In message , at 09:00:08 on Tue, 26 Oct
2004, Arthur Clune remarked:
The trouble with RIPA is that the bad stuff (the gagging orders etc) is
very, very bad.

So you like crooks being able to tip off their comrades? Very good.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
The trouble with RIPA is that the bad stuff (the gagging orders etc) is
very, very bad.


So you like crooks being able to tip off their comrades? Very good.

If they're a crook, they're going to tip off their comrades regardless.

In message , at 12:59:44 on Tue, 26 Oct
2004, Richard remarked:
So you like crooks being able to tip off their comrades? Very good.

If they're a crook, they're going to tip off their comrades regardless.

So cancel the law banning armed robbery, as people do it anyway.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 12:59:44 on Tue, 26 Oct
2004, Richard remarked:

So you like crooks being able to tip off their comrades? Very good.


If they're a crook, they're going to tip off their comrades regardless.


So cancel the law banning armed robbery, as people do it anyway.

Oh, look, apples and oranges and straw men. "If you're doing nothing
wrong..." can't be far off.

(Parts of) RIPA are overly restrictive. The effect on criminals will
be minimal; the effect on the general public will be widespread repression.

A more accurate statement/analogy would be,

"As people committ armed robbery despite there being a law against it,
we're going to ban everyone from entering post offices and banks."

p.s. laws don't get cancelled, they get repealed.

In message , at 13:47:37 on Tue, 26 Oct
2004, Richard remarked:
(Parts of) RIPA are overly restrictive. The effect on criminals will
be minimal; the effect on the general public will be widespread
repression.

I don't think most of the General Public's communications (even if
encrypted) are of enough interest that the recipients will have the GAK
powers applied.
--
Roland Perry

(Parts of) RIPA are overly restrictive. The effect on criminals will
be minimal; the effect on the general public will be widespread
repression.

I don't think most of the General Public's communications (even if
encrypted) are of enough interest that the recipients will have the GAK
powers applied.

headbutts brick wall You've somewhat missed the point. Although Roland
is being slightly hysterical, the effect of parts of RIPA _could_ be
widespread repression, which is why we should deny that opportunity to this
future governments. Slippery slope and thin end of the wedge may be
cliches, but they are almost always valid.

In message , at
13:49:34 on Tue, 26 Oct 2004, Mark Thompson
remarked:
(Parts of) RIPA are overly restrictive. The effect on criminals will
be minimal; the effect on the general public will be widespread
repression.

I don't think most of the General Public's communications (even if
encrypted) are of enough interest that the recipients will have the GAK
powers applied.

headbutts brick wall You've somewhat missed the point. Although Roland
is being slightly hysterical, the effect of parts of RIPA _could_ be
widespread repression, which is why we should deny that opportunity to this
future governments. Slippery slope and thin end of the wedge may be
cliches, but they are almost always valid.

Any law can be misused - why pick on RIPA especially? And while the GAK
part hasn't even got a draft Code of Practice, speculation is moot.
--
Roland Perry

In uk.rec.cycling Roland Perry wrote:

: So you like crooks being able to tip off their comrades? Very good.

And you think they won't anyway?

The trouble will all this sort of stuff is that it's always a trade off
between the risks to the innocent and being able to convict the guilty.
I think RIPA (and a lot of more recent developments) draw the line in
the wrong place.

Why defend "the free world" if it's not free anymore?

Arthur


--
Arthur Clune PGP/GPG Key: http://www.clune.org/pubkey.txt
"Blogs are neither necessary nor sufficient for evil to triumph.
They're just what we call an enabling technology" - Danny O'Brien

In message , at 12:46:29 on Tue, 26 Oct
2004, Arthur Clune remarked:
: So you like crooks being able to tip off their comrades? Very good.

And you think they won't anyway?

Just like they'll rob banks anyway (haven't we been round this block
once before?)

The trouble will all this sort of stuff is that it's always a trade off
between the risks to the innocent and being able to convict the guilty.
I think RIPA (and a lot of more recent developments) draw the line in
the wrong place.

RIPA draws the line in a place decided by other legislation. The crime
has to be serious enough. If you are paranoid enough to think that a
future government will make insert your pet activity here illegal, and
subject to GAK, then that new law could just as easily have the GAK
within it.
--
Roland Perry

then that new law could just as easily have the GAK
within it.

Nope.