey history like a normal Oyster card? [It'll spot me doing some strange ones as I take advantage of my new freedom!] I suspect this inanimate object will spot nothing at all tim |
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"tim....." wrote:
wrote in message ... In article , (Recliner) wrote: Paul Corfield wrote: On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 16:15:28 +0000, Lewis wrote: I'm not too sure if this is the right place to post this but I was wondering if anyone could help me. What is the maximum amount of times you can use your oyster card in a set period of time? I have just produce a list of things that I need to do on Monday and it will require 9 different uses of my oyster card in a two hour period. Will my oyster card work for all thee journies? I heard that there is a cap of the amount of journeys that can be made in a period of time I have never heard of such a limit. There are journeys in London where nine validations within 2 hours are perfectly possible. Further, staff use Oyster cards to open gates time after time without any issue. I am sure there must have been times when I have used an Oyster card as many times as you propose to do, again without any card problems. The only thing I can think of is the fact that the card holds the last 10 transactions but this is not an issue. Once the 11th transaction is made the first one disappears from the card. The system overall captures all the transactions anyway. I'm now the proud possessor of one of the new 60+ not-quite-Freedom Oyster cards, and I notice that it doesn't tell me the fares that I've saved. Do you know if it calculates them at all, or just opens the gates without doing any fare calculations? And does it keep a query-able journey history like a normal Oyster card? [It'll spot me doing some strange ones as I take advantage of my new freedom!] Do you mean a Freedom Pass or something else? He means a Freedom pass for the 60-60 whatever it is this week that doesn't get a pension yet. That isn't the same as the normal Freedom pass because it can't be used on buses outside of London. Correct. It's a London-only free Oyster photocard that is otherwise similar to a Freedom Pass. It came in at the beginning of this month (a Boris election pledge). See http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tickets/25830.aspx |
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In article ,
(tim.....) wrote: wrote in message ... In article , (Recliner) wrote: I'm now the proud possessor of one of the new 60+ not-quite-Freedom Oyster cards, and I notice that it doesn't tell me the fares that I've saved. Do you know if it calculates them at all, or just opens the gates without doing any fare calculations? And does it keep a query-able journey history like a normal Oyster card? [It'll spot me doing some strange ones as I take advantage of my new freedom!] Do you mean a Freedom Pass or something else? He means a Freedom pass for the 60-60 whatever it is this week that doesn't get a pension yet. That isn't the same as the normal Freedom pass because it can't be used on buses outside of London. Huh? I have a (Cambridgeshire) bus pass and don't get a pension. I can use it anywhere in the country. -- Colin Rosenstiel |
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wrote:
In article , (tim.....) wrote: wrote in message ... In article , (Recliner) wrote: I'm now the proud possessor of one of the new 60+ not-quite-Freedom Oyster cards, and I notice that it doesn't tell me the fares that I've saved. Do you know if it calculates them at all, or just opens the gates without doing any fare calculations? And does it keep a query-able journey history like a normal Oyster card? [It'll spot me doing some strange ones as I take advantage of my new freedom!] Do you mean a Freedom Pass or something else? He means a Freedom pass for the 60-60 whatever it is this week that doesn't get a pension yet. That isn't the same as the normal Freedom pass because it can't be used on buses outside of London. Huh? I have a (Cambridgeshire) bus pass and don't get a pension. I can use it anywhere in the country. The bus pass age is linked to the female retirement age, so it's currently ~61.5. People over that age are entitled to it, but any Londoner over 60 but under that rising age can now have the new 60+ free Oystercard (which, of course, also includes 24 hour access to all TfL services, and off-peak access to all rail services in London). |
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Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 16:19:33 -0600, Recliner wrote: I'm now the proud possessor of one of the new 60+ not-quite-Freedom Oyster cards, Lucky you! and I notice that it doesn't tell me the fares that I've saved. Do you know if it calculates them at all, or just opens the gates without doing any fare calculations? And does it keep a query-able journey history like a normal Oyster card? [It'll spot me doing some strange ones as I take advantage of my new freedom!] My guess, as I don't know how the card has been specified, is that it is coded as a "Permit" just like a Freedom Pass. It has the same London area validity but is not an English Concessionary Pass so it will not have the english rose symbol printed on it. I don't know whether London Freedom Passes are now both Oyster and ITSO compatible but if so then I would expect the 60+ Oyster (your card) to just be Oyster compatible. Permits