Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

The first L&SW trains to Kingston-on-Railway (nowadays Surbiton) were
notable for having people riding on top and people riding below.

Were they double-deckers?

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

On Thu, 18 Nov 04 02:55:07 GMT, (Charles
Ellson) wrote:

In article
"Troy Steadman" writes:

The first L&SW trains to Kingston-on-Railway (nowadays Surbiton) were
notable for having people riding on top and people riding below.

Were they double-deckers?

Don't some old pictures show passengers on top of the stage-coaches-on-rails
as used on early railways, not so much "on top" as at the ends.
There were double deck trains in Lonon in the 40s and has been
discussed on here before.
http://www.yellins.co.uk/transporthi...l/ddtrain.html

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"Martin WY" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 18 Nov 04 02:55:07 GMT, (Charles
Ellson) wrote:

In article
"Troy Steadman" writes:

The first L&SW trains to Kingston-on-Railway (nowadays Surbiton) were
notable for having people riding on top and people riding below.

Were they double-deckers?

Don't some old pictures show passengers on top of the
stage-coaches-on-rails
as used on early railways, not so much "on top" as at the ends.
There were double deck trains in Lonon in the 40s and has been
discussed on here before.
http://www.yellins.co.uk/transporthi...l/ddtrain.html


The Mumbles Railway had double-decked open-topped vehicles, which I rode on
as a small child. However, though this was called a 'railway', it was really
a cross between what the Americans refer to as an 'Interurban' and a
tramway. Almost all the 'main line' was on a reserved track to the side of
the main road to Mumbles. In the 1840s, some of the French companies used
open-topped double deck stock on Paris suburban services, which were
nicknamed 'Imperiales' as they appeared during the Second Empire- some of
them may have even survived until the 1930s in commercial service, whilst
there was a preserved example at the big SNCF exhibition in Paris last year.
As for examples on the UK main line railways, I would have thought the
loading gauge was a little restrictive.
Brian

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"BH Williams" wrote in message
...

The Mumbles Railway had double-decked open-topped vehicles, which I rode
on
as a small child. However, though this was called a 'railway', it was
really
a cross between what the Americans refer to as an 'Interurban' and a
tramway. Almost all the 'main line' was on a reserved track to the side of
the main road to Mumbles. In the 1840s, some of the French companies used
open-topped double deck stock on Paris suburban services, which were
nicknamed 'Imperiales' as they appeared during the Second Empire- some of
them may have even survived until the 1930s in commercial service, whilst
there was a preserved example at the big SNCF exhibition in Paris last
year.
As for examples on the UK main line railways, I would have thought the
loading gauge was a little restrictive.

I never realised that they had some open-toppers. I only rode it once, in
1951, and it was a fascinating experience, with two cars coupled together,
as I recall. How were the bow collectors mounted?
--
Terry Harper, Web Co-ordinator, The Omnibus Society
75th Anniversary 2004, see http://www.omnibussoc.org/75th.htm
E-mail:
URL: http://www.terry.harper.btinternet.co.uk/

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"Terry Harper" wrote in message
...
"BH Williams" wrote in message
...

The Mumbles Railway had double-decked open-topped vehicles, which I rode
on
as a small child. However, though this was called a 'railway', it was
really
a cross between what the Americans refer to as an 'Interurban' and a
tramway. Almost all the 'main line' was on a reserved track to the side
of
the main road to Mumbles. In the 1840s, some of the French companies used
open-topped double deck stock on Paris suburban services, which were
nicknamed 'Imperiales' as they appeared during the Second Empire- some of
them may have even survived until the 1930s in commercial service, whilst
there was a preserved example at the big SNCF exhibition in Paris last
year.
As for examples on the UK main line railways, I would have thought the
loading gauge was a little restrictive.

