"Recliner" wrote in message
...

I looked at Victoria the other day, and all the 38s in the queue were
conventional buses, so perhaps the NB4L prototypes have been
withdrawn. I suppose their new role might be to test out other routes
for production models. Or maybe they've gone back to Wright to be
upgraded to production spec?

I tried them out in January on the 38 route, and took a few pics:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/recline...7632900943469/

I do use the 38 from time, but never with one of the new buses. Do you know
how they differ from the production series?

"Stephen Furley" wrote:
"Recliner" wrote in message ...

I looked at Victoria the other day, and all the 38s in the queue were
conventional buses, so perhaps the NB4L prototypes have been
withdrawn. I suppose their new role might be to test out other routes
for production models. Or maybe they've gone back to Wright to be
upgraded to production spec?

I tried them out in January on the 38 route, and took a few pics:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/recline...7632900943469/

I do use the 38 from time, but never with one of the new buses. Do you
know how they differ from the production series?

No, no idea. I know one of the problems with the prototypes was that they
were very heavy, so perhaps the production versions have been on a diet,
but I don't know if that will have led to any visible changes. I also
thought the prototype's engine was a bit noisy, but again, if they've
improved the engine mounts or insulation, I don't know if one could see any
changes.

Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sun, 23 Jun 2013 19:21:05 +0100, "Stephen Furley"
wrote:

"Recliner" wrote in message
...

I looked at Victoria the other day, and all the 38s in the queue were
conventional buses, so perhaps the NB4L prototypes have been
withdrawn. I suppose their new role might be to test out other routes
for production models. Or maybe they've gone back to Wright to be
upgraded to production spec?

I tried them out in January on the 38 route, and took a few pics:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/recline...7632900943469/

I do use the 38 from time, but never with one of the new buses. Do you know
how they differ from the production series?

There are 8 prototypes - LT1-8. Two of them, LT1 and 2, are on "Great
Britain" promotional work at the moment. LT1 is the one that went to
the USA.

The remaining 6 prototypes are on route 38. However they way they are
used has changed. Up until 14 June there was a "supplementary
schedule" which just used the LTs. That has been scrapped and the LTs
are now just part of the pool of buses that can be used on route 38.
There has been a road closure in Hackney which has altered the way
buses have to move near to Hackney Central and Clapton Garage. To
avoid gridlock schedules and terminals on several routes have been
changed. A side effect is that the NB4Ls now run to Clapton Pond -
previously they always terminated at Hackney Central sometimes running
into Clapton Garage to stand but other times to Ash Grove where they
actually "live". The conductors have also been withdrawn from the 38
as of yesterday so they run as OPO open boarding double deckers
alongside the VDL double deckers.

The remaining LTs (LT9-40) are production buses and are allocated to
route 24. There are 32 buses for a peak requirement of 27 vehicles.
This is quite a premium of spare vehicles. The main difference is that
the production vehicles are a bit lighter than the prototypes.
Production vehicles can carry 80 pax while the prototypes carry 78.
TfL's standard requires a capacity of 87 for double deckers.

The next route to get them is route 11 on 21 September 2013. A wide
number of routes have been evaluated for potential conversion but no
announcements have been made. The buses for route 24 have route 16 on
their blind set but route 16 already has a compliment of hybrid buses
on it.

Ah, I thought you'd be the one to know! Are there any visible changes? And
will the first eight prototypes get upgraded to production spec?

In message , at 19:16:59
on Sun, 23 Jun 2013, Stephen Furley remarked:
I just noticed that you said this was on Friday. I'm pretty sure
Saturday was their first day on the 24, so the one you saw was probably
either being moved to whatever depot they operate from, or on crew
training, and not actually in service.

Is the depot inside the congestion zone (the bus I saw was about a
minute outside, heading in).
--
Roland Perry

"Roland Perry" wrote in message ...

In message , at 19:16:59
on Sun, 23 Jun 2013, Stephen Furley remarked:
I just noticed that you said this was on Friday. I'm pretty sure
Saturday was their first day on the 24, so the one you saw was probably
either being moved to whatever depot they operate from, or on crew
training, and not actually in service.

Is the depot inside the congestion zone (the bus I saw was about a
minute outside, heading in).
--
Roland Perry

I've no idea where it is - sorry.

In article ,
says...

"Roland Perry" wrote in message ...

In message , at 19:16:59
on Sun, 23 Jun 2013, Stephen Furley remarked:
I just noticed that you said this was on Friday. I'm pretty sure
Saturday was their first day on the 24, so the one you saw was probably
either being moved to whatever depot they operate from, or on crew
training, and not actually in service.

Is the depot inside the congestion zone (the bus I saw was about a
minute outside, heading in).
--
Roland Perry

I've no idea where it is - sorry.

It's at Holloway [N19] so well outside the congestion zone, so must have
been driver training last Friday.

On Mon, 24 Jun 2013 00:35:01 +0100
Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sun, 23 Jun 2013 21:46:19 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote:

In message , at 19:16:59
on Sun, 23 Jun 2013, Stephen Furley remarked:
I just noticed that you said this was on Friday. I'm pretty sure
Saturday was their first day on the 24, so the one you saw was probably
either being moved to whatever depot they operate from, or on crew
training, and not actually in service.

Is the depot inside the congestion zone (the bus I saw was about a
minute outside, heading in).

No - they're based at Holloway garage which is just down the road from
Archway Tube. It backs on to the Barking - Gospel Oak line.

I wonder if an area with steep hills is the best place to use a hybrid. On
the one hand you can recover a lot of energy going down the hill, on the
other I can imagine a lot of overheating traction motors going up highgate
hill. If the route goes that way of course.

--
Spud

wrote:

I wonder if an area with steep hills is the best place to use a hybrid. On
the one hand you can recover a lot of energy going down the hill, on the
other I can imagine a lot of overheating traction motors going up highgate
hill. If the route goes that way of course.

That's one thing. Another thing is when crawling in traffic the engine can
be (and is on London hybrids) turned off completely, leading to less wasted
fuel idling, and less pollution at the point of use.

Neil
--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK. Put first name before the at to reply.

On 24 Jun 2013 09:06:02 GMT
Neil Williams wrote:
wrote:

I wonder if an area with steep hills is the best place to use a hybrid. On
the one hand you can recover a lot of energy going down the hill, on the
other I can imagine a lot of overheating traction motors going up highgate
hill. If the route goes that way of course.

That's one thing. Another thing is when crawling in traffic the engine can
be (and is on London hybrids) turned off completely, leading to less wasted
fuel idling, and less pollution at the point of use.

True, but then if we did what is common around the rest of the world - ie
use trolleybuses which have zero point of use emissions - then complicated
hybrids would be unnecessary in the first place. But that might mean admitting
that we made a mistake getting rid of them and that we really don't have a clue
anymore when it comes to public transport in the UK.

--
Spud

On Mon, 24 Jun 2013 13:38:36 +0100
Paul Corfield wrote:
Some all electric buses are due on the former Red Arrow routes run out
of Waterloo garage. These will be Chinese BYD single deckers. There
are a few of these in service with Arriva in the Netherlands and KMB
have one on staff shuttle duties in Hong Kong.

http://www.orientalmodelbuses.co.uk/Xtra/HK-KMB-BE1.htm

Is there any info on the range and/or recharge times of those? I can't see
them lasting a whole day.

--
Spud