Mizter T wrote:
On 04/03/2015 16:29, d wrote:

On Wed, 04 Mar 2015 16:02:12 +0000
Paul Corfield wrote:
Clearly there are several places where there are crossovers but the
intensity of the service is such that you'd probably have trains at

I'm not sure I'd describe the service as "intense". One train every 3 to 5
minutes (in reality, never mind the timetable) is hardly at victoria line
levels.

The other difficulty will be the ripple effect if Overground trains
are forced to sit still on shared sections of track thereby buggering
up Southern and South Eastern services into London Bridge / Victoria /
Blackfriars. Services into London Bridge are regularly a complete
disaster and that has transferred vast numbers on to London Overground
and Jubilee Line services.

Was a stupid idea to extend onto NR tracks anyway as it means the overground
timetable is frequently up the bloody spout. One of the reasons I gave up
using it along with the nonsensical reversing of 2 out of 3 trains at Dalston
so providing a **** poor service to Highbury where 80% of northbound passangers
actually want to go.

IME the Overground timetable is not "frequently up the bloody spout".

Indeed, and at 95.5%, it has the joint second highest PPM (punctuality)
moving average of all the operators in the country. Its moving average
cancellation and significant lateness (CaSL) figure, a measure of
reliability, is also one of the best at 1.8% (only c2c, Chiltern and HEx
are slightly better). That's not bad, considering that it shares lines with
LU, freight and lower performing TOCs.

See http://www.networkrail.co.uk/about/performance/

On Wed, 04 Mar 2015 16:35:29 +0000
Mizter T wrote:
On 04/03/2015 16:29, d wrote:

On Wed, 04 Mar 2015 16:02:12 +0000
Paul Corfield wrote:
Clearly there are several places where there are crossovers but the
intensity of the service is such that you'd probably have trains at

I'm not sure I'd describe the service as "intense". One train every 3 to 5
minutes (in reality, never mind the timetable) is hardly at victoria line
levels.

The other difficulty will be the ripple effect if Overground trains
are forced to sit still on shared sections of track thereby buggering
up Southern and South Eastern services into London Bridge / Victoria /
Blackfriars. Services into London Bridge are regularly a complete
disaster and that has transferred vast numbers on to London Overground
and Jubilee Line services.

Was a stupid idea to extend onto NR tracks anyway as it means the overground
timetable is frequently up the bloody spout. One of the reasons I gave up
using it along with the nonsensical reversing of 2 out of 3 trains at Dalston
so providing a **** poor service to Highbury where 80% of northbound
passangers
actually want to go.

IME the Overground timetable is not "frequently up the bloody spout".

And how often do you use it? I used it every almost every weekday for about a
month and the service was appalling. Plus they had a nice habit of running
"fast" trains to highbury when the service really was screwed which nicely
****ed over the people who were waiting at Dalston having taken a reverser
there.

--
Spud

wrote:
On Wed, 04 Mar 2015 16:35:29 +0000
Mizter T wrote:
On 04/03/2015 16:29, d wrote:

On Wed, 04 Mar 2015 16:02:12 +0000
Paul Corfield wrote:
Clearly there are several places where there are crossovers but the
intensity of the service is such that you'd probably have trains at

I'm not sure I'd describe the service as "intense". One train every 3 to 5
minutes (in reality, never mind the timetable) is hardly at victoria line
levels.

The other difficulty will be the ripple effect if Overground trains
are forced to sit still on shared sections of track thereby buggering
up Southern and South Eastern services into London Bridge / Victoria /
Blackfriars. Services into London Bridge are regularly a complete
disaster and that has transferred vast numbers on to London Overground
and Jubilee Line services.

Was a stupid idea to extend onto NR tracks anyway as it means the overground
timetable is frequently up the bloody spout. One of the reasons I gave up
using it along with the nonsensical reversing of 2 out of 3 trains at Dalston
so providing a **** poor service to Highbury where 80% of northbound
passangers
actually want to go.