I never realised that they had some open-toppers. I only rode it once, in
1951, and it was a fascinating experience, with two cars coupled together,
as I recall. How were the bow collectors mounted?
--
Terry Harper, Web Co-ordinator, The Omnibus Society
75th Anniversary 2004, see http://www.omnibussoc.org/75th.htm
E-mail:
I was only four or five at the time and much more interested in the seats
which had backs that could be folded according to the direction of travel...
It was a great pity that none were preserved _ I believe one was at the
Middleton Railway, but got burnt. The Slow, Wicked and Terrible bus company
used the last bit of the route into Mumbles as a dedicated bus route
Brian

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

On Thu, 18 Nov 2004, BH Williams wrote:

[excessive quotage now snipped]

I was only four or five at the time and much more interested in the
seats which had backs that could be folded according to the
direction of travel...

Sounds like me as a toddler on the rare occasions I was taken on
Birmingham trams. Where can we see one of those today? We never
actually went to the terminus (Rednal, IIRC), and I was fascinated by
the idea of changing ends and reversing the seat backs.

But they'd been abolished before I was paying proper attention.

It was a great pity that none were preserved

Indeed. I wouldn't want the place to be overrun with antiques, but
we've plenty of scope for keeping a few. Works for me (the house is
from the 1880's, perhaps a bit earlier ;-)

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

In article ,
Troy Steadman wrote:
(Charles Ellson) wrote in message
...

Don't some old pictures show passengers on top of the stage-coaches-on-rails
as used on early railways, not so much "on top" as at the ends.

Yup, the old stagecoaches had a driver on top at the front and a
postillion (at least I've remembered that name even if I've no idea
how to spell it) at the back.

The early pictures of the L&SW show people perched on a seat outside
on the top front of each carriage in the direct line of the smoke.

"People" or "person" ? I'm not familar with the pictures you mention,
but ISTR some early railways had a brakeman in a "dicky seat" on the
outside of each vehicle - obviously borrowed from coaching practice !

Nick
--
http://www.leverton.org/ ... So express yourself ...

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"Nick Leverton" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Troy Steadman wrote:
(Charles Ellson) wrote in message
...

Don't some old pictures show passengers on top of the
stage-coaches-on-rails
as used on early railways, not so much "on top" as at the ends.

Yup, the old stagecoaches had a driver on top at the front and a
postillion (at least I've remembered that name even if I've no idea
how to spell it) at the back.

The early pictures of the L&SW show people perched on a seat outside
on the top front of each carriage in the direct line of the smoke.

"People" or "person" ? I'm not familar with the pictures you mention,
but ISTR some early railways had a brakeman in a "dicky seat" on the
outside of each vehicle - obviously borrowed from coaching practice !

Nick
--
http://www.leverton.org/ ... So express yourself ...
A practice which continued on some continental railways on freight trains
until relatively recent times- whilst the more recent ones were a covered
section of platform,housing a screw brake, I have seen stock from as
recently as the inter-war period where the cabin was raised sufficently for
the brakeman to have a view along the length of the train. The Southern
Railway built some four-wheel brakes for the Night Ferry which had a similar
feature, albeit in the middle of the vehicle.
Brian

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"JF" wrote in message
...

A few finger signposts around my part of Surrey survived the round-up of
cast iron signposts during the last war. The finger is usually about
three metres above ground level for the benefit of coach drivers.

--
James Follett. Novelist. (G1LXP)

What, so they could pick their noses as they passed by without having to
take their hands off the reins? :o)
--
Dave (Sgt. Pepper) Epsom, England
Nikon D2H / D100 / Coolpix 5700 / Canon Ixus 400 / Paintshop Pro 8
My photo galleries at http://www.pbase.com/davecq

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"BH Williams" wrote in message
...

A practice which continued on some continental railways on freight trains
until relatively recent times- whilst the more recent ones were a covered
section of platform,housing a screw brake, I have seen stock from as
recently as the inter-war period where the cabin was raised sufficently
for
the brakeman to have a view along the length of the train. The Southern
Railway built some four-wheel brakes for the Night Ferry which had a
similar
feature, albeit in the middle of the vehicle.

