Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

Before boarding my District line train at Kensington Olympia today I
dutifully swiped my monthly Travelcard Oyster card on one of those
often-hard-to-find validators that says "Pre Pay users Please touch
your Oyster card on the reader".

Many posts in this group mention that actually, ALL Oyster users have
validate their cards to avoid an unresolved journey. My question is,
why did LU/Transys print those misleading Pre Pay users only notices?

They seem to be written for a period when (i) Travelcard Oyster card
users don't have to worry about swiping in and out, and (ii) Pre Pay
is in use. AFAIK these 2 conditions never existed at the same time.
Was the original plan to keep Pre Pay disabled on Travelcard Oyster
cards, but there was a late change of plan?

Dominic

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Thu, 13 May 2004 at 14:24:36, Dominic wrote:

Many posts in this group mention that actually, ALL Oyster users have
validate their cards to avoid an unresolved journey. My question is,
why did LU/Transys print those misleading Pre Pay users only notices?

I don't think that's altogether true, though. As a Travelcard holder, I
don't have to swipe in and out on the DLR, and I can't between Streatham
and Blackfriars, as there's nowhere to do so - but my ticket is
perfectly valid, nevertheless. I wouldn't swipe in at Kenny O, simply
because I don't think I'd need to... after all, I don't at Bank, if I'm
changing from the DLR there, as sometimes happens, and no problem the
other end.
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 9 May 2004

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

Annabel Smyth wrote:
On Thu, 13 May 2004 at 14:24:36, Dominic wrote:


Many posts in this group mention that actually, ALL Oyster users have
validate their cards to avoid an unresolved journey. My question is,
why did LU/Transys print those misleading Pre Pay users only notices?


I don't think that's altogether true, though. As a Travelcard holder, I
don't have to swipe in and out on the DLR, and I can't between Streatham
and Blackfriars, as there's nowhere to do so - but my ticket is
perfectly valid, nevertheless. I wouldn't swipe in at Kenny O, simply
because I don't think I'd need to... after all, I don't at Bank, if I'm
changing from the DLR there, as sometimes happens, and no problem the
other end.

So you're saying that you don't touch the validators when you enter a
DLR station, and you don't touch them when you exit a DLR station?

Brad

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

(I apologize in advance if this is duplicated; my mail tool crashed
unexpectedly when I sent the message).

Annabel Smyth wrote:
On Thu, 13 May 2004 at 14:24:36, Dominic wrote:


Many posts in this group mention that actually, ALL Oyster users have
validate their cards to avoid an unresolved journey. My question is,
why did LU/Transys print those misleading Pre Pay users only notices?


I don't think that's altogether true, though. As a Travelcard holder, I
don't have to swipe in and out on the DLR, and I can't between Streatham
and Blackfriars, as there's nowhere to do so - but my ticket is
perfectly valid, nevertheless. I wouldn't swipe in at Kenny O, simply
because I don't think I'd need to... after all, I don't at Bank, if I'm
changing from the DLR there, as sometimes happens, and no problem the
other end.

So you don't touch a validator when you enter or exit a DLR station,
even if you previously went through a gateline?

Brad

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Sat, 15 May 2004 at 18:37:43, TheOneKEA wrote:

So you're saying that you don't touch the validators when you enter a
DLR station, and you don't touch them when you exit a DLR station?

Correct. If you read the Oyster blurb, you will see that there is no
requirement to do so.
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 9 May 2004

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Sun, 16 May 2004 16:00:38 +0100, Barry Salter
wrote:



Correct. If you read the Oyster blurb, you will see that there is no
requirement to do so.

The exceptions being if starting or ending your DLR journey at a Tube
station, or when joining the DLR at Bank.

Not sure what you mean by this? Why do you need to swipe it even if
you started or finished at a tube station? The validators at Bank
STILL weren't working when I last passed through there - why is this
taking so long?

Personally, if I'm using a
Travelcard I just touch in and out anyway as it avoids unresolved
journeys.


