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#181
April 15th 21, 09:32 AM
posted to uk.railway,uk.transport.london
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LO lines to be named
Charles Ellson wrote:
On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 01:09:01 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: On 14 Apr 2021 22:18:29 GMT, Marland wrote: James Heaton wrote: "Anna Noyd-Dryver" wrote in message ... MB wrote: On 11/04/2021 11:56, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote: Hummer have already built 2 large battery SUVs. And H2 trains makes no bloody sense whatsoever - just electric the damn lines and if its too expensive for overhead then they should recind that moronic rule about no more 3rd rail and lay that instead. Health and Safety at Work Act, isn't it? I would not have expected the H&S at Work Act to go into detail like that. About having exposed electro conductors at floor level? Apparently it's something specific in electrical regulations too. Either way, the point is that it's about staff safety not about trespassers, as often claimed. Electricity at Work Regulations 1989 It is mainly focused on staff safety. Realistically the only way we're ever going to get more 3rd rail, is with fully protected contact like the DLR - which is incompatible with existing installations on the southern/mersey. James There must be some mechanism to give dispensation in some circumstances Other wise laying down the conductor rails on the Old Dalby test track to test the LU S Stock could not have occurred . A lot of it on there is protected by side protection boards but quite a lot of pictures show a lot is not, Regulation 7 gives you the choice of insulating or taking other precautions "so far is reasonably practicable". Old Dalby doesn't have passengers to worry about so precautions probably rely more on suitable fencing and appropriate training of onsite staff. There is minimal shielding of conductor rails on LU anyway, even on new work. snip The reasonably practical measure taken at Old Dalby is presumably not having staff walking at track level without an isolation. Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.” GH |
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#182
April 15th 21, 09:49 AM
posted to uk.railway,uk.transport.london
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LO lines to be named
Marland wrote:
Charles Ellson wrote: On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 01:09:01 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: On 14 Apr 2021 22:18:29 GMT, Marland wrote: James Heaton wrote: "Anna Noyd-Dryver" wrote in message ... MB wrote: On 11/04/2021 11:56, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote: Hummer have already built 2 large battery SUVs. And H2 trains makes no bloody sense whatsoever - just electric the damn lines and if its too expensive for overhead then they should recind that moronic rule about no more 3rd rail and lay that instead. Health and Safety at Work Act, isn't it? I would not have expected the H&S at Work Act to go into detail like that. About having exposed electro conductors at floor level? Apparently it's something specific in electrical regulations too. Either way, the point is that it's about staff safety not about trespassers, as often claimed. Electricity at Work Regulations 1989 It is mainly focused on staff safety. Realistically the only way we're ever going to get more 3rd rail, is with fully protected contact like the DLR - which is incompatible with existing installations on the southern/mersey. James There must be some mechanism to give dispensation in some circumstances Other wise laying down the conductor rails on the Old Dalby test track to test the LU S Stock could not have occurred . A lot of it on there is protected by side protection boards but quite a lot of pictures show a lot is not, Regulation 7 gives you the choice of insulating or taking other precautions "so far is reasonably practicable". Old Dalby doesn't have passengers to worry about so precautions probably rely more on suitable fencing and appropriate training of onsite staff. There is minimal shielding of conductor rails on LU anyway, even on new work. snip The reasonably practical measure taken at Old Dalby is presumably not having staff walking at track level without an isolation. Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.” I wonder if the 3rd/4th rails are only powered up when a DC train that needs them is under test? |
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#183
April 15th 21, 10:07 AM
posted to uk.railway,uk.transport.london
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LO lines to be named
On 15 Apr 2021 08:32:31 GMT
Marland wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.” Given we have Old Dalby in the UK why do so many new trains do their testing in the Czech Republic these days? Perhaps there's an argument for one track to be returned to being a regular railway linking Melton Mowbray and Nottingham? |
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#185
April 15th 21, 10:49 AM
posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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LO lines to be named
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 09:07:24 on Thu, 15 Apr 2021, remarked: On 15 Apr 2021 08:32:31 GMT Marland wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.� Given we have Old Dalby in the UK why do so many new trains do their testing in the Czech Republic these days? Perhaps there's an argument for one track to be returned to being a regular railway linking Melton Mowbray and Nottingham? The stretch from the north end of the Old Dalby line, to Central Nottingham, has been obliterated by various development. Presumably the line closed in the first place because it wasn't heavily used? |
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#186
April 15th 21, 10:57 AM
posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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LO lines to be named
wrote:
On 15 Apr 2021 08:32:31 GMT Marland wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.” Given we have Old Dalby in the UK why do so many new trains do their testing in the Czech Republic these days? Siemens trains are normally tested at its test track at an old RAF base in Wildenrath. Old Dalby is mainly used by British-built trains from Derby and Newton Aycliffe. For example, every S stock train had to be tested there. There is also a planned new test track in south Wales, on a former coal mine site. This will be used particularly by CAF. https://gov.wales/global-centre-rail-excellence-wales Perhaps there's an argument for one track to be returned to being a regular railway linking Melton Mowbray and Nottingham? No, not ony is it not needed, but you don't run service trains through a test site. |
