Solar Penguin wrote:
--- Tony Raven said:


Well one assumes your priority would start with the biggest threat.

Never heard of "triage"? The priority is to start with the threat
that's most easily dealt with and once that's out of the way, you'll
have more freedom to deal with the more complicated threats.



jeez how many knobs can we get in the one thread


micky


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Solar Penguin opined the following...
So, let's have tougher restrictions and penalties for both motorists
*AND* cyclists. The best of both worlds. Well... What's wrong with
that?

But you seem to advocate ignoring the major problem (Deaths caused by
motorised vehicles) in favour of tackling the minor (Deaths caused by
bicyles). This is not "tougher restrictions and penalties for both
motorists *AND* cyclists", this is jumping on the easy target because
we're afraid of the larger one.

Thought experiment:

A badly defended country (Smallium) is under attack from two sides. The
neighbour to the East (Biggus) is categorised as a Superpower and has
highly advanced technology. He is making vast headway into the civilian
population of Smallium. The neighbour to the West (Tribus) has an
aggressive populace armed with particularly sharp mangoes. As a large
neighbour to both Biggus and Tribus you can stop either of them. Your
mandate is to defend Smallium. What do you do?

Jon

On 16 Oct 2004 05:58:53 -0700, Silas Denyer wrote:

Personally I think the only solution is compulsory registration of
bicycles, with clearly-displayed plates, or perhaps compulsory
registration of the riders (plate on the back of a mandatory
reflective jacket, perhaps). This isn't trivial law-breaking - this is
anarchy in which business, the police, and the general public are
wholesale ignoring the law of the land, and frequently endangering the
lives of pedestrians (yes, lives - cyclist hitting pedestrian can and
does result in death). Who wants to join my petition?

Don't feed the trolls!

On Sat, 16 Oct 2004 17:06:37 +0100, Jon Senior
jon_AT_restlesslemon_DOTco_DOT_uk wrote:

A badly defended country (Smallium) is under attack from two sides. The
neighbour to the East (Biggus) is categorised as a Superpower and has
highly advanced technology. He is making vast headway into the civilian
population of Smallium. The neighbour to the West (Tribus) has an
aggressive populace armed with particularly sharp mangoes. As a large
neighbour to both Biggus and Tribus you can stop either of them. Your
mandate is to defend Smallium. What do you do?

Annex with Biggus. Buy a car?

[Not Responding] lid opined the
following...
Annex with Biggus. Buy a car?

OK. So I got a bit carried away there. And the reality is that unless
you have the muscle to do it, you say "yessir-what-ever-you-want-sir" to
Biggus while telling the world that you have everyone's best interests
at heart.

Jon

Jon Senior wrote:

Thought experiment:

A badly defended country (Smallium) is under attack from two sides. The
neighbour to the East (Biggus) is categorised as a Superpower and has
highly advanced technology. He is making vast headway into the civilian
population of Smallium. The neighbour to the West (Tribus) has an
aggressive populace armed with particularly sharp mangoes. As a large
neighbour to both Biggus and Tribus you can stop either of them. Your
mandate is to defend Smallium. What do you do?


Feed the mangos to the trolls?

Tony

micky wrote:

jeez how many knobs can we get in the one thread


micky


Welcome

Tony ;-)

Cars may be 3000 times deadlier
than bikes, but that also makes them at least 3000 times harder to
solve.

Eh? No.

Solar Penguin wrote:
--- Tony Raven said:


Well one assumes your priority would start with the biggest threat.


Never heard of "triage"? The priority is to start with the threat
that's most easily dealt with and once that's out of the way, you'll
have more freedom to deal with the more complicated threats.




Surely the biggest, most dangerous, and easiest to solve problem is that
of cars and vans passing lights on red - something that now appears
commonplace in London. As these are already equipped with number plates
a low-tech solution for stopping this would be to station Community
Support Officers at intersections and getting them to note down the
registration numbers of anyone seen doing this so they can be prosecuted.

If the fines for this could be ringfenced and used to provide traffic
light cameras this would probably only need to done for a short period.
Once the majority of junctions (and traffic light controlled pedestrian
crossings) were controlled in this way we should we well on the way to
stampting out that particular crime.


JulesH

--- Jon Senior said:

Thought experiment:

A badly defended country (Smallium) is under attack from two sides.
The
neighbour to the East (Biggus) is categorised as a Superpower and has
highly advanced technology. He is making vast headway into the
civilian
population of Smallium. The neighbour to the West (Tribus) has an
aggressive populace armed with particularly sharp mangoes. As a large
neighbour to both Biggus and Tribus you can stop either of them. Your
mandate is to defend Smallium. What do you do?


Hmmm... I don't accept the premise of this thought experiment because I
don't accept that this is an "Either/Or" situation. (E.g. How do we
know that Biggus and Tribus aren't already allied against Smallium?)
And anyway, pedestrians would be in the position of Tribus, not
Smallium -- we've got the least to defend ourselves with out of any of
the three groups! Heck at least cyclists are armed with bikes.
Pedestrians don't even get a blunt mango to harm other road users with!