What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

k wrote:
On Sun, 16 May 2004 16:00:38 +0100, Barry Salter
wrote:



Correct. If you read the Oyster blurb, you will see that there is no
requirement to do so.

The exceptions being if starting or ending your DLR journey at a Tube
station, or when joining the DLR at Bank.


Not sure what you mean by this? Why do you need to swipe it even if
you started or finished at a tube station? The validators at Bank
STILL weren't working when I last passed through there - why is this
taking so long?


Personally, if I'm using a
Travelcard I just touch in and out anyway as it avoids unresolved
journeys.



What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?

Your PrePay account will become negative and the gates will not let you
in until the PrePay account on the Oyster is zero or positive.

Brad

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Mon, 17 May 2004 12:14:56 +0000 (UTC), TheOneKEA
wrote:



What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?

Your PrePay account will become negative

On what grounds? As it CLEARLY says on the signs - the validators are
for prepay users.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Mon, 17 May 2004 13:47:50 +0100, Barry Salter
wrote:




That was a direct quote from the Oyster site, so...

Presumably they mean that if you pass through an LU gate line en route
to/from the DLR you should touch in/out, and use the validator at Bank
(if it's working) as that's within the Compulsory Ticket Area.


But you are in the middle of your journey - surely you don't need to
validate "during" a journey?

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Mon, 17 May 2004 17:06:44 +0100, k wrote:

On Mon, 17 May 2004 12:14:56 +0000 (UTC), TheOneKEA
wrote:
What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?

Your PrePay account will become negative

On what grounds? As it CLEARLY says on the signs - the validators are
for prepay users.

On the grounds that all Oyster cards have pre-pay functionality and if
you travel beyond your zonal availability the pre-pay element can be
deducted - even if there is NO cash on the card. You must then top up
with cash in order to make another DLR or Tube trip.

The system would appear to work differently for bus and tramlink where
you only register on entry with no requirement to register an exit on
either mode.

There is a new "Guide to using Oyster" on the leaflet racks at Tube
stations today.

I was a bit bemused by Barry's post about DLR but having read the advice
being provided on LUL Pre-Pay, then DLR and what you do at Bank and also
the advice on what to do at Wimbledon with Tramlink I have to say I am
confused.

The advice provided *seems* to be inconsistent but I am still trying to
work through the system logic in my head so don't quote me on it. It
would appear that whenever there is a "within a gateline" interchange
between operators that you must register the interchange on the card
regardless of ticket type in order for any potential excess fare or
Pre-Pay charge to be correctly calculated on eventual exit. The bit that
is confusing within the document is that there appears to be no
requirement to validate on exiting DLR at Bank, only on entry and I
can't work that out at all. I am assuming that on eventual exit the
reader must interrogate at least the last 2 journeys recorded on the
card to calculate any liability for a pre-pay deduction. Oh well back to
the drawing board for my theories.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Mon, 17 May 2004 at 12:13:44, k wrote:

On Sun, 16 May 2004 16:00:38 +0100, Barry Salter
wrote:



Correct. If you read the Oyster blurb, you will see that there is no
requirement to do so.

The exceptions being if starting or ending your DLR journey at a Tube
station, or when joining the DLR at Bank.

Not sure what you mean by this? Why do you need to swipe it even if
you started or finished at a tube station? The validators at Bank
STILL weren't working when I last passed through there - why is this
taking so long?

They weren't working today. Nor was much of the Underground, it
seems.... sheesh.....
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 9 May 2004

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Mon, 17 May 2004 at 12:14:56, TheOneKEA wrote:

k wrote:
Personally, if I'm using a
Travelcard I just touch in and out anyway as it avoids unresolved
journeys.

What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?

Your PrePay account will become negative and the gates will not let you
in until the PrePay account on the Oyster is zero or positive.

But why does this affect a Travelcard? I don't *have* any PrePay on my
card?
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 9 May 2004

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

TheOneKEA wrote the following in:


k wrote:

What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?

