Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 18 Aug 2016 13:29:54 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:


"Recliner" wrote in message
...
tim... wrote:

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message
-sept
ember.org, at 09:14:01 on Thu, 18 Aug 2016, Recliner
remarked:

"True independent contractors have the freedom to decide when they
want
to
work and what kind of work they want to do," Benjamin Sachs, a
Harvard
Law
School professor told CNNMoney. "By giving drivers timeouts, Uber is
exercising the kind of control over its workforce that employers
exercise
over employees."

I thought the whole point of Uber from a drivers point of view was
being
able to work flexible hours and/or part time.

well I think that they can, in the sense that they can choose what
shift
times to work this week

The issue seems to be around not accepting particular rides when
self-declared "on shift".

Though the post that Recliner made was about poolriding.

Complaint was, it's more effort for no more money.

I find that very strange. I though the MO of Uber was that all of the
billing, less some percentage commission goes to the driver (the same
as
the
hotel booking sites for instance). So if the billing goes up because
three
pool riders are sharing, then so should the amount that the driver
gets.

If Uber have structured this deal so that they get to keep all of the
extra
income (whilst incurring the driver in extra expense of the
pick-up/set-downs), them my like of Uber has gone down even more (by a
couple of notches).

You already hated Uber with a deep passion,

No, I hate it's business model

What do you hate about its business model?

I have already told you, several times

Do you even know what it
is?

Just because I have no idea how a "pick up" works, doesn't mean that I know
nothing about the operation of the rest of the company.

The pick-up is an insignificant part of the whole.

despite manifestly knowing
nothing about it.

I know lots about it

Really? It's not apparent from your posts.

Why is it my fault that you cannot read?

tim

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

tim... wrote:

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 18 Aug 2016 13:29:54 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:


"Recliner" wrote in message
...
tim... wrote:

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message
-sept
ember.org, at 09:14:01 on Thu, 18 Aug 2016, Recliner
remarked:

"True independent contractors have the freedom to decide when they
want
to
work and what kind of work they want to do," Benjamin Sachs, a
Harvard
Law
School professor told CNNMoney. "By giving drivers timeouts, Uber is
exercising the kind of control over its workforce that employers
exercise
over employees."

I thought the whole point of Uber from a drivers point of view was
being
able to work flexible hours and/or part time.

well I think that they can, in the sense that they can choose what
shift
times to work this week

The issue seems to be around not accepting particular rides when
self-declared "on shift".

Though the post that Recliner made was about poolriding.

Complaint was, it's more effort for no more money.

I find that very strange. I though the MO of Uber was that all of the
billing, less some percentage commission goes to the driver (the same
as
the
hotel booking sites for instance). So if the billing goes up because
three
pool riders are sharing, then so should the amount that the driver
gets.

If Uber have structured this deal so that they get to keep all of the
extra
income (whilst incurring the driver in extra expense of the
pick-up/set-downs), them my like of Uber has gone down even more (by a
couple of notches).

You already hated Uber with a deep passion,

No, I hate it's business model

What do you hate about its business model?

I have already told you, several times

No, you've told us that you hate it with a deep passionate. You haven't
explained why. All the reasons you've provided have been incorrect.



Do you even know what it
is?

Just because I have no idea how a "pick up" works, doesn't mean that I know
nothing about the operation of the rest of the company.

You don't seem to know anything about the company except that you hate it.


The pick-up is an insignificant part of the whole.

despite manifestly knowing
nothing about it.

I know lots about it

Really? It's not apparent from your posts.

Why is it my fault that you cannot read?

I think your problem is that we can all read your posts perfectly well.

It was all too apparent that you didn't know who Uber competed with, why
people do or don't choose to use it, how they use it, why blind people are
very unlikely to have Uber accounts, and why choosing to attack Uber for
its record keeping would be very foolish. You seemed to think that Uber's
main problem was with its customer service, rather than how it treats its
drivers.

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
tim... wrote:

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 18 Aug 2016 13:29:54 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:


"Recliner" wrote in message
...
tim... wrote:

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message
-sept
ember.org, at 09:14:01 on Thu, 18 Aug 2016, Recliner
remarked:

"True independent contractors have the freedom to decide when they
want
to
work and what kind of work they want to do," Benjamin Sachs, a
Harvard
Law
School professor told CNNMoney. "By giving drivers timeouts, Uber
is
exercising the kind of control over its workforce that employers
exercise
over employees."