act like a season ticket within the area, times and modes specified. They are not able to have a PAYG purse working alongside. This question has been raised many times in Mayor's Questions due to the lack of 24 hour availability on National Rail services for Freedom Passes and the answer has always been "your constituent must obtain a separate Oyster PAYG card and pay fares before 0930 M-F". Permits should be readable by a ticket office machine operated by a ticket clerk but I am not certain if journey history is displayed if you tap the card at a passenger ticket machine (POM). I think my old TfL Staff Pass could be read at a POM so it's possible the basic (last 10) journey details would be displayed as that's what on the card. It will not show what the fare would have been for the journey you've done - it has no reason to calculate a fare. You'll need to record your journeys and work out the fares and daily caps yourself. I've done this for the Travelcard I currently have and it's been an instructive exercise when you compare it to what would have happened if I'd done the same journeys on PAYG and been capped. No harm in you tapping your card on an Oyster pad at a POM and seeing what Journey History brings up. Thanks for the info. Do you know what would happen if I tried to use it to enter a NR station before 9:30? Would it open the gate? And what happens if it's an ungated station with an Oyster reader? Having one will certainly change my journey patterns. |
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I can't imagine that they would allow that. Best use 2 Oysters.
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In article , (Roland Perry)
wrote: In message , at 18:32:20 on Sat, 10 Nov 2012, remarked: He means a Freedom pass for the 60-60 whatever it is this week that doesn't get a pension yet. That isn't the same as the normal Freedom pass because it can't be used on buses outside of London. Huh? I have a (Cambridgeshire) bus pass and don't get a pension. I can use it anywhere in the country. People attaining the age of 60 this year won't get such a pass, because the goalposts have been moved. For someone who becomes 60 today, they'll have to wait until 6 July 2015 to qualify for a national bus pass, assuming they haven't changed the rules again by then. That depends on the issuing council(s). I'm sure Cambridgeshire will be one of the meanest. -- Colin Rosenstiel |
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 04:51:41 on Sun, 11 Nov 2012, remarked: For someone who becomes 60 today, they'll have to wait until 6 July 2015 to qualify for a national bus pass, assuming they haven't changed the rules again by then. That depends on the issuing council(s). I'm sure Cambridgeshire will be one of the meanest. Are you saying that councils have discretion on when they'll issue the passes? And if so, do they generally exercise it to issue them earlier or later than the "female retirement age" benchmark? They can issue a local pass earlier if they want, as London now does, but the national bus pass scheme starts when someone reaches female retirement age. I don't think English councils can opt out of that. London is also more generous in that its pass covers nearly all public transport, not just buses, and it's 24 hours a day for TfL-operated services. |
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wrote:
In article , (Recliner) wrote: Thanks for the info. Do you know what would happen if I tried to use it to enter a NR station before 9:30? Would it open the gate? And what happens if it's an ungated station with an Oyster reader? Like any other ticketless travel, surely? But are the Oyster readers programmed to refuse one of the cards before 9:30am? |
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In message
, at 05:44:18 on Sun, 11 Nov 2012, Recliner remarked: For someone who becomes 60 today, they'll have to wait until 6 July 2015 to qualify for a national bus pass, assuming they haven't changed the rules again by then. That depends on the issuing council(s). I'm sure Cambridgeshire will be one of the meanest. Are you saying that councils have discretion on when they'll issue the passes? And if so, do they generally exercise it to issue them earlier or later than the "female retirement age" benchmark? They can issue a local pass earlier if they want, as London now does, but the national bus pass scheme starts when someone reaches female retirement age. I don't think English councils can opt out of that. Have any of the shire counties opted-in to provide the passes early? -- Roland Perry |
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Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 19:18:12 -0600, Recliner wrote: Thanks for the info. Do you know what would happen if I tried to use it to enter a NR station before 9:30? Would it open the gate? And what happens if it's an ungated station with an Oyster reader? It should not open the gate. Before Freedom Passes were made 24 hours they would not open a gate before 0900 / 0930. This is the same as happens with off peak One Day Travelcards that similarly do not open gates before 0930 M-F. A validator should show a reject message but obviously it can't physically stop you entering the platform. You would be at risk of being caught for ticketless travel if you travel on a NR service before your pass becomes valid. I see that a few NR routes, traditionally those with inter-availability with LU, offer free travel before 0930 M-F. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...tocard-pdf.pdf Thanks, yes it's confusing how bits of the Chiltern lines that parallel or share LU lines have 24 availability, but others don't. |