Your PrePay account will become negative and the gates will not
let you in until the PrePay account on the Oyster is zero or
positive.

My experience has been that with a travelcard you can walk in without
validating and validate on the way out (within your zones) without
being charged anything. You can also validate when you walk in (within
your zones) and not validate when you walk out and not be charged
anything.

--
message by Robin May, but I would say that, wouldn't I?
"GIVE IN! IT'S TIME TO GO!" - The NHS offers a high standard of care.

"You MUST NOT drive dangerously" - the Highway Code
Spelling lesson: then and than are different words.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Mon, 17 May 2004 18:38:07 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:



On what grounds? As it CLEARLY says on the signs - the validators are
for prepay users.

On the grounds that all Oyster cards have pre-pay functionality and if
you travel beyond your zonal availability the pre-pay element can be
deducted - even if there is NO cash on the card. You must then top up
with cash in order to make another DLR or Tube trip.

Just because it has a prepay facility it doesn't mean you are using
it. If i only travel within the zones of my travelcard then I am not
using prepay. I still maintaiin that I am doing nothing wrong by not
vaidating my travelcard AT ALL when using the DLR (my Travelcard
covers all zones of the DLR)

If I must do so then the signs need to be changed ASAP.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

Paul Corfield typed


On Mon, 17 May 2004 17:06:44 +0100, k wrote:

On Mon, 17 May 2004 12:14:56 +0000 (UTC), TheOneKEA
wrote:
What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?


There is a new "Guide to using Oyster" on the leaflet racks at Tube
stations today.

Would anyone here know if this has hit the lofty heights of the Oyster
website yet?

--
Helen D. Vecht:
Edgware.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

k wrote in message . ..
On Mon, 17 May 2004 13:47:50 +0100, Barry Salter
wrote:




That was a direct quote from the Oyster site, so...

Presumably they mean that if you pass through an LU gate line en route
to/from the DLR you should touch in/out, and use the validator at Bank
(if it's working) as that's within the Compulsory Ticket Area.


But you are in the middle of your journey - surely you don't need to
validate "during" a journey?

I have had to validated during a jounrey.
Example:
Barking to Snaresbrook via West Ham and Stratford
1 gateline to enter barking station
1 gateline to exit the Jubliee line at stratford and finally
1 gateline to exit snaresbrook station.

I could have gone via mile end but, i would have had to buy another
zone on my Travelcard.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On 18 May 2004 08:10:10 -0700, (Richard Jeeves)
wrote:



I have had to validated during a jounrey.
Example:
Barking to Snaresbrook via West Ham and Stratford
1 gateline to enter barking station
1 gateline to exit the Jubliee line at stratford and finally
1 gateline to exit snaresbrook station.


No - I'm not talking about using your ticket to open gates - I mean
validating it just because there is a validator there.

And I STILL don't understand why there are the extra set of gates at
Stratford....

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

Annabel Smyth wrote:
On Mon, 17 May 2004 at 12:14:56, TheOneKEA wrote:


k wrote:

Personally, if I'm using a
Travelcard I just touch in and out anyway as it avoids unresolved
journeys.


What are the implications of "unresolved journeys"?

Your PrePay account will become negative and the gates will not let you
in until the PrePay account on the Oyster is zero or positive.


But why does this affect a Travelcard? I don't *have* any PrePay on my
card?

It only affects you if you go beyond the zonal configuration of your
Travelcard, and thus incur an extension charge.

Paul Corfield posted elsewhere in the thread and explained it far better
than me.

Brad

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Tue, 18 May 2004 13:25:01 +0100, Helen Deborah Vecht
wrote:

Paul Corfield typed
There is a new "Guide to using Oyster" on the leaflet racks at Tube
stations today.

Would anyone here know if this has hit the lofty heights of the Oyster
website yet?