I thought the whole point of Uber from a drivers point of view was
being
able to work flexible hours and/or part time.

well I think that they can, in the sense that they can choose what
shift
times to work this week

The issue seems to be around not accepting particular rides when
self-declared "on shift".

Though the post that Recliner made was about poolriding.

Complaint was, it's more effort for no more money.

I find that very strange. I though the MO of Uber was that all of
the
billing, less some percentage commission goes to the driver (the same
as
the
hotel booking sites for instance). So if the billing goes up because
three
pool riders are sharing, then so should the amount that the driver
gets.

If Uber have structured this deal so that they get to keep all of the
extra
income (whilst incurring the driver in extra expense of the
pick-up/set-downs), them my like of Uber has gone down even more (by
a
couple of notches).

You already hated Uber with a deep passion,

No, I hate it's business model

What do you hate about its business model?

I have already told you, several times

No, you've told us that you hate it with a deep passionate. You haven't
explained why.

Oh yes I have!

All the reasons you've provided have been incorrect.

as I have already told you:

just because you think that my reasons aren't correct doesn't make my belief
that they are, an invalid reason for using them to dislike the company's
business model.

And in any case, I dispute your claim that they are incorrect. You haven't
presented a single piece of evidence that they are, just continually
asserted your position - that doesn't make you right, you aren't God.

You don't win an argument by simply repeating "no it isn't, no it isn't, no
it isn't, which so far, is all that you have done

Your position is built on sand and has no credibility whatsoever

I'm fed up with you cheating here

conversation over

tim

I'm sure that has been their plan from day one. Whether
customers will enjoy riding in cars without drivers in
another matter. As is whether customers will approve of
large numbers of people being effectively made redundant
merely so a high-tech firm can make billions for itself and
its backers.

The public mood has changed a lot in recent years, and I
wouldn't be surprised if customers switched to a cab firm
which provided the app-based facilities combined with cars
with drivers.

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 09:50:19AM -0000, Recliner wrote:

Uber is more likely to be used by people who are out and about. Once a
driver has been assigned, Uber sends the client a description of the car,
and it's up to the customer to identify it and get in.

The app notifies you shortly before the driver arrives. If you don't
make yourself obvious to the driver quickly then IME he phones you.

Someone getting a mini cab from home is more likely to phone their local
firm,

Are they? I certainly don't, partly because Uber are cheaper and
quicker, partly because the app is more convenient.

which will be cheaper

IME Uber is cheaper than a local cab office.

and more likely to have a car available locally.

At least where I live Uber has sufficiently good coverage that they're
actually more likely to have a car available quickly than the local cab
office.

They will also accept pre-bookings, which Uber does not.

Yes, that's the only reason I ever use any cab company other than Uber
now.

--
David Cantrell | Official London Perl Mongers Bad Influence

European immigration: making Britain great since AD43

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

On Wed, Aug 17, 2016 at 01:26:03PM +0100, Recliner wrote:

One obvious reason: it's more expensive

IME Uber is cheaper than a local minicab company by around 25%.

especially at 'surge' times.

OK, I'll grant you that. They're rare though.

- Second reason: it's less likely to have cars available locally in
residential areas (just like black cabs).

Wrong. There are four, right now, within 500 yards of my flat.

- Third reason: you have to have a smart phone, with a signal/wi-fi
access (which is why very few blind people will have an Uber account).

The blind people I know actually find a smart phone more useful than a
dumb phone.

- Fourth reason: you have to have an Uber account before you can use
it, and Uber's app installed on your smart phone.

Well duh. And how long does it take to install and set up? Not very long
at all. It certainly takes less time than it does to find a local
minicab office if you don't know the area.

You only have to do it once though. I did it while waiting ages for a
normal minicab to become available at a cab office in Balham.

--
David Cantrell | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david

The test of the goodness of a thing is its fitness for use. If it
fails on this first test, no amount of ornamentation or finish will
make it any better, it will only make it more expensive and foolish.
-- Frank Pick, lecture to the Design and Industries Assoc, 1916

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

On Wed, 24 Aug 2016 13:55:08 +0100
David Cantrell wrote:
- Third reason: you have to have a smart phone, with a signal/wi-fi
access (which is why very few blind people will have an Uber account).

The blind people I know actually find a smart phone more useful than a
dumb phone.

