Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

I remember a few years back there was talk of the line from MHE being
extended to Copthall Stadium. Mind you , this has been put forward plenty
of times in the past. Was this just people chucking ideas about or was/is
there a real project for this currently on hold?

B2003

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Boltar wrote:
I remember a few years back there was talk of the line from MHE being
extended to Copthall Stadium. Mind you , this has been put forward
plenty of times in the past. Was this just people chucking ideas
about or was/is there a real project for this currently on hold?

B2003

As I remember it, this was purely a proposal by the loacal authority, LB of
Barnet. LU immediately refuted the idea, claiming it had not done the
necessary research, and that most of the original track had been built over.
I don't think that it was ever a real starter.

--
Lawrence Myers
Remove numbers,if present, from address to reply.

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Subject: Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?

it would help you if you can see a copy of the Tube map for 1937.........p46

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

"Lawrence Myers" wrote in message
...
Boltar wrote:
I remember a few years back there was talk of the line from MHE being
extended to Copthall Stadium. Mind you , this has been put forward
plenty of times in the past. Was this just people chucking ideas
about or was/is there a real project for this currently on hold?

B2003

As I remember it, this was purely a proposal by the loacal authority, LB
of
Barnet. LU immediately refuted the idea, claiming it had not done the
necessary research, and that most of the original track had been built
over.
I don't think that it was ever a real starter.

--
Lawrence Myers
Remove numbers,if present, from address to reply.

I was at the London Transport Museum at Covent Garden today and their tube
train on display has the destination Bushey Heath !!! Can post photo on
alt.binaries.pictures.rail if wanted.
Cheerz,
Baz

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Marratxi wrote:
"Lawrence Myers" wrote in message
...
Boltar wrote:
I remember a few years back there was talk of the line from MHE
being extended to Copthall Stadium. Mind you , this has been put
forward plenty of times in the past. Was this just people chucking
ideas about or was/is there a real project for this currently on
hold?

B2003

As I remember it, this was purely a proposal by the loacal
authority, LB of Barnet. LU immediately refuted the idea, claiming
it had not done the necessary research, and that most of the
original track had been built over. I don't think that it was ever a
real starter.

--
Lawrence Myers
Remove numbers,if present, from address to reply.

I was at the London Transport Museum at Covent Garden today and their
tube train on display has the destination Bushey Heath !!! Can post
photo on alt.binaries.pictures.rail if wanted.
Cheerz,
Baz

That was something completely different. In late 1930's there was a plan to
extend Edgware Branch northward to Elstree & Bushey Heath. Prelimiary
building work took place in Edgware and bridge butresses are still visible
from A41. This was abandoned on outbreak of WWII, and never resurrected.

The route being discussed here is the old goods line (orginally passenger)
from Mill Hill East, past Mill Hill (The Hale) to a separate station in
Edgware. It went past the site of the present Copthall Stadium.



--
Lawrence Myers
Remove numbers,if present, from address to reply.

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:34:50 -0000, "Marratxi"
wrote:

I was at the London Transport Museum at Covent Garden today and their tube
train on display has the destination Bushey Heath !!! Can post photo on
alt.binaries.pictures.rail if wanted.

In Jim Blake's book "Northern Wastes", essential reading for anybody
interested in this topic, there is a picture of a 1938 tube stock
train at Highgate showing Bushey Heath - photographed in 1987.

The destination plates for 1938 stock were made before the extension
was abandoned and never changed - most abandoned extensions could be
displayed it required.


--
Bill Hayles

http://billnot.com

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Unless I'm very much mistaken, it was Bill Hayles
), in message
who said:
On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 21:34:50 -0000, "Marratxi"
wrote:

I was at the London Transport Museum at Covent Garden today and
their tube train on display has the destination Bushey Heath !!! Can
post photo on alt.binaries.pictures.rail if wanted.

In Jim Blake's book "Northern Wastes", essential reading for anybody
interested in this topic, there is a picture of a 1938 tube stock
train at Highgate showing Bushey Heath - photographed in 1987.

The destination plates for 1938 stock were made before the extension
was abandoned and never changed - most abandoned extensions could be
displayed it required.


Further to this, I can also recommend Jim's annual walking tours of the
'Northern Heights' branches.

Very enlightening. And, ahem, ironic.