I had a look yesterday and I could not find it. I have to say I am not
very impressed with the Oyster website but there you go.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Tue, 18 May 2004 11:38:59 +0100, k wrote:

On Mon, 17 May 2004 18:38:07 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:



On what grounds? As it CLEARLY says on the signs - the validators are
for prepay users.

On the grounds that all Oyster cards have pre-pay functionality and if
you travel beyond your zonal availability the pre-pay element can be
deducted - even if there is NO cash on the card. You must then top up
with cash in order to make another DLR or Tube trip.

Just because it has a prepay facility it doesn't mean you are using
it. If i only travel within the zones of my travelcard then I am not
using prepay. I still maintaiin that I am doing nothing wrong by not
vaidating my travelcard AT ALL when using the DLR (my Travelcard
covers all zones of the DLR)

You are right about the travelcard bit. I think the problem here is that
there are two concepts on the card. In our case you have no risk of
needing to extend your travelcard for DLR journeys by using the auto
ticket extension facility provided by Pre-Pay. Therefore you do not need
to validate. However the customer message needs to make clear that if
you do intend to extend e.g. to Zone 3 that you do can do this by using
pre-pay. If everyone understood how all this worked it would be easy -
however there are always people who do not understand how the zones and
extensions work and now we've added Pre-Pay on top. I guess the real
trick is just to explain a complex subject in simple terms to all
intending passengers - ahem!
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Tue, 18 May 2004 16:50:04 +0100, k wrote:

And I STILL don't understand why there are the extra set of gates at
Stratford....

The stratford issue is very easy to explain. When the system was
originally conceived a decree from on high said the JLE would be gated
off from other operators and from the street. This was before authority
was granted to gate the remainder of the LUL network - one of my pieces
of work at LUL so you can all blame me!!!

The original design of Stratford station had an independent overbridge
from the main ticket hall to the JLE platforms with its own gateline.
Therefore street to JLE was via one gateline. In order to comply with
the overarching edict the interchange gateline was designed in to cover
the potential for people reaching JLE from "open" stations on the
Central Line, BR and DLR lines. At a later stage there was a need to
redesign the route from street to JLE and the independent one gateline
route was removed. Therefore we ended up with the unique requirement to
double enter or double exit for trips from JLE to street - it caused no
end of problems in getting the ticket checking logic to work but there
you are. I don't claim any of it makes much sense but some of us did
try to point out the pitfalls.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Tue, 18 May 2004 at 11:38:59, k wrote:

Just because it has a prepay facility it doesn't mean you are using
it. If i only travel within the zones of my travelcard then I am not
using prepay. I still maintaiin that I am doing nothing wrong by not
vaidating my travelcard AT ALL when using the DLR (my Travelcard
covers all zones of the DLR)

If I must do so then the signs need to be changed ASAP.

Ditto, likewise, and fully agree! If I am within the limits of my
Travelcard zones, there is no reason on earth to engage Prepay.

Anyway, the amount of times I've had my card read on the DLR, if I was
doing something wrong, they'd have told me by now!
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 9 May 2004

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Tue, 18 May 2004 at 16:57:17, TheOneKEA wrote:

I asked:

But why does this affect a Travelcard? I don't *have* any PrePay on
my
card?

It only affects you if you go beyond the zonal configuration of your
Travelcard, and thus incur an extension charge.

Paul Corfield posted elsewhere in the thread and explained it far better
than me.

Indeed; and were I to wish to go beyond the limit of my Travelcard, I'd
put some PrePay on my Oyster (and touch in/out, where valid) to enable
me to do so. As I don't, I am not sure why PrePay comes into it at all.
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 9 May 2004

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

In message , Annabel Smyth
writes
On Tue, 18 May 2004 at 16:57:17, TheOneKEA wrote:

I asked:

But why does this affect a Travelcard? I don't *have* any PrePay on
my
card?

It only affects you if you go beyond the zonal configuration of your
Travelcard, and thus incur an extension charge.

Paul Corfield posted elsewhere in the thread and explained it far better
than me.