IME the Overground timetable is not "frequently up the bloody spout".

And how often do you use it? I used it every almost every weekday for about a
month and the service was appalling. Plus they had a nice habit of running
"fast" trains to highbury when the service really was screwed which nicely
****ed over the people who were waiting at Dalston having taken a reverser
there.

I thought you told us you used the quicker Victoria line option?

On Wed, 4 Mar 2015 16:53:37 +0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
Mizter T wrote:
IME the Overground timetable is not "frequently up the bloody spout".

Indeed, and at 95.5%, it has the joint second highest PPM (punctuality)
moving average of all the operators in the country. Its moving average
cancellation and significant lateness (CaSL) figure, a measure of
reliability, is also one of the best at 1.8% (only c2c, Chiltern and HEx
are slightly better). That's not bad, considering that it shares lines with
LU, freight and lower performing TOCs.

See http://www.networkrail.co.uk/about/performance/

Well if the statistics say its great then obviously I was just imagining
waiting 10-15 minutes for a highbury train on numerous occasions or waiting
*at* highbury for any train at all.

It should have remained a tube line. Linking it into the NR network was just
asking for problems. If it was a self contained tube line it could have had a
much better service frequency in the central section and since everyone thinks
closing the moorgate branch on thameslink was no big deal since everyone can
hope on the tube - the same logic applies, right? People from south london
could hope out at new cross (gate) and change.

--
Spud

In article , (Mizter T) wrote:

On 04/03/2015 16:29, d wrote:

Was a stupid idea to extend onto NR tracks anyway as it means the
overground timetable is frequently up the bloody spout. One of the
reasons I gave up using it along with the nonsensical reversing of 2 out
of 3 trains at Dalston so providing a **** poor service to Highbury
where 80% of northbound passangers actually want to go.

IME the Overground timetable is not "frequently up the bloody spout".

And isn't it 1 in 2 that reverse at Dalston Junction?

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In article , (Mizter T) wrote:

On 03/03/2015 18:31, eastender wrote:
One faulty train at Hoxton has knocked out the entire Highbury-New
Cross-Clapham-West Croydon-Crystal Place network.

I received the following email from TfL this afternoon, with the
subject of"London Overground services yesterday evening":

---quote---
Dear Mizter T,

I am writing to apologise for the major disruption to London
Overground services yesterday evening, Tuesday 3 March.

Our services were significantly disrupted by a southbound train
failure at Hoxton on the Highbury & Islington to Clapham Junction
line. As a result, many trains were cancelled or delayed.

We are examining the train to find the root cause of the failure and
what can be done to prevent such significant disruption happening
again.

As this fault was within our control, you can apply for a service
delay refund. You must do this within the next 13 days. For more
information, please visit tfl.gov.uk/refunds


Yours sincerely,
Mike Stubbs
Director London Overground, Transport for London
---quote---

How did they know you were affected? Did you email them?

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On 04/03/2015 17:14, d wrote:

On Wed, 04 Mar 2015 16:35:29 +0000
Mizter T wrote:
[...]
Was a stupid idea to extend onto NR tracks anyway as it means the overground
timetable is frequently up the bloody spout. One of the reasons I gave up
using it along with the nonsensical reversing of 2 out of 3 trains at Dalston
so providing a **** poor service to Highbury where 80% of northbound
passangers actually want to go.

IME the Overground timetable is not "frequently up the bloody spout".

And how often do you use it? I used it every almost every weekday for about a
month and the service was appalling. Plus they had a nice habit of running
"fast" trains to highbury when the service really was screwed which nicely
****ed over the people who were waiting at Dalston having taken a reverser
there.

I use it regularly.

wrote:

In article , (Mizter
T) wrote:

On 03/03/2015 18:31, eastender wrote:
One faulty train at Hoxton has knocked out the entire Highbury-New
Cross-Clapham-West Croydon-Crystal Place network.