BTN

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

I think this idea arose from the possible need for Barnet Football
Club to relocate to Copthall Stadium, preferably at somebody else's
expense. The Football Club saga goes on (don't ask) but not, for
the moment, at Copthall

Jeremy Parker

"Boltar" wrote in message
om...
I remember a few years back there was talk of the line from MHE
being
extended to Copthall Stadium. Mind you , this has been put forward
plenty
of times in the past. Was this just people chucking ideas about or
was/is
there a real project for this currently on hold?

B2003

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

"Lawrence Myers" wrote in message ...

That was something completely different. In late 1930's there was a plan to
extend Edgware Branch northward to Elstree & Bushey Heath. Prelimiary
building work took place in Edgware and bridge butresses are still visible
from A41. This was abandoned on outbreak of WWII, and never resurrected.

The route being discussed here is the old goods line (orginally passenger)
from Mill Hill East, past Mill Hill (The Hale) to a separate station in
Edgware. It went past the site of the present Copthall Stadium.

A separate station in Edgware? I'm pretty sure it was intended to be
the same station in Edgware, with a junction between the two lines
immediately south-east of the station. Two of the platforms at Edgware
station are obviously placed to permit extension of the line under the
street, and you can (I think) still see the route of the line to Mill
Hill curving off to the left as you leave the station on the existing
Northern Line.

The Northern Line was roughly planned to have run from Bushey Heath to
Edgware, bifurcated into two routes from there to Camden Town, joined
up there, bifurcated again into two routes from there to Kennington,
and joined up again for the run to Morden. Oh, and there would have
been a route from Moorgate to High Barnet via Finsbury Park that
paralleled the Northern Line between East Finchley and Finchley
Central.

Imagine Celia: "This station is Edgware. This train terminates at
Kennington via Finchley Central and Charing Cross. Change here for the
Golders Green branch. The next station is Mill Hill (The Hale)."

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Subject: Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?

In 1937 the Northen "New" Line was going from MORGATE [then as now to] FIBSBURY
PARK.......STROUD GREEN -CROUCH END-HIGHGATE [INTERCHANGE WITH HIGH BARNET
LINE] -CRANLEY GARDENS-MUSWELL HILL- ALEXANDER PALACE= the
other line was planed to be...........MILL HILL EAST-MILLHILL [The Hale]
-EDGEWARE [as now] then BROCKLEY HILL-ELSTREE SOUTH-BUSHEY HEATH.= hope this
helps...P46

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

"Ben Nunn" wrote in message
...
Unless I'm very much mistaken, it was Bill Hayles

Further to this, I can also recommend Jim's annual walking tours of the
'Northern Heights' branches.

Very enlightening. And, ahem, ironic.

BTN

I have heard about these tours but how can we find out when and where, etc.
?
Cheerz,
Baz

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

In article , Alistair
Bell writes
A separate station in Edgware? I'm pretty sure it was intended to be
the same station in Edgware, with a junction between the two lines
immediately south-east of the station.

There were two stations in Edgwa Edgware LNER and Edgware LER.

The Golders Green branch ran, and runs, to Edgware LER.

The Mill Hill branch ran to Edgware LNER. As part of the Northern
Heights work, passenger trains would have been diverted to Edgware LER
and thence Bushey Heath. Goods trains would have continued to use
Edgware LNER.

The Northern Line was roughly planned to have run
[...]

The planned service patterns we
- Kennington to Bushey Heath via Finchley and Charing Cross
- Kennington to High Barnet via Charing Cross
- Morden to Archway via Bank, extended to Finchley Central in the peaks
- Moorgate to East Finchley, extended to High Barnet in the peaks
- Moorgate to Alexandra Palace
- Moorgate to Finsbury Park tube (peak only)
- assorted services to Edgware via Golders Green

Trains on the two main routes from Moorgate would have coupled at
Highgate.

--
Clive D.W. Feather, writing for himself | Home:
Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org
Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work:
Written on my laptop; please observe the Reply-To address

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 16:59:04 +0000, "Clive D. W. Feather"
wrote:



Trains on the two main routes from Moorgate would have coupled at
Highgate.

ITYM "connected". Attempts at coupling would have been interesting,
to say the least.

--
Bill Hayles

http://billnot.com

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

In article , Bill Hayles
writes
Trains on the two main routes from Moorgate would have coupled at
Highgate.
ITYM "connected". Attempts at coupling would have been interesting,
to say the least.

No, coupled. Just like on the big railway.