Indeed; and were I to wish to go beyond the limit of my Travelcard, I'd
put some PrePay on my Oyster (and touch in/out, where valid) to enable
me to do so. As I don't, I am not sure why PrePay comes into it at all.

Simply because many people are not as conversant with the zones as you
and often travel outside those on their T/Cs without knowing it... or so
they tell me.
--
Kat Me, Ambivalent? Well, yes and no.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Tue, 18 May 2004 18:59:05 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:



The stratford issue is very easy to explain.

Thanks for the explanation.


Therefore street to JLE was via one gateline. In order to comply with
the overarching edict the interchange gateline was designed in to cover
the potential for people reaching JLE from "open" stations on the
Central Line, BR and DLR lines.

But surely they can get on from "open" stations elsewhere i.e. at any
other interchange? I don't see why Stratford should be unique.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Wed, 19 May 2004 11:48:12 +0100, k wrote:

On Tue, 18 May 2004 18:59:05 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:



The stratford issue is very easy to explain.

Thanks for the explanation.


Therefore street to JLE was via one gateline. In order to comply with
the overarching edict the interchange gateline was designed in to cover
the potential for people reaching JLE from "open" stations on the
Central Line, BR and DLR lines.

But surely they can get on from "open" stations elsewhere i.e. at any
other interchange? I don't see why Stratford should be unique.

Stratford was unique because of a policy statement to gate the JLE (a
new piece of railway) off from all other operators. The end result of
that policy only really applies at Stratford and the concept was not
applied at places like Canning Town although we did have some utterly
bizarre gateline designs to assess. I think in the end we convinced
people that the cost far outweighed any benefit. This is what happens
when people have high level concepts and ignore the practical detail.

Similar arguments were put forward when we were designing the gate
layouts for the North end of the Victoria Line. Thankfully we managed to
convince people that such complex layouts would not work and would not
be cost effective.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Wed, 19 May 2004 19:30:37 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:

Similar arguments were put forward when we were designing the gate
layouts for the North end of the Victoria Line. Thankfully we managed to
convince people that such complex layouts would not work and would not
be cost effective.

Is this reference to Walthamstow Central, Tottenham Hale and Finsbury
Park with National Rail services where one can travel without a ticket
due to no barriers being in place?

As a passenger using these stations periodically, I'd prefer that
there *were* ticket barriers - complex layouts or not - to discourage
fare evasion and the sort of people that flock to stations for "free"
travel.

Thankfully places like Blackhorse Road, and Highbury and Islington
have gates lines even for National Rail services, so it's not all bad!


Cheers,

Jason.

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Thu, 27 May 2004 16:29:26 +0100, Jason wrote:

On Wed, 19 May 2004 19:30:37 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:

Similar arguments were put forward when we were designing the gate
layouts for the North end of the Victoria Line. Thankfully we managed to
convince people that such complex layouts would not work and would not
be cost effective.

Is this reference to Walthamstow Central, Tottenham Hale and Finsbury
Park with National Rail services where one can travel without a ticket
due to no barriers being in place?

No it isn't. It is a reference to LU people wanting every possible route
to and from street as well as between operators gated. This means a
combination of normal gatelines and interchange ones as per stratford.
It would mean at least 50% more gates, probably building works, more
maintenance cost for next to no benefit.

Where there has always been within the barrier line interchange then it
seems completely pointless to create barriers to people moving freely -
would you put gates on the cross platform corridors between WAGN and the
Victoria Line at Highbury and Islington? If not then why put them
between WAGN and the Victoria Line at say Seven Sisters?

Walthamstow Central is impossible to deal with in its current
configuration if you want to gate everything off from everything else.
Believe me we looked at it but it would not be safe given the limited
space, position of staircases and platform edges. It is bad enough in
the LUL ticket hall area - we struggled to get in the requisite number
of gates and it would be hugely expensive to expand under the WAGN
tracks to make more room. Whether the link to the bus station makes any
difference we shall have to wait and see.