I received the following email from TfL this afternoon, with the
subject of"London Overground services yesterday evening":

---quote---
Dear Mizter T,

I am writing to apologise for the major disruption to London
Overground services yesterday evening, Tuesday 3 March.

Our services were significantly disrupted by a southbound train
failure at Hoxton on the Highbury & Islington to Clapham Junction
line. As a result, many trains were cancelled or delayed.

We are examining the train to find the root cause of the failure
and what can be done to prevent such significant disruption
happening again.

As this fault was within our control, you can apply for a service
delay refund. You must do this within the next 13 days. For more
information, please visit tfl.gov.uk/refunds


Yours sincerely,
Mike Stubbs
Director London Overground, Transport for London
---quote---

How did they know you were affected? Did you email them?

I assume it is based on Oyster records?

Peter Smyth

On 04/03/2015 17:57, wrote:

In article , (Mizter T) wrote:

On 03/03/2015 18:31, eastender wrote:
One faulty train at Hoxton has knocked out the entire Highbury-New
Cross-Clapham-West Croydon-Crystal Place network.

I received the following email from TfL this afternoon, with the
subject of"London Overground services yesterday evening":

---quote---
Dear Mizter T,

I am writing to apologise for the major disruption to London
Overground services yesterday evening, Tuesday 3 March.

Our services were significantly disrupted by a southbound train
failure at Hoxton on the Highbury & Islington to Clapham Junction
line. As a result, many trains were cancelled or delayed.

We are examining the train to find the root cause of the failure and
what can be done to prevent such significant disruption happening
again.

As this fault was within our control, you can apply for a service
delay refund. You must do this within the next 13 days. For more
information, please visit tfl.gov.uk/refunds


Yours sincerely,
Mike Stubbs
Director London Overground, Transport for London
---quote---

How did they know you were affected? Did you email them?


No - and I wasn't affected. I should have said, it was sent to the email
address registered with my Oyster/contactless online account. I assume
my travel history flagged me up as a user - similar targetted mailshots
happens with other disruptions and sometimes planned works too on other
lines or bus routes.

On Wednesday, 4 March 2015 17:22:31 UTC, wrote:
On Wed, 4 Mar 2015 16:53:37 +0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
Mizter T wrote:
IME the Overground timetable is not "frequently up the bloody spout".

Indeed, and at 95.5%, it has the joint second highest PPM (punctuality)
moving average of all the operators in the country. Its moving average
cancellation and significant lateness (CaSL) figure, a measure of
reliability, is also one of the best at 1.8% (only c2c, Chiltern and HEx
are slightly better). That's not bad, considering that it shares lines with
LU, freight and lower performing TOCs.

See http://www.networkrail.co.uk/about/performance/

Well if the statistics say its great then obviously I was just imagining
waiting 10-15 minutes for a highbury train on numerous occasions or waiting
*at* highbury for any train at all.

It should have remained a tube line. Linking it into the NR network was just
asking for problems. If it was a self contained tube line it could have had a
much better service frequency in the central section and since everyone thinks
closing the moorgate branch on thameslink was no big deal since everyone can
hope on the tube - the same logic applies, right? People from south london
could hope out at new cross (gate) and change.

1. It was an infrequent, slow "tube" line. Without the extra passengers gained by
extra destinations there'd have been no justification for increased frequency - new
routes open up latent demand.

2. If it was rebranded back to London Underground, it wouldn't magically speed up.
It's an old and slow route, quite similar to parts of the District Line really.

2. People wouldn't change in massive numbers at New Cross Gate - they didn't
to the old East London Line.

3. Even if they did, New Cross Gate station wouldn't be able to cope with that
amount of interchange (even after rebuilding is complete)

4. Capacity and number of services at London Bridge are very reduced until 2018.
Overground via Canada Water has become the common route for stations between
Norwood Junction and New Cross Gate. That's not just passenger choice - in the
peaks the London Bridge service to these stations is now next to non-existent. (There
isn't a single southbound non-Overground train at Sydenham between 16:20 and
18:20, for example.)

5. We've really done this one to death now, surely?