Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In message , at 08:17:24
on Mon, 22 Jul 2013, remarked:
The regular single has "no restrictions", which I think means that
section 16(ii) of the NCoC isn't over-riden, viz:

"stay in overnight accommodation when you cannot reasonably complete
your journey within one day"

Some tickets have a condition that you must resume the journey by
midday the second day, but not apparently this one.

I agree that as a "Day single" it could be argued that the validity
expires overnight anyway, but the National Rail site is silent about
any difference between "anytime", and "day" singles...

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_...pes/46550.aspx

Not on that link it isn't. "Anytime Day (Single and Return) tickets must be
used on the date shown on your ticket and up to 04:29 the following day.".
The only standard class fares offered are Anytime Day Singles, "Valid 1 day
only".

But modified by the BoJ rule quoted?

As for your immediate issue, why not buy the most appropriate tickets
once landside at Gatwick?
--
Roland Perry

Offpeak for railcard, was Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In message , at 15:07:20 on Mon, 22 Jul
2013, the_dog remarked:

slight change of topic - when does off peak for a network railcard
finish? (begins at 10am during the week)

The T&C say "after 10am", and usually the railway day ends at around
4am.
--
Roland Perry

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In article , (Roland Perry)
wrote:

In message , at
08:17:24 on Mon, 22 Jul 2013, remarked:
The regular single has "no restrictions", which I think means that
section 16(ii) of the NCoC isn't over-riden, viz:

"stay in overnight accommodation when you cannot reasonably complete
your journey within one day"

Some tickets have a condition that you must resume the journey by
midday the second day, but not apparently this one.

I agree that as a "Day single" it could be argued that the validity
expires overnight anyway, but the National Rail site is silent about
any difference between "anytime", and "day" singles...

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_...pes/46550.aspx

Not on that link it isn't. "Anytime Day (Single and Return) tickets must
be used on the date shown on your ticket and up to 04:29 the following
day.". The only standard class fares offered are Anytime Day Singles,
"Valid 1 day only".

But modified by the BoJ rule quoted?

You tell me! I'm quoting the TOC web site.

As for your immediate issue, why not buy the most appropriate tickets
once landside at Gatwick?

Time may be a problem in terms of getting a ticket so advance purchase may
be the only way to get back to Cambridge on the night.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In message , at 17:37:54
on Mon, 22 Jul 2013, remarked:
The regular single has "no restrictions", which I think means that
section 16(ii) of the NCoC isn't over-riden, viz:

"stay in overnight accommodation when you cannot reasonably complete
your journey within one day"

Some tickets have a condition that you must resume the journey by
midday the second day, but not apparently this one.

I agree that as a "Day single" it could be argued that the validity
expires overnight anyway, but the National Rail site is silent about
any difference between "anytime", and "day" singles...

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_...pes/46550.aspx

Not on that link it isn't. "Anytime Day (Single and Return) tickets must
be used on the date shown on your ticket and up to 04:29 the following
day.".

That's wrong, because of the not-being-able-to-complete condition I
quoted earlier.

The only standard class fares offered are Anytime Day Singles,
"Valid 1 day only".

Or until 4.30am the next day, of course.

But modified by the BoJ rule quoted?

You tell me! I'm quoting the TOC web site.

If it really is an Anytime Day Single, it should be OK, but it's
difficult to know who to ask to confirm this.

As for your immediate issue, why not buy the most appropriate tickets
once landside at Gatwick?

Time may be a problem in terms of getting a ticket so advance purchase may
be the only way to get back to Cambridge on the night.

"purchasing in advance" please. 'advance purchase' is a completely
different type of ticket.
--
Roland Perry

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In article , (Roland Perry)
wrote:

In message , at
17:37:54 on Mon, 22 Jul 2013, remarked:
The regular single has "no restrictions", which I think means that
section 16(ii) of the NCoC isn't over-riden, viz:

"stay in overnight accommodation when you cannot reasonably complete
your journey within one day"

Some tickets have a condition that you must resume the journey by
midday the second day, but not apparently this one.

I agree that as a "Day single" it could be argued that the validity
expires overnight anyway, but the National Rail site is silent about
any difference between "anytime", and "day" singles...

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_...pes/46550.aspx

Not on that link it isn't. "Anytime Day (Single and Return) tickets
must be used on the date shown on your ticket and up to 04:29 the
following day.".

That's wrong, because of the not-being-able-to-complete condition I
quoted earlier.

The trouble is that my daughter will have difficulty relying on that when
the official output from train companies says something else. How can she
get confirmation that her ticket will be valid before arriving at Gatwick?

The only standard class fares offered are Anytime Day Singles,
"Valid 1 day only".

Or until 4.30am the next day, of course.

Indeed. I understand "1 day only" to mean that.

But modified by the BoJ rule quoted?

You tell me! I'm quoting the TOC web site.

If it really is an Anytime Day Single, it should be OK, but it's
difficult to know who to ask to confirm this.

The nub of the problem.

As for your immediate issue, why not buy the most appropriate tickets
once landside at Gatwick?

Time may be a problem in terms of getting a ticket so advance purchase
may be the only way to get back to Cambridge on the night.

"purchasing in advance" please. 'advance purchase' is a completely
different type of ticket.

Yes, yes. You know what I meant!

--
Colin Rosenstiel

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In Neil Williams writes:

Mizter T wrote:
I'm 99.9% sure of this, but after advising a friend about ticketing who
is highly doubtful of my advice, I've stupidly allowed 0.1% of doubt to
creep in, so as a belt-and-braces measure I thought I'd just quickly check here.