As a passenger using these stations periodically, I'd prefer that
there *were* ticket barriers - complex layouts or not - to discourage
fare evasion and the sort of people that flock to stations for "free"
travel.

Thankfully places like Blackhorse Road, and Highbury and Islington
have gates lines even for National Rail services, so it's not all bad!

But only because these stations are configured in such a way that a
gateline at the station entrance covers both operators. You can still
interchange between the operators within the gateline.

There is also the small issue about who actually benefits - the TOCs
were very reluctant to cough up any whatsoever where their lines were
covered at places like Highbury even though they benefit directly from
increased sales at Highbury and also from other stations where people
travel to Highbury. In other words LUL can stump public sector money and
they can reap the private sector gain - err I think not. We all have
duties to demonstrate that we are getting value for money. At
Tottenham Hale the second gateline you suggest would only cover WAGN -
there's nothing to stop them putting one in if they think it would pay.
It certainly would not be the responsibility of LUL.

--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

TheOneKEA wrote in message ...

So you're saying that you don't touch the validators when you enter a
DLR station, and you don't touch them when you exit a DLR station?

Sounds like she's saying that you don't (or shouldn't) need to
swipe the card on the validator when you are
a) interchanging between operators/lines at an interchange station
and
b) when you have a travelcard, as opposed to prepay.

With prepay, there is the possibility of having an unclosed
or ambiguous journey. This isn't usually the case with
travelcards.

However, it also appears that you *do* sometimes have to
validate the card, even with travelcards. I don't know why,
and I don't know where I first heard it.

Richard [in PO7]

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

Annabel Smyth wrote in message

But why does this affect a Travelcard? I don't *have* any PrePay on my
card?

My understanding is that every Oyster card has pre pay, even if
it stays at zero for all its life.

The idea, as I understand it, is that if you have a TC for zones
1,2,3 and use it to go from Z1 to Z4, it will take the Z3-Z4
bit out of your prepay. If this prepay is zero, it will leave
you with a negative prepay balance. This may disable the card for
future use (until you make good the debt) or it may just disable
the out-of-zone aspect; I don't know.

Richard [in PO7]

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On 8 Jun 2004 13:57:42 -0700,
(Richard M Willis) wrote:

However, it also appears that you *do* sometimes have to
validate the card, even with travelcards. I don't know why,
and I don't know where I first heard it.

It's because Travelcards either do or will (not sure which) have a
pre-pay capacity for the purchase of extension tickets. This means
that unresolved journeys can occur here as well.

Neil

--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
To e-mail use neil at the above domain

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

On Tue, 8 Jun 2004 at 21:09:54, Neil Williams
wrote:

On 8 Jun 2004 13:57:42 -0700,
(Richard M Willis) wrote:

However, it also appears that you *do* sometimes have to
validate the card, even with travelcards. I don't know why,
and I don't know where I first heard it.

It's because Travelcards either do or will (not sure which) have a
pre-pay capacity for the purchase of extension tickets. This means
that unresolved journeys can occur here as well.

Do. But as far as I can tell, if you are staying within your zone,
there isn't a problem.

I've recently changed my Oyster to contain a bus pass and some pre-pay,
and I have a horrible feeling that half the time it is taking off the
pre-pay, not using the pass (I haven't tried it on the tube yet). I
don't know how one can stop it doing that.....
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 6 June 2004

Those "Pre Pay users" Oyster validators
 

Annabel Smyth typed


I've recently changed my Oyster to contain a bus pass and some pre-pay,
and I have a horrible feeling that half the time it is taking off the
pre-pay, not using the pass (I haven't tried it on the tube yet). I
don't know how one can stop it doing that.....

Ask a nice ticket office chap(pess) at a Tube station for a printout of
your Oyster usage. If your expediture disagrees with your entitlement,
phone the Oyster Helpline.

FWIW I have a Bus Pass with added PrePay for my Tube use. I've never had
money deducted for bus use.

--
Helen D. Vecht:
Edgware.