National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

On Thursday, 29 August 2013 13:03:04 UTC+1, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at

Where's a list of organisations which are?


PTEs were set up under section 9 of the 1968 Transport Act

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/73/enacted

It starts "If in the case of any area in Great Britain outside Greater London..."


http://www.pteg.net/ explains more about them.



Are "Rover" and "Britrail" the same set as "leisure travel passes", or

are there other additions/subtractions by way of exceptions?



From the CoC "leisure travel pass...includes rover tickets, travel passes,



What's the definition (or a list of) the somewhat generic expression

"travel pass".



flexipass tickets and Britrail passes"



"Flexipass" seems to be carnet-style travel pass.

--

Roland Perry


Flexipasses are tickets such as the 3 in 7 passes which have to be dated. Carnets are treated for Conditions of Carriage purposes as single tickets.

National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

On Thursday, 29 August 2013 12:58:37 UTC+1, Roland Perry wrote:




What's your authority for that? I'm fairly sure XC doesn't have to

accept EMT's ITSO tickets between Nottingham and Derby, for example.

--

Roland Perry

The authority is the Conditions of Carriage. Cross Country do have to accept ITSO cards, unless the tickets contained on the card are operator specific.

National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

On 27/08/2013 17:14, Barry Salter wrote:
On 21/08/2013 21:15, Peter Smyth wrote:

By a strict reading of the rules, the conductor was correct, a ticket
from Surbiton is only valid on trains that stop at Surbiton, while a
ticket from Boundary Zone 6 woule be valid on any train.

A Freedom Pass (and 60+ Oyster) is treated as a Season Ticket (albeit a
time-restricted one) for the purposes of Condition 19(c) of the National
Conditions of Carriage, thus the train does not need to stop at the
relevant station as long as you're travelling on a participating TOC
(i.e. all of them except East Coast, EMT, Grand Central, Heathrow
Express, Hull Trains and Virgin).

A briefing to this effect went out some time ago, but it appears that
some staff are in need of a reminder...

So can I use a BZ6 to Reading extension on an FGW express now? I recall
this being banned in earler times.

Peter Lawrence

National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

Peter Lawrence wrote on 29 August 2013 21:31:23 ...
On 27/08/2013 17:14, Barry Salter wrote:
On 21/08/2013 21:15, Peter Smyth wrote:

By a strict reading of the rules, the conductor was correct, a ticket
from Surbiton is only valid on trains that stop at Surbiton, while a
ticket from Boundary Zone 6 woule be valid on any train.

A Freedom Pass (and 60+ Oyster) is treated as a Season Ticket (albeit a
time-restricted one) for the purposes of Condition 19(c) of the National
Conditions of Carriage, thus the train does not need to stop at the
relevant station as long as you're travelling on a participating TOC
(i.e. all of them except East Coast, EMT, Grand Central, Heathrow
Express, Hull Trains and Virgin).

A briefing to this effect went out some time ago, but it appears that
some staff are in need of a reminder...

So can I use a BZ6 to Reading extension on an FGW express now? I recall
this being banned in earler times.

That was when FGW only ran the express services out of Paddington, with
Thames Trains (later First Great Western Link) running the stopping
services. Since 2006 it's all been one franchise, so BZ6 to X tickets
are now valid on all FGW services.
--
Richard J.
(to email me, swap 'uk' and 'yon' in address)

National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

In message , at
09:08:49 on Thu, 29 Aug 2013, Matthew Dickinson
remarked:
On Thursday, 29 August 2013 12:58:37 UTC+1, Roland Perry wrote:




What's your authority for that? I'm fairly sure XC doesn't have to

accept EMT's ITSO tickets between Nottingham and Derby, for example.

The authority is the Conditions of Carriage. Cross Country do have to
accept ITSO cards, unless the tickets contained on the card are
operator specific.

I can only see a paragraph which indicates the opposite:

Each ticket is issued subject to:

....

the conditions which apply to Electronic Tickets, Smartcards,
other devices used for storing Electronic Tickets and certain
types of reduced and discounted fare tickets as set out in the
notices and other publications issued by the Train Companies
whose trains you are entitled to use;

In other words, all the train company has to do is issue a notice saying
"sorry, no ITSO cards accepted".
--
Roland Perry

National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

In message , at
09:03:49 on Thu, 29 Aug 2013, Matthew Dickinson
remarked:
Where's a list of organisations which are?


PTEs were set up under section 9 of the 1968 Transport Act

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/73/enacted

It starts "If in the case of any area in Great Britain outside Greater London..."


http://www.pteg.net/ explains more about them.



Thanks. For completeness, that list is:

Greater Manchester (Transport for Greater Manchester),
Merseyside (Merseytravel), South Yorkshire (SYPTE), Tyne and
Wear (Nexus), West Midlands (Centro) and West Yorkshire (Metro).

Are "Rover" and "Britrail" the same set as "leisure travel passes", or

are there other additions/subtractions by way of exceptions?



From the CoC "leisure travel pass...includes rover tickets, travel passes,



What's the definition (or a list of) the somewhat generic expression

"travel pass".



flexipass tickets and Britrail passes"



"Flexipass" seems to be carnet-style travel pass.



Flexipasses are tickets such as the 3 in 7 passes which have to be dated. Carnets are treated for Conditions of Carriage purposes as single
tickets.

As I thought.
--
Roland Perry

National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

Thanks, Paul

My bedtime reading will never be the same again!

On 2013-08-29 08:32:21 +0000, Paul Corfield said:

On Thu, 29 Aug 2013 01:01:06 +0100, kenw wrote:

Thanks much for that.

We can now cite 19c to those awaiting reminders

And of course the diehard jobsworths.

Ken

Here's a link to the Conditions of Carriage

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/static...tent/NRCOC.pdf

for your delectation or printing off ;-)

National Rail tickets beyond the Freedom Pass boundary
 

On 29/08/2013 23:50, Richard J. wrote:
Peter Lawrence wrote on 29 August 2013 21:31:23
...
So can I use a BZ6 to Reading extension on an FGW express now? I recall
this being banned in earler times.

That was when FGW only ran the express services out of Paddington, with
Thames Trains (later First Great Western Link) running the stopping
services. Since 2006 it's all been one franchise, so BZ6 to X tickets
are now valid on all FGW services.

Though FGW like to try and say they're not valid on HST services in the
evening peak.

An Off-Peak Day Single or Return from Boundary Zone 6 to Reading
Stations via Slough carries validity code W1 (Valid by any train except
those timed to depart before 09:30 Mondays to Fridays, excluding Public
Holidays).

An Off-Peak Return, on the other hand, carries Validity Code 5K which
*does* have the list of barred trains in the evening peak. Good innit?

Cheers,

Barry