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 05:44:18 on Sun, 11 Nov 2012, Recliner remarked: For someone who becomes 60 today, they'll have to wait until 6 July 2015 to qualify for a national bus pass, assuming they haven't changed the rules again by then. That depends on the issuing council(s). I'm sure Cambridgeshire will be one of the meanest. Are you saying that councils have discretion on when they'll issue the passes? And if so, do they generally exercise it to issue them earlier or later than the "female retirement age" benchmark? They can issue a local pass earlier if they want, as London now does, but the national bus pass scheme starts when someone reaches female retirement age. I don't think English councils can opt out of that. Have any of the shire counties opted-in to provide the passes early? http://www.salisburyjournal.co.uk/ne...ds_for_travel/ |
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In message
, at 07:10:40 on Sun, 11 Nov 2012, Recliner remarked: For someone who becomes 60 today, they'll have to wait until 6 July 2015 to qualify for a national bus pass, assuming they haven't changed the rules again by then. That depends on the issuing council(s). I'm sure Cambridgeshire will be one of the meanest. Are you saying that councils have discretion on when they'll issue the passes? And if so, do they generally exercise it to issue them earlier or later than the "female retirement age" benchmark? They can issue a local pass earlier if they want, as London now does, but the national bus pass scheme starts when someone reaches female retirement age. I don't think English councils can opt out of that. Have any of the shire counties opted-in to provide the .... National bus pas scheme... passes early? http://www.salisburyjournal.co.uk/ne...ds_for_travel/ It's not obvious that the scheme referred to there is a national bus pass. -- Roland Perry |
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On 11/11/2012 12:57, Recliner wrote:
Thanks, yes it's confusing how bits of the Chiltern lines that parallel or share LU lines have 24 availability, but others don't. The only bit that may seem less than obvious at first is South Ruislip - West Ruislip. It's perfectly logical though, as the gates at each end won't know whether you've travelled on Chiltern or the Central Line. And Marylebone - Amersham is an extension of the interavailability of paper tickets. Cheers, Barry |
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 07:10:40 on Sun, 11 Nov 2012, Recliner remarked: For someone who becomes 60 today, they'll have to wait until 6 July 2015 to qualify for a national bus pass, assuming they haven't changed the rules again by then. That depends on the issuing council(s). I'm sure Cambridgeshire will be one of the meanest. Are you saying that councils have discretion on when they'll issue the passes? And if so, do they generally exercise it to issue them earlier or later than the "female retirement age" benchmark? They can issue a local pass earlier if they want, as London now does, but the national bus pass scheme starts when someone reaches female retirement age. I don't think English councils can opt out of that. Have any of the shire counties opted-in to provide the ... National bus pas scheme... passes early? http://www.salisburyjournal.co.uk/ne...ds_for_travel/ It's not obvious that the scheme referred to there is a national bus pass. No, it clearly isn't. Local councils (including London) obviously can't force any others to provide free travel before the national pass age. But they are free to grant it to 60+ (or any other) locals in their own area, as London now does. |
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Barry Salter wrote:
On 11/11/2012 12:57, Recliner wrote: Thanks, yes it's confusing how bits of the Chiltern lines that parallel or share LU lines have 24 availability, but others don't. The only bit that may seem less than obvious at first is South Ruislip - West Ruislip. It's perfectly logical though, as the gates at each end won't know whether you've travelled on Chiltern or the Central Line. And Marylebone - Amersham is an extension of the interavailability of paper tickets. Unfortunately for me, my nearest station is one of the Chiltern ones that doesn't participate in this (even though it has Oyster OSI with a nearby Tube station). |
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In article
, (Recliner) wrote: Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 07:10:40 on Sun, 11 Nov 2012, Recliner remarked: For someone who becomes 60 today, they'll have to wait until 6 July 2015 to qualify for a national bus pass, assuming they haven't changed the rules again by then. That depends on the issuing council(s). I'm sure Cambridgeshire will be one of the meanest. Are you saying that councils have discretion on when they'll issue the passes? And if so, do they generally exercise it to issue them earlier or later than the "female retirement age" benchmark? They can issue a local pass earlier if they want, as London now does, but the national bus pass scheme starts when someone reaches female retirement age. I don't think English councils can opt out of that. Have any of the shire counties opted-in to provide the ... National bus pas scheme... passes early? http://www.salisburyjournal.co.uk/ne...unds_for_trave l/ It's not obvious that the scheme referred to there is a national bus pass. No, it clearly isn't. Local councils (including London) obviously can't force any others to provide free travel before the national pass age. But they are free to grant it to 60+ (or any other) locals in their own area, as London now does. A Google search for "concessionary bus travel in England" reveals few if any other councils issuing passes at 60.I thought I'd read that at least one of the metropolitan areas had done something similar to Boris. -- Colin Rosenstiel |
