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When was Praed Street Junction built?
Did Praed Street Junction exist when the Metropolitan Railway opened
between Paddington Bishop's Road and Farringdon Street in 1863? Or was the junction only added when the line south to Gloucester Road opened in 1868? In books about the Metropolitan one often sees a picture of a broad gauge steam locomotive going over the junction, dated as 1863. But why would the junction be there at that time? Dominic |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
In message , Dominic
writes Did Praed Street Junction exist when the Metropolitan Railway opened between Paddington Bishop's Road and Farringdon Street in 1863? Or was the junction only added when the line south to Gloucester Road opened in 1868? The latter - 1868. In books about the Metropolitan one often sees a picture of a broad gauge steam locomotive going over the junction, dated as 1863. But why would the junction be there at that time? One of the classic early lithographs (but dated c. 1868) is ... http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/r...image=10302307 Is that the one? -- Paul Terry |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
Dominic F.:
Did Praed Street Junction exist when the Metropolitan Railway opened between Paddington Bishop's Road and Farringdon Street in 1863? Or was the junction only added when the line south to Gloucester Road opened in 1868? Paul Terry: The latter - 1868. In books about the Metropolitan one often sees a picture of a broad gauge steam locomotive going over the junction, dated as 1863. ... One of the classic early lithographs (but dated c. 1868) ... Metropolitan trains themselves were always standard gauge from August 1863 when the GWR withdrew from the original arrangement to provide them. But through trains from the GWR operated over the Met starting later in 1863, and these were broad gauge until 1869. Evidently the lithograph shows one of them. What I never thought about until now is that the tracks in the *fore- ground*, which now form the Circle and District Line tracks, are mixed gauge in the lithograph. I have never seen anything to suggest that broad-gauge trains used those tracks. Does anyone know how far toward South Ken the broad-gauge rails ran, and whether they were ever used? -- Mark Brader "You can't [compare] computer memory and recall Toronto with human memory and recall. It's comparing apples and bicycles." -- Ed Knowles My text in this article is in the public domain. |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
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When was Praed Street Junction built?
Paul Terry wrote in message ...
In message , Dominic writes Did Praed Street Junction exist when the Metropolitan Railway opened between Paddington Bishop's Road and Farringdon Street in 1863? Or was the junction only added when the line south to Gloucester Road opened in 1868? The latter - 1868. In books about the Metropolitan one often sees a picture of a broad gauge steam locomotive going over the junction, dated as 1863. But why would the junction be there at that time? One of the classic early lithographs (but dated c. 1868) is ... http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/r...image=10302307 Is that the one? Yeah, that's it. I think in London's Metropolitan Railway by Alan Jackson it's dated wrongly as 1863, which didn't help me when I was trying to resolve that Bishop's Road is the original Paddington, and Praed Street was added later. Thanks, Dominic |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
Dominic F.:
... which didn't help me when I was trying to resolve that Bishop's Road is the original Paddington, and Praed Street was added later. An interesting point here is that the Praed Street station and junction were actually in the plan for the Metropolitan at the time when the terminus was first moved to Paddington. Then they realized that since connecting tracks with the GWR main line were planned, it would be cheaper to eliminate the junction and put the station on the connecting tracks instead -- hence, Bishop's Road. But you knew this, if you've read CULG http://www.davros.org/rail/culg on the Hammersmith & City Line. -- Mark Brader, Toronto "Ken doesn't spell very well. Fortunately, he has other virtues." -- Dennis Ritchie My text in this article is in the public domain. |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
"Paul Cummins" wrote in message
... In article , (Mark Brader) wrote: What I never thought about until now is that the tracks in the *fore-ground*, which now form the Circle and District Line tracks, are mixed gauge in the lithograph. I have never seen anything to suggest that broad-gauge trains used those tracks. Does anyone know how far toward South Ken the broad-gauge rails ran, and whether they were ever used? They didn't, as can be seen if you take a look at the tunnel width at the junction. The lithographer used artistic licence. Was there any device to prevent broad gauge trains attempting to go the wrong way? -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
|
When was Praed Street Junction built?
In article , Paul Cummins
writes Does anyone know how far toward South Ken the broad-gauge rails ran, and whether they were ever used? They didn't, as can be seen if you take a look at the tunnel width at the junction. The lithographer used artistic licence. It's not clear to me that the tunnel width is insufficient. Remember that broad gauge trains overhung the rails far less than narrow gauge. -- Clive D.W. Feather | Home: Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is: |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
In article , John Rowland
writes Was there any device to prevent broad gauge trains attempting to go the wrong way? No broad gauge rail. The track would be something like this: \ \ \ \ \ C\ \ \ \\------------ \ \ \--C -------X-------\-------------- \ \ \ ------------------------------ Irrespective of the setting of the points, the check rail C would pull a broad-gauge axle around the curve. If the common rail is on the other side it's harder; one approach is to slew the standard-gauge track across before the points: \ \ \ \ \ C\ \ \ \\---------O------ \ \ \--C /C -------X-------\---------// \ C--/ /--C \ //---- \ C/ ---------------------------O------ Note that the locations marked O do *not* have a point blade; the diverging rail ends short of the stock rail. Broad-gauge trains stay on the stock rail, while standard gauge ones are pulled across by the check rails. -- Clive D.W. Feather | Home: Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is: |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
"Paul Cummins" wrote in message
... In article , (John Rowland) wrote: Was there any device to prevent broad gauge trains attempting to go the wrong way? I would suggest that the lack of rail would have done the job most effectively. No, that would have prevented broad gauge trains from *succeeding* in going the wrong way. It wouldn't have stopped them from attempting and derailing, if the points on the shared rail were wrongly set. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
"Clive D. W. Feather" wrote in message
... In article , John Rowland writes Was there any device to prevent broad gauge trains attempting to go the wrong way? No broad gauge rail. The track would be something like this: snip Wow, thanks, that was service beyond the call of duty. All is now clear. I've always wondered if you type these ASCII diagrams by hand or if you have some program for doing them. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
In article , John Rowland
writes I've always wondered if you type these ASCII diagrams by hand or if you have some program for doing them. By hand. Though I've now done enough that I have a good feel for how to put them together. And vi is a very sharp tool. -- Clive D.W. Feather | Home: Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is: |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
John Rowland:
Was there any device to prevent broad gauge trains attempting to go the wrong way? Clive Feather: No broad gauge rail. The track would be something like this: \ \ \ \ \ C\ \ \ \\------------ \ \ \--C -------X-------\-------------- \ \ \ ------------------------------ A Irrespective of the setting of the points, the check rail C would pull a broad-gauge axle around the curve. Well, it would try to, but wouldn't the point at A try equally hard to put the wheel on the wrong side of the rail? Or is there something special about the bit of track on that side too? -- Mark Brader "People with whole brains, however, dispute Toronto this claim, and are generally more articulate in expressing their views." -- Gary Larson |
When was Praed Street Junction built?
In article , Mark Brader
writes [...] Irrespective of the setting of the points, the check rail C would pull a broad-gauge axle around the curve. Well, it would try to, but wouldn't the point at A try equally hard to put the wheel on the wrong side of the rail? Or is there something special about the bit of track on that side too? Argh, you're right. Fixed points, with a gap where the blade is, works to split the two gauges, but it doesn't work in conjunction with a turnout. Back to the drawing board. -- Clive D.W. Feather | Home: Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is: |
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