Hornby used to produce some French models of the vehicles with a brakeman's
cabin in the 1930s. I can remember seeing them in their catalogue, along
with a Nord 4-4-2 and CIWL cars.
--
Terry Harper, Web Co-ordinator, The Omnibus Society
75th Anniversary 2004, see http://www.omnibussoc.org/75th.htm
E-mail:
URL: http://www.terry.harper.btinternet.co.uk/

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

Alan J. Flavell wrote to uk.transport.london on Thu, 18 Nov 2004:

Sounds like me as a toddler on the rare occasions I was taken on
Birmingham trams. Where can we see one of those today? We never
actually went to the terminus (Rednal, IIRC), and I was fascinated by
the idea of changing ends and reversing the seat backs.

Me, I was fascinated by those on the Star Ferry in Hong Kong when I was
the mother of a toddler, never mind being one!
--
"Mrs Redboots"
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/
Website updated 6 November 2004 with new photos

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"Alan J. Flavell" wrote in message . gla.ac.uk...
On Thu, 18 Nov 2004, BH Williams wrote:

[excessive quotage now snipped]

I was only four or five at the time and much more interested in the
seats which had backs that could be folded according to the
direction of travel...

Sounds like me as a toddler on the rare occasions I was taken on
Birmingham trams. Where can we see one of those today? We never
actually went to the terminus (Rednal, IIRC), and I was fascinated by
the idea of changing ends and reversing the seat backs.

But they'd been abolished before I was paying proper attention.

It was a great pity that none were preserved

Doesn't the Black Country Museum have a tram from that part of the
World on its system? I seem to remember that they ran on track of a
narrower gauge than standard, but I can't remember what it was.

Many of the modern trains on New Jersey Transit have reversible backs.

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

In message , Stephen
Furley writes
"Alan J. Flavell" wrote in message news:Pine.LN
.. .
On Thu, 18 Nov 2004, BH Williams wrote:

[excessive quotage now snipped]

I was only four or five at the time and much more interested in the
seats which had backs that could be folded according to the
direction of travel...

Sounds like me as a toddler on the rare occasions I was taken on
Birmingham trams. Where can we see one of those today? We never
actually went to the terminus (Rednal, IIRC), and I was fascinated by
the idea of changing ends and reversing the seat backs.

But they'd been abolished before I was paying proper attention.

It was a great pity that none were preserved

Doesn't the Black Country Museum have a tram from that part of the
World on its system?
Well, they have three trams two "Tividale" type single deckers (of which
one, 5, is no longer operational and the other, 34, provides the
mainstay of the Museum service). A Wolverhampton District car (49) has
also recently entered service but is used sparingly.

I seem to remember that they ran on track of a
narrower gauge than standard, but I can't remember what it was.
It was 3' 6" (or 1067mm).

Only one complete Birmingham tram remains in existence, car 395, which
is now on display at Think Tank, Birmingham's Science and Technology
Museum.

Although they are very close (and shared a common tramway gauge (with
connections) it is worth mentioning that Birmingham and the Black
Country are very different area with much (friendly!) local rivalry.
People from one area get slightly huffy at being mistaken for natives of
the "other" area. For that reason alone, I suspect that seeing 395
restored to operational condition and operated on the Museum line at the
Black Country Museum would be very unlikely. That said, I would dearly
*love* to see it done!

Many of the modern trains on New Jersey Transit have reversible backs.
As do trains on the Sydney system, the only place I've ever seen that on
a railway.
--
Ian Jelf, MITG, Birmingham, UK
Registered "Blue Badge" Tourist Guide for
London & the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

"Stephen Furley" wrote in message
...
"Alan J. Flavell" wrote in message
. gla.ac.uk...
On Thu, 18 Nov 2004, BH Williams wrote:

[excessive quotage now snipped]

I was only four or five at the time and much more interested in the
seats which had backs that could be folded according to the
direction of travel...

Sounds like me as a toddler on the rare occasions I was taken on
Birmingham trams. Where can we see one of those today? We never
actually went to the terminus (Rednal, IIRC), and I was fascinated by
the idea of changing ends and reversing the seat backs.

But they'd been abolished before I was paying proper attention.

It was a great pity that none were preserved

Doesn't the Black Country Museum have a tram from that part of the
World on its system? I seem to remember that they ran on track of a
narrower gauge than standard, but I can't remember what it was.

Many of the modern trains on New Jersey Transit have reversible backs.

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?
 

Trivia: Victorian double-decker trains?