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In message of Sun, 11 Nov
2012 01:04:24 in uk.transport.london, Paul Corfield writes [snip] My guess, as I don't know how the card has been specified, is that it is coded as a "Permit" just like a Freedom Pass. It has the same London area validity but is not an English Concessionary Pass so it will not have the english rose symbol printed on it. I don't know whether London Freedom Passes are now both Oyster and ITSO compatible but if so then I would expect the 60+ Oyster (your card) to just be Oyster compatible. Permits act like a season ticket within the area, times and modes specified. They are not able to have a PAYG purse working alongside. This question has been raised many times in Mayor's Questions due to the lack of 24 hour availability on National Rail services for Freedom Passes and the answer has always been "your constituent must obtain a separate Oyster PAYG card and pay fares before 0930 M-F". What is the reasoning behind that? Permits should be readable by a ticket office machine operated by a ticket clerk but I am not certain if journey history is displayed if you tap the card at a passenger ticket machine (POM). I think my old TfL Staff Pass could be read at a POM so it's possible the basic (last 10) journey details would be displayed as that's what on the card. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oyster_card says "... Touch screen ticket machines report the last eight journeys and last top-up amount. The same information is available as a print-out from ticket offices, and also on-board London Buses by request. ..." I can get last 8 journeys on Oyster Cards and on my Freedom Pass. I assume the same is true on the 60+ Oyster issued to my better half. A Freedom Pass can't be associated with an Oyster online account. I found it possible, but unreasonably tedious, to get an 8 week printout on paper with a Freedom of Information Act request. -- Walter Briscoe |
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In message
nternet.com of Sat, 10 Nov 2012 19:18:12 in uk.transport.london, Recliner writes Paul Corfield wrote: On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 16:19:33 -0600, Recliner wrote: [snip] No harm in you tapping your card on an Oyster pad at a POM and seeing what Journey History brings up. Thanks for the info. Do you know what would happen if I tried to use it to enter a NR station before 9:30? Would it open the gate? And what happens It won't open the gate if the travel is not valid. This also happens at London Bridge where most travel by train on these concessionary cards is invalid in the morning peak. When my son went to school, his child was also rejected there. if it's an ungated station with an Oyster reader? You get a rejection bleep. I found this happened at Bowes Park (invalid) after starting a First Capital Connect journey at Moorgate (valid). Having one will certainly change my journey patterns. The Freedom Pass has curiously inconsistent validity. It is valid at Dartford, where Oyster is not. I saw many caught by that on a visit to Dartford. It is invalid at Chafford Hundred Lakeside, Grays, Ockenden, and Purfleet, which are outside the zones, but where PAYG is valid. It seems one is expected to buy a paper extension ticket. -- Walter Briscoe |
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On 11/11/2012 13:45, Paul Corfield wrote: [...] Other sets of interavailabilities / time based restrictions have grown up over the years because of the "early adopters" of PAYG plus the impact of London Overground. The proliferation of discount schemes and the reluctance of the TOCs to participate in them is another factor in burgeoning availability complexity. I dare say a new set will emerge when the Overground extends in a few weeks time where you'll be able to go to Denmark Hill on a LOROL train before 0930 but not on a South Eastern or Southern one! [...] Though you won't be going to Denmark Hill on a Southern train from 9 December onwards, as there won't be any! (Unless a signalman sets the wrong route, and a driver takes it...) [...] I'm assuming the practice will be the same as happens south of New Cross Gate where using LOROL is fine but Southern is not (before 0930 M-F). Agreed, there are posters up to this effect at stations south of NX Gate. |