Oh really? And how exactly do they operate a touchscreen, press it randomly
and hope for the best?

- Fourth reason: you have to have an Uber account before you can use
it, and Uber's app installed on your smart phone.

Well duh. And how long does it take to install and set up? Not very long
at all. It certainly takes less time than it does to find a local
minicab office if you don't know the area.

The question is - why are you supporting this silicon valley shark instead of
local businesses? Do you have any sort of conscience?

--
Spud

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

On 24/08/2016 14:51, d wrote:
On Wed, 24 Aug 2016 13:55:08 +0100
David Cantrell wrote:
- Third reason: you have to have a smart phone, with a signal/wi-fi
access (which is why very few blind people will have an Uber account).

The blind people I know actually find a smart phone more useful than a
dumb phone.

Oh really? And how exactly do they operate a touchscreen, press it randomly
and hope for the best?

- Fourth reason: you have to have an Uber account before you can use
it, and Uber's app installed on your smart phone.

Well duh. And how long does it take to install and set up? Not very long
at all. It certainly takes less time than it does to find a local
minicab office if you don't know the area.

The question is - why are you supporting this silicon valley shark instead of
local businesses? Do you have any sort of conscience?


Because, as each driver is a self-employed contractor I am supporting
local businesses!

If you're talking about the profit margin, then if some of the rumours
about the alleged owners of some of the local minicab firms are in any
way true, I'd far prefer my money to go to Uber than them.

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

David Cantrell wrote:
On Wed, Aug 17, 2016 at 01:26:03PM +0100, Recliner wrote:

One obvious reason: it's more expensive

IME Uber is cheaper than a local minicab company by around 25%.

Not where I am. The trusty local minicab firm is consistently cheaper than
Uber's estimates. And Uber doesn't claim to be cheaper than minicabs, only
black cabs (which it certainly is).


especially at 'surge' times.

OK, I'll grant you that. They're rare though.

Lots of people say otherwise.


- Second reason: it's less likely to have cars available locally in
residential areas (just like black cabs).

Wrong. There are four, right now, within 500 yards of my flat.

I suspect you're near the sort of traffic magnet that attracts Uber
drivers. They don't otherwise hang around residential areas.


- Third reason: you have to have a smart phone, with a signal/wi-fi
access (which is why very few blind people will have an Uber account).

The blind people I know actually find a smart phone more useful than a
dumb phone.

And how exactly do they operate the Uber app if they can't see the screen?



- Fourth reason: you have to have an Uber account before you can use
it, and Uber's app installed on your smart phone.

Well duh. And how long does it take to install and set up? Not very long
at all. It certainly takes less time than it does to find a local
minicab office if you don't know the area.

I was talking about using one's local minicab firm. If you're out and
around, then Uber is certainly more convenient, even though it's more
expensive.



You only have to do it once though. I did it while waiting ages for a
normal minicab to become available at a cab office in Balham.

Yes, of course. And it's great if travelling abroad.

Sadiq Khan and TfL on taxis and minicabs
 

On Wed, 24 Aug 2016 15:30:04 +0100
Someone Somewhere wrote:
On 24/08/2016 14:51, d wrote:
On Wed, 24 Aug 2016 13:55:08 +0100
David Cantrell wrote:
- Third reason: you have to have a smart phone, with a signal/wi-fi
access (which is why very few blind people will have an Uber account).

The blind people I know actually find a smart phone more useful than a
dumb phone.

Oh really? And how exactly do they operate a touchscreen, press it randomly
and hope for the best?

- Fourth reason: you have to have an Uber account before you can use
it, and Uber's app installed on your smart phone.

Well duh. And how long does it take to install and set up? Not very long
at all. It certainly takes less time than it does to find a local
minicab office if you don't know the area.

The question is - why are you supporting this silicon valley shark instead of
local businesses? Do you have any sort of conscience?


Because, as each driver is a self-employed contractor I am supporting
local businesses!

Hardly. Thats like saying buying a coffee at Starbucks is the same as buying
it from your local cafe. One pays corporation tax, one doesn't.

If you're talking about the profit margin, then if some of the rumours
about the alleged owners of some of the local minicab firms are in any
way true, I'd far prefer my money to go to Uber than them.

There will always be dodgy companies in any sector. That doesn't mean they're
all bent. Why TfL allowed Uber to operate here with its hailing model is
anyones guess. In thrall to big business presumably.

--
Spud