Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

On Sun, 17 Nov 2013 11:22:21 +0000, Arthur Figgis
wrote:
They were last year! Having checked the usual travel sources for
gen
before going, we pre-booked a cab, which I can recommend, if only
for it
taking about 30 min to the city rather than about three weeks by
bus or
having to negotiate the lack of information, spiked pits etc to
reach
the rumoured train.

The train, while advertised at the station, did not actually exist
when we went.

Neil

--
Neil Williams. Use neil before the at to reply.

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

In message , at 11:58:05 on Sun,
17 Nov 2013, Ken Wheatley remarked:
Best to head to the H&C & Circle platform - no need to change in
order to get to KXSP (plus the option of the H&C to Whitechapel -
though that does feel as though it'd going out of the way somewhat,
but I guess it probably wouldn't take that much longer).

Heading for the H&C platform requires you to walk most of the way back
to Heathrow these days.

Indeed, it's a good example of modern station rebuilding practice.
"Whatever else you do, you must make people walk twice as far".
--
Roland Perry

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

In article ,
(Neil Williams) wrote:

On Sun, 17 Nov 2013 11:58:05 +0000, Ken Wheatley
wrote:

Heading for the H&C platform requires you to walk most of the way back
to Heathrow these days.

Only if you go to the concourse first. You can go straight there
from any platform.

It's rather counter-intuitive to head for the back of the train at a
terminal station. Catches 'em every time.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

On 16/11/2013 18:39, Roland Perry wrote:

will be some blurring at the edges, but you'd probably be surprised the
number of people whose immediate reaction on arriving at a foreign (as
in both overseas and unfamiliar) airport is to head for the taxi rank.

And also the number of "official" sources of information which assume
that anyone arriving at an airport will (or at least ought to) get a
taxi. There seems to be an attitude that if you can afford to fly, you
can afford a cab.

It is also odd how many foreign taxi meters don't work, despite all the
modern technology...

--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message

, at 16:24:21 on Fri, 15 Nov 2013, Recliner
remarked:

Of course, they will have to stop giving "free" rides from T123 to T4
(etc)

The latter won't work, as it's a fundamental requirement for Heathrow in
the modern age to be able to move passengers from one terminal to
another free of charge.

But not necessarily by underground train -- lots of airports use
inter-terminal buses, as does Heathrow for air-side movements.

Indeed, but Heathrow's layout means that using buses is extremely
inefficient and slow. It would be a major new fleet and an expensive
operation to run. Far simpler just to let the passengers use the trains,
given that the trains are already there.

How many people actually take advantage of this (airside) free transport?

I did it once so that I could sample the train (I have never had the need to
use it for a paid for journey)

I was the only passenger to get on at T123, did I just choose a slack period
or is this "one person every 15 minutes" demand normal?

tim

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message , at
12:02:55 on Sat, 16 Nov 2013, Neil Williams
remarked:
Couldn't they just issue free tickets for use between the terminals that
are only available at the terminals? Perhaps only valid for half an hour
or something.

Which would be used as free ways around paying the extra! Didn't get on
at Heathrow mate!

Difficult if only issued airside.

why would someone airside want to make a free transfer land side, they would
surely use the airside bus?

The need for the free landside transfer is for passengers who have arrived
at a (e.g) the central terminal by bus and need to get T4/5. In the old
days long distance buses used to serve all terminals, but they no longer do
that


I don't see why Oyster should have any problems with a higher non zonal
fare, in any case. It manages Watford Junction OK, which is in exactly
that situation,

I think they are about to (or maybe have) run out of "extra Zones" that
the Oyster system can cope with. Not 640k RAM, or 4 billion IPv4 addresses
this time, but "only ?16 zones".


So they'll just have to be more careful how they allocate them then

The idea that the zones beyond Z6 on the line to X needs to be different to
the line beyond zone 6 on the line to Y is just nuts. Make then all Z7/8/9.
Ok some one passenger in 100 million is going to save 50p on a ride from
Essex to Herts, big deal!

tim

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message , at
14:36:40 on Sat, 16 Nov 2013, Neil Williams
remarked:
But not likely to be used enough to be a worry. A ticket check on
leaving Heathrow would catch a lot of the offenders.

True. But then no need for any barriers.

Barriers are good because a full ticket check isn't comprehensive, it's
there to deter people.

And of course the MAD scenario is only people *arriving* at the airport.

Not sure what you mean by this, of course it's only for people arriving at
the airport (otherwise they'd be at some other station).

But it does work both for passengers arriving by air (and hence starting
their rail journey) and those arriving by train (and thus completing their
rail journey).

The point about the station at MAD is that it is the only one on the network
that has ticket controlled exit barriers. The rest of the network has entry
only controls, as the normal fixed price single fare always pays for that
journey. At MAD underground station you can only get into, or out of, the
station if you have purchased a premium "airport" ticket (either as a full
single or an add-on). You can "ride through" track side with a normal
ticket. And you can even: stand on the station inner concourse and watch
all the bemused people wondering why the can't get out with they "normal
ticket, with a normal ticket (if you see what I mean).

tim



--
Roland Perry

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

On Sun, 17 Nov 2013 06:35:40 -0600,
wrote:
It's rather counter-intuitive to head for the back of the train at
a
terminal station. Catches 'em every time.

True. It'd also be nice if they would reopen the old bridge with
some sort of one way system, it's rather a bottleneck at present.

Neil

--
Neil Williams. Use neil before the at to reply.

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

"Neil Williams" wrote in message
. net...
On Fri, 15 Nov 2013 18:31:01 +0000, Roland Perry
wrote:
Only if Crossrail goes non-stop to Heathrow from Paddington, and
accepts
Travelcards/Oyster.

Paddington is in the middle of nowhere in London terms, hence why the Picc
Line is often still a viable choice.

I agree.

Whatever the Oracle Perry thinks, starting from many places in London, the
aggro of detouring to Padd by underground, then walking to an over ground
platform isn't worth the aggro for the time saving on the overall journey,
even if there wasn't a 400% premium on the price, but there's that as well!

HEx is only the first choice for people who are going to complete their
journey by Taxi, (on foot) or who need to get to a location that would go
past Padd anyway.

tim

Piccadilly line 'bustitution' to Heathrow this weekend
 

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message 2013111610301056084-nospam@nospamcom, at 10:30:10 on Sat, 16
Nov 2013, eastender remarked:
HEx is only intended as a replacement for taxis (ie for people who had
it not existed would have taken a taxi), it's not in competition with
any other rail-based modes.

Not really - HEx is still half the price of a taxi unless you share a cab.
I got it last week for the first time in a while and was surprised to find
the fare as high as £20 (for some reason I had £14 one way in my mind).
But isn't a taxi to Westminster about £40 at least?

How they choose to set the fare has little to do with the business
objective, which was entirely about replacing taxis (in the vicinity of
Heathrow towards London; taxis onward from Paddington are not affected).

I don't think that it was,

ISTR that business objective was to provide a high speed service into London
and the proximity to taxi prices in setting the fares was the way that they
made it financially viable (given that there is no made up, funny money,
economic benefit paying for it).

I don't recall reducing the number of taxis at the airport ever being an
"objective".

tim