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#187
April 15th 21, 11:10 AM
posted to uk.railway,uk.transport.london
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LO lines to be named
Recliner wrote:
Marland wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 01:09:01 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: On 14 Apr 2021 22:18:29 GMT, Marland wrote: James Heaton wrote: "Anna Noyd-Dryver" wrote in message ... MB wrote: On 11/04/2021 11:56, Anna Noyd-Dryver wrote: Hummer have already built 2 large battery SUVs. And H2 trains makes no bloody sense whatsoever - just electric the damn lines and if its too expensive for overhead then they should recind that moronic rule about no more 3rd rail and lay that instead. Health and Safety at Work Act, isn't it? I would not have expected the H&S at Work Act to go into detail like that. About having exposed electro conductors at floor level? Apparently it's something specific in electrical regulations too. Either way, the point is that it's about staff safety not about trespassers, as often claimed. Electricity at Work Regulations 1989 It is mainly focused on staff safety. Realistically the only way we're ever going to get more 3rd rail, is with fully protected contact like the DLR - which is incompatible with existing installations on the southern/mersey. James There must be some mechanism to give dispensation in some circumstances Other wise laying down the conductor rails on the Old Dalby test track to test the LU S Stock could not have occurred . A lot of it on there is protected by side protection boards but quite a lot of pictures show a lot is not, Regulation 7 gives you the choice of insulating or taking other precautions "so far is reasonably practicable". Old Dalby doesn't have passengers to worry about so precautions probably rely more on suitable fencing and appropriate training of onsite staff. There is minimal shielding of conductor rails on LU anyway, even on new work. snip The reasonably practical measure taken at Old Dalby is presumably not having staff walking at track level without an isolation. Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.” I wonder if the 3rd/4th rails are only powered up when a DC train that needs them is under test? I would very much imagine so, and the OLE the same. Anna Noyd-Dryver |
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#188
April 15th 21, 11:10 AM
posted to uk.railway,uk.transport.london
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LO lines to be named
wrote:
On 15 Apr 2021 08:32:31 GMT Marland wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.” Given we have Old Dalby in the UK why do so many new trains do their testing in the Czech Republic these days? Perhaps there's an argument for one track to be returned to being a regular railway linking Melton Mowbray and Nottingham? For a start, Velim is circular, so it allows continuous testing at high speeds, rather than changing ends every few minutes. It's got OLE throughout (rather than only for a few miles of Old Dalby) compatible with all major European systems, so presumably all the manufacturers already have a contract there; in which case it makes sense to utilise the one you already know. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velim_railway_test_circuit Anna Noyd-Dryver |
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#189
April 15th 21, 11:24 AM
posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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LO lines to be named
In message , at 09:49:15 on Thu, 15 Apr
2021, Recliner remarked: Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 09:07:24 on Thu, 15 Apr 2021, remarked: On 15 Apr 2021 08:32:31 GMT Marland wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.� Given we have Old Dalby in the UK why do so many new trains do their testing in the Czech Republic these days? Perhaps there's an argument for one track to be returned to being a regular railway linking Melton Mowbray and Nottingham? The stretch from the north end of the Old Dalby line, to Central Nottingham, has been obliterated by various development. Presumably the line closed in the first place because it wasn't heavily used? It was seen as needlessly duplicating the MML as a route to London (much the same as the similar fate of the Great Central). The local commuter traffic was negligible (no stations in the Nottingham suburbs) and for people wanting to get to Melton, an hourly bus was deemed sufficient (and I bet was more regular than what stopping trains it might have replaced). -- Roland Perry |
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#190
April 15th 21, 12:52 PM
posted to uk.railway,uk.transport.london
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LO lines to be named
On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 10:17:50 +0100
Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 09:07:24 on Thu, 15 Apr 2021, remarked: On 15 Apr 2021 08:32:31 GMT Marland wrote: Charles Ellson wrote: Looking at e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9k7XvFH3pE there isn't a lot of DC track out in the open away from the fenced off "depot" and there is about 200y of shielding at the far end of the DC track (about 5:12) which is rather more than usually seen at transition points. We will have to disagree about what “isn’t a lot is “ . Quoting from this website. http://www.old-dalby.com/operation.htm “This line is now electrified with 750v DC conductor rails for approximately 3 miles and the SSL trains are based in the compound during the daily testing. The yard sidings at the former control centre have also been equipped. Power for the DC line is routed from the sub-station at Asfordby. All other functions are now conducted from the new complex at Asfordby, and the SSL trains travel to and from Asfordby each day, hauled by a diesel locomotive.� Given we have Old Dalby in the UK why do so many new trains do their testing in the Czech Republic these days? Perhaps there's an argument for one track to be returned to being a regular railway linking Melton Mowbray and Nottingham? The stretch from the north end of the Old Dalby line, to Central Nottingham, has been obliterated by various development. Ah ok. I thought there was a tunnel beyond the buffer stops at the end. Hard to tell in google. |
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