If one buy an Anytime single ticket from A to C, one can travel A to B in
the morning, go and do a day's work (or indeed go and 'do' a day's fun
etc), then travel from B to C in the evening and go home (or go to the circus etc).

Yes. The one exception is that if B is a Tube station when crossing London
as part of the ticket, you have to pay for the extra Tube trip from B to
the relevant London terminal to continue.

Well that's not what the ticket clerk at our local station told me when I
asked whether I could book a ticket from Manchester to Reading via London,
and then break my journey for an afternoon at Bletchley.

He said break of journey was only allowed if you claimed to be too ill to
proceed without the break. Emphasis on the word "claimed".

--
Charles H. Lindsey ---------At Home, doing my own thing------------------------
Tel: +44 161 436 6131 Web: http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~chl
Email: Snail: 5 Clerewood Ave, CHEADLE, SK8 3JU, U.K.
PGP: 2C15F1A9 Fingerprint: 73 6D C2 51 93 A0 01 E7 65 E8 64 7E 14 A4 AB A5

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In message , at 19:17:25 on Wed, 24 Jul
2013, Charles Lindsey remarked:
I'm 99.9% sure of this, but after advising a friend about ticketing who
is highly doubtful of my advice, I've stupidly allowed 0.1% of doubt to
creep in, so as a belt-and-braces measure I thought I'd just quickly check here.

If one buy an Anytime single ticket from A to C, one can travel A to B in
the morning, go and do a day's work (or indeed go and 'do' a day's fun
etc), then travel from B to C in the evening and go home (or go to the circus etc).

Yes. The one exception is that if B is a Tube station when crossing London
as part of the ticket, you have to pay for the extra Tube trip from B to
the relevant London terminal to continue.

Well that's not what the ticket clerk at our local station told me when I
asked whether I could book a ticket from Manchester to Reading via London,
and then break my journey for an afternoon at Bletchley.

He said break of journey was only allowed if you claimed to be too ill to
proceed without the break. Emphasis on the word "claimed".

What nonsense. Where do they get these people from?

Getting back to the overnight BoJ (because the journey is impossible to
complete) there's a degree of interpretation in that I suppose.

Here's a real example: Sheffield to Liverpool St via Ely (which is a
permitted route).

The last train from Ely to Liverpool St is the 22.15, change Cambridge,
arriving 00:18, which might be a bit late for some people - depending on
where they were planning on sleeping overnight.

The last train (on which a through ticket is valid) from Sheffield to
Ely arrives at 22:11, so it could be argued that you should never have
to "overnight" at Ely.

Modulo the minimum interchange time which seems to have gone AWOL from
the National Rail site, but is unlikely to be as little as 4 minutes I'd
have thought.

[Although of course, these two trains used to be a guaranteed
connection, because both being run by Central they swapped crew at Ely,
so that the Norwich crew from the train bound for Cambridge would have
taken the ex-Liverpool/Sheffield train onwards to Norwich, and the
Liverpool/Sheffield train's crew would have finished their shift with a
short hop to Cambridge.]
--
Roland Perry

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In article , (Roland Perry)
wrote:

Getting back to the overnight BoJ (because the journey is impossible
to complete) there's a degree of interpretation in that I suppose.

Here's a real example: Sheffield to Liverpool St via Ely (which is a
permitted route).

The last train from Ely to Liverpool St is the 22.15, change
Cambridge, arriving 00:18, which might be a bit late for some people
- depending on where they were planning on sleeping overnight.

The last train (on which a through ticket is valid) from Sheffield to
Ely arrives at 22:11, so it could be argued that you should never
have to "overnight" at Ely.

Modulo the minimum interchange time which seems to have gone AWOL
from the National Rail site, but is unlikely to be as little as 4
minutes I'd have thought.

[Although of course, these two trains used to be a guaranteed
connection, because both being run by Central they swapped crew at
Ely, so that the Norwich crew from the train bound for Cambridge
would have taken the ex-Liverpool/Sheffield train onwards to Norwich,
and the Liverpool/Sheffield train's crew would have finished their
shift with a short hop to Cambridge.]

Ely is 6 minutes in Table 17 of the GBTT which is still obtainable from the
Network Rail web site.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

In message , at 07:09:47
on Thu, 25 Jul 2013, remarked:
Modulo the minimum interchange time which seems to have gone AWOL
from the National Rail site, but is unlikely to be as little as 4
minutes I'd have thought.

[Although of course, these two trains used to be a guaranteed
connection, because both being run by Central they swapped crew at
Ely, so that the Norwich crew from the train bound for Cambridge
would have taken the ex-Liverpool/Sheffield train onwards to Norwich,
and the Liverpool/Sheffield train's crew would have finished their
shift with a short hop to Cambridge.]

Ely is 6 minutes in Table 17 of the GBTT which is still obtainable from the
Network Rail web site.

Thanks for that.

I wonder when these numbers disappeared from the National Rail site?
--
Roland Perry

Silly 'break of journey' question
 

"Charles Lindsey" wrote:

Well that's not what the ticket clerk at our local station told me when I
asked whether I could book a ticket from Manchester to Reading via London,
and then break my journey for an afternoon at Bletchley.

He said break of journey was only allowed if you claimed to be too ill to
proceed without the break. Emphasis on the word "claimed".

Was this an Anytime Single, on which he would be wrong, or an Off Peak
Single, on which break of journey may be prohibited (and often is) by the
ticket restrictions?

Neil
--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK. Put first name before the at to reply.