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On 12/11/2012 14:41, Paul Corfield wrote: On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 11:00:21 +0000, Mizter T wrote: On 11/11/2012 13:45, Paul Corfield wrote: [...] Other sets of interavailabilities / time based restrictions have grown up over the years because of the "early adopters" of PAYG plus the impact of London Overground. The proliferation of discount schemes and the reluctance of the TOCs to participate in them is another factor in burgeoning availability complexity. I dare say a new set will emerge when the Overground extends in a few weeks time where you'll be able to go to Denmark Hill on a LOROL train before 0930 but not on a South Eastern or Southern one! [...] Though you won't be going to Denmark Hill on a Southern train from 9 December onwards, as there won't be any! (Unless a signalman sets the wrong route, and a driver takes it...) Trust me to choose a station without Southern after 9 Dec 2012. Can I swap to Peckham Rye which I assume will keep some Southern service coverage? I am showing up my relative ignorance of the rail network south of the Thames! You can - if there's no Southern service at Peckham Rye from 9 Dec onwards then something will have gone badly wrong with the planning! (Denmark Hill's only Southern service being the 'South London Line' service which shuttles between Victoria and London Bridge, which is of course being withdrawn at the timetable change.) |
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On Sat, Nov 10, 2012 at 04:15:28PM +0000, Lewis wrote:
I'm not too sure if this is the right place to post this but I was wondering if anyone could help me. What is the maximum amount of times you can use your oyster card in a set period of time? I have just produce a list of things that I need to do on Monday and it will require 9 different uses of my oyster card in a two hour period. Will my oyster card work for all thee journies? I heard that there is a cap of the amount of journeys that can be made in a period of time I expect that you're getting confused with the fare cap. If you use your PAYG Oyster card enough in a day that it would have been cheaper to get a one day travelcard*, then you will only be charged for a one day travelcard. * the exact amount will depend on what modes of transport you've used, the time of day, phase of the moon, and what colour tie Boris is wearing today -- David Cantrell | Cake Smuggler Extraordinaire "The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary" -- H. L. Mencken |
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In message , at 14:34:43
on Thu, 15 Nov 2012, David Cantrell remarked: If you use your PAYG Oyster card enough in a day that it would have been cheaper to get a one day travelcard*, then you will only be charged for a one day travelcard. And the devil in the detail is "what travelcard". There was a worked example discussed a few months ago that showed that lots of use in Z1, plus one excursion to Z2 (or was it Z4) at the end of the day, gets capped at the higher travelcard figure, which is noticeably more than the Z1 travelcard plus the extra single fare. -- Roland Perry |
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On 15/11/2012 14:34, David Cantrell wrote: On Sat, Nov 10, 2012 at 04:15:28PM +0000, Lewis wrote: I'm not too sure if this is the right place to post this but I was wondering if anyone could help me. What is the maximum amount of times you can use your oyster card in a set period of time? I have just produce a list of things that I need to do on Monday and it will require 9 different uses of my oyster card in a two hour period. Will my oyster card work for all thee journies? I heard that there is a cap of the amount of journeys that can be made in a period of time I expect that you're getting confused with the fare cap. If you use your PAYG Oyster card enough in a day that it would have been cheaper to get a one day travelcard*, then you will only be charged for a one day travelcard. PAYG caps are the same price as the equivalent Day Travelcards, so getting a Day Travelcard would be no cheaper. (Next year, Day Travelcards are going up in price but the PAYG caps are being frozen at 2012 levels, so it'll be cheaper to use Oyster PAYG.) Re the original question, I've used an Oyster card more than 9 times (in terms of validations) in a two hour period no problem. I've never come across the suggestion of any such limit before reading the OP's post either - I'm 99.9% certain no such limit exists. |
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On 15/11/2012 15:56, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 14:34:43 on Thu, 15 Nov 2012, David Cantrell remarked: If you use your PAYG Oyster card enough in a day that it would have been cheaper to get a one day travelcard*, then you will only be charged for a one day travelcard. And the devil in the detail is "what travelcard". There was a worked example discussed a few months ago that showed that lots of use in Z1, plus one excursion to Z2 (or was it Z4) at the end of the day, gets capped at the higher travelcard figure, which is noticeably more than the Z1 travelcard plus the extra single fare. There's no such thing as a Z1 only Travelcard (or PAYG cap) - only a Z1&2 Travelcard / cap. If it was an excursion to Z4, then I still can't make sense of that whatsoever - I certainly can't make it compute as being more expensive. If you can dig the discussion up, I'd be happy to take a look at it. FWIW, the fare tables for Oyster PAYG and Day Travelcards can be found here... TfL fare tables (travel on Tube/DLR/LO): http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tickets/14416.aspx National Rail: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tickets/14414.aspx |
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"Mizter T" wrote in message ...
