In message , at 13:31:24 on Wed, 30 Aug
2017, d remarked:

From the back office database. Don't they already access that when
checking
contactless these days? Recent Oyster & Contactless developments rely on a
degree of connectivity that was but a dream less than a decade ago.

Not in real time as far as I can tell, no. Contactless ticket checks
show on the journey history but take some hours to appear, it seems to
be updated after the event. Gate entry/exits take a few seconds to appear.

I wonder what if anything stops people using duff contactless cards, eg
ones for a closed account or one that was thought lost , cancelled , then
foundi
again? Presumably the only check the gate can do is whether the card
is from a
valid bank and account type.

The first time it's used, probably nothing to stop it. Once the charge
"bounces", overnight, it'll probably be added to a local-to-TfL
block-list.

I suppose for TfL the most they can lose is the daily capped fare, but if
contactless starts to be accepted on national rail for longer journeys someone
could in theory fleece a TOC of a few hundred quid.

Which is why every informed commentary on the likelihood of a National
Rail contactless post-pay scheme says it's a pipe dream.
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 16:00:29 on Wed, 30 Aug
2017, Someone Somewhere remarked:
if
contactless starts to be accepted on national rail for longer journeys someone
could in theory fleece a TOC of a few hundred quid.

Isnt't the max for contactless £40, hence that has to be the limit of
liability.

The trader can voluntarily, at their risk, accept them for a greater
sum.

Not very likely though in a National Rail context.

And that's before we've looked at the complexity of national roll-out of
the equivalent of pink route validators, and checking if the traveller
sat in First or Standard,
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 30 Aug 2017 16:00:29 +0100
Someone Somewhere wrote:
On 30/08/2017 14:31, d wrote:
if
contactless starts to be accepted on national rail for longer journeys
someone
could in theory fleece a TOC of a few hundred quid.

Isnt't the max for contactless £40, hence that has to be the limit of
liability.

It seems to go up all the time.

--
Spud

In message , at 15:14:27 on Wed, 30 Aug
2017, d remarked:

Isnt't the max for contactless £40, hence that has to be the limit of
liability.

It seems to go up all the time.

I'm not aware it's increased above £30, a limit set in Sept 2015.
--
Roland Perry

The first time a contactless card is used each day, a charge of 10p is made. If this is declined, the card is placed on the deny list almost immediately. Code 49 will then appear on the display when an exit gate or validator is used.

On Wed, 30 Aug 2017 12:18:59 +0100, Roland Perry
wrote:

I wonder what if anything stops people using duff contactless cards, eg
ones for a closed account or one that was thought lost , cancelled , then foundi
again? Presumably the only check the gate can do is whether the card is from a
valid bank and account type.

The first time it's used, probably nothing to stop it. Once the charge
"bounces", overnight, it'll probably be added to a local-to-TfL
block-list.

" When you touch in at the start of a journey, the card issuer takes a
nominal charge when authorising the transaction. Depending on the
issuer, this could be for £0.00, £0.01 or £0.10. Actual fares are not
charged until the daily charge is calculated at the end of the day. "

From
https://tfl.gov.uk/fares-and-payment...uer-statements

--
jhk

In message , at 00:28:51 on
Fri, 1 Sep 2017, Jarle Hammen Knudsen remarked:
I wonder what if anything stops people using duff contactless cards, eg
ones for a closed account or one that was thought lost , cancelled , then foundi
again? Presumably the only check the gate can do is whether the card is from a
valid bank and account type.

The first time it's used, probably nothing to stop it. Once the charge
"bounces", overnight, it'll probably be added to a local-to-TfL
block-list.

" When you touch in at the start of a journey, the card issuer takes a
nominal charge when authorising the transaction. Depending on the
issuer, this could be for £0.00, £0.01 or £0.10. Actual fares are not
charged until the daily charge is calculated at the end of the day. "

I didn't realise all the buses were online, but then sometimes progress
does creep up on us!
--
Roland Perry

They are not quite real time online, but the Deny list is propagated within a few minutes to the bus ticket machines.

Pick up of online top ups on buses is planned within the next few months.

On 01/09/2017 09:33, Matthew Dickinson wrote:
They are not quite real time online, but the Deny list is propagated within a few minutes to the bus ticket machines.


Sounds pretty much like the architecture I described then!

In message , at
01:33:46 on Fri, 1 Sep 2017, Matthew Dickinson
remarked:
They are not quite real time online, but the Deny list is propagated
within a few minutes to the bus ticket machines.

But do they make a card charge from the bus also "within minutes"?
--
Roland Perry