--
Clive D.W. Feather, writing for himself | Home:
Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org
Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work:
Written on my laptop; please observe the Reply-To address

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Clive D. W. Feather wrote:
In article , Bill Hayles
writes
Trains on the two main routes from Moorgate would have coupled at
Highgate.
ITYM "connected". Attempts at coupling would have been interesting,
to say the least.

No, coupled. Just like on the big railway.

I think Bill is pointing out that the vertical difference between the two
lines at Highgate make that a bit of a problem. If coupling was going to be
performed it would most likely have been at Finchley Central as at East
Finchley the lines join north of the platforms.


--
Cheers for now,

John from Harrow, Middx

remove spamnocars to reply

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

In article , John
Shelley writes
Trains on the two main routes from Moorgate would have coupled at
Highgate.
ITYM "connected". Attempts at coupling would have been interesting,
to say the least.
No, coupled. Just like on the big railway.
I think Bill is pointing out that the vertical difference between the two
lines at Highgate make that a bit of a problem.

In which case, both you and Bill are misunderstanding.

Train departs Moorgate, runs via Drayton Park, Finsbury Park (high
level), to Highgate High Level. Splits.
* One part turns right at Park Junction and heads to Ally Pally.
* The other part goes straight ahead and continues to East Finchley (or,
in the peaks, High Barnet).
Reverse the process for southbound trains.

I said "two routes *from* Moorgate".

--
Clive D.W. Feather, writing for himself | Home:
Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org
Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work:
Written on my laptop; please observe the Reply-To address

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Clive D. W. Feather wrote:

I said "two routes *from* Moorgate".

I'd been considering routes from Moorgate (GN&C) and Moorgate (City Branch)
to a common destination. You didn't state to different destinations did
you?

I think we can agree that both were correct.


--
Cheers for now,

John from Harrow, Middx

remove spamnocars to reply

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

Clive D. W. Feather wrote:

John Shelley writes
Trains on the two main routes from Moorgate would have coupled at
Highgate.
ITYM "connected". Attempts at coupling would have been interesting,
to say the least.
No, coupled. Just like on the big railway.
I think Bill is pointing out that the vertical difference between the two
lines at Highgate make that a bit of a problem.

In which case, both you and Bill are misunderstanding.

Train departs Moorgate, runs via Drayton Park, Finsbury Park (high
level), to Highgate High Level. Splits.
* One part turns right at Park Junction and heads to Ally Pally.
* The other part goes straight ahead and continues to East Finchley (or,
in the peaks, High Barnet).
Reverse the process for southbound trains.

I said "two routes *from* Moorgate".

Sorry to be so pedantic, but wouldn't those have *un*coupled at Highgate?

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 22:29:48 +0000, "Clive D. W. Feather"
wrote:


In which case, both you and Bill are misunderstanding.

Yes, I was. Apologies

Train departs Moorgate, runs via Drayton Park, Finsbury Park (high
level), to Highgate High Level. Splits.
* One part turns right at Park Junction and heads to Ally Pally.
* The other part goes straight ahead and continues to East Finchley (or,
in the peaks, High Barnet).
Reverse the process for southbound trains.

Although it's the first I've heard of this idea. AFAIK, it isn't
mentioned in Northern Wastes, which talks of fourteen trains per
hour from Moorgate via Finsbury Park, seven of which would go to
High Barnet and the other seven to Alexandra Palace.

Knowing you, I'm sure you have source for this. Can you let me know
what it is so that I can read up for myself. For various reasons,
not least an early childhood memory of a steam trip to Alexandra
Palace, this is one of my favourite topics.



--
Bill Hayles

http://billnot.com

Whatever happened to the Mill Hill East extension?
 

In article , Bill Hayles
writes
Train departs Moorgate, runs via Drayton Park, Finsbury Park (high
level), to Highgate High Level. Splits.
* One part turns right at Park Junction and heads to Ally Pally.
* The other part goes straight ahead and continues to East Finchley (or,
in the peaks, High Barnet).
Reverse the process for southbound trains.

Although it's the first I've heard of this idea. AFAIK, it isn't
mentioned in Northern Wastes, which talks of fourteen trains per
hour from Moorgate via Finsbury Park, seven of which would go to
High Barnet and the other seven to Alexandra Palace.

Knowing you, I'm sure you have source for this.

I certainly did, but I can't right now locate it. This makes me think it
might have been in Underground News (which I don't keep).

--
Clive D.W. Feather, writing for himself | Home:
Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org
Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work:
Written on my laptop; please observe the Reply-To address