On 15/11/2012 15:56, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 14:34:43 on Thu, 15 Nov 2012, David Cantrell remarked: If you use your PAYG Oyster card enough in a day that it would have been cheaper to get a one day travelcard*, then you will only be charged for a one day travelcard. And the devil in the detail is "what travelcard". There was a worked example discussed a few months ago that showed that lots of use in Z1, plus one excursion to Z2 (or was it Z4) at the end of the day, gets capped at the higher travelcard figure, which is noticeably more than the Z1 travelcard plus the extra single fare. There's no such thing as a Z1 only Travelcard (or PAYG cap) - only a Z1&2 Travelcard / cap. If it was an excursion to Z4, then I still can't make sense of that whatsoever - I certainly can't make it compute as being more expensive. If you can dig the discussion up, I'd be happy to take a look at it. I think it may have been related to the peak cap. Something like one single peak journey from Z5 to Z1, followed by a large number of journeys in Z1/2. This would be charged at the Z1-6 peak cap (£15.80), instead of single + Z1-2 peak cap (£4.40+£8.40). Peter Smyth |
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In message , at 16:35:23 on Thu, 15 Nov
2012, Mizter T remarked: And the devil in the detail is "what travelcard". There was a worked example discussed a few months ago that showed that lots of use in Z1, plus one excursion to Z2 (or was it Z4) at the end of the day, gets capped at the higher travelcard figure, which is noticeably more than the Z1 travelcard plus the extra single fare. There's no such thing as a Z1 only Travelcard (or PAYG cap) - only a Z1&2 Travelcard / cap. If it was an excursion to Z4, then I still can't make sense of that whatsoever - I certainly can't make it compute as being more expensive. Z12 Travelcard £ 8.40 Z2-Z5 Single £ 2.60 (even cheaper @ £1.40 if off peak by then) ------ £11.00 Z12345 Travelcard £15.80 -- Roland Perry |
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On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 09:44:25PM +0000, Paul Corfield wrote:
You cannot work out how the capping process would work *unless* you have the times, numbers. modes and zones covered of all journeys over the day (assuming it is M-F when peak periods apply). Comparing two fares with each other or even two tariffs won't provide the answer. And that is the problem. Pricing should be clear. If it isn't, there will always be the suspicion that people are being ripped off. And pricing should be simple. If it isn't, then there are likely to be edge-cases where people *are* ripped off. -- David Cantrell | Nth greatest programmer in the world One person can change the world, but most of the time they shouldn't -- Marge Simpson |
Oyster Card
In message , at 12:23:38
on Fri, 16 Nov 2012, David Cantrell remarked: You cannot work out how the capping process would work *unless* you have the times, numbers. modes and zones covered of all journeys over the day (assuming it is M-F when peak periods apply). Comparing two fares with each other or even two tariffs won't provide the answer. And that is the problem. Pricing should be clear. If it isn't, there will always be the suspicion that people are being ripped off. And pricing should be simple. If it isn't, then there are likely to be edge-cases where people *are* ripped off. Part of the problem is the impression which is given that the Oyster capping system means you'll never pay more than the total of all the individual elements bought separately as efficiently as possible. However, that isn't the case (see the Z5 example I quoted yesterday). -- Roland Perry |
Oyster Card
On Fri, 16 Nov 2012 12:45:49 +0000
Paul Corfield wrote: I think the basic message is clear - you are capped at the lowest priced cap or at best value / lowest priced combination of peak travel and off peak cap (for the journeys you have made). I've seen several worked examples and it can get quite involved when you are balancing peak jnys against off peak ones, especially with peak / off peak different modal journeys. Another good argument for a flat fare system. B2003 |
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