Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

NO 2 mins, even then you still contact the LC, there maybe a train with
problems ahead, the most likely cause of a red signal is a train ahead.

Boltar wrote:
the driver what the problem is. Therefore the driver cannot be "given
permission". S/He waits one minute and if the signal fails to clear there is
a standing instruction to proceed. This is the "stop and proceed" rule.


So in other words the driver should only wait for 1 minute at any red
light
since the line controllers don't have a clue whats going on and
wouldn't
know if train A was in front of train B. In which case how come I've
been
in trains stuck at non broken red lights for up to 10 minutes at
various times?

Perhaps its about time LU moved into the 20th century , never mind the
21st and actually had electronic line maps in the controllers rooms so
they
had a bloody clue where the trains on the line they're controlling
actually are.

B2003

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

What has caused the signal to fail, if it's a broken rail then you can
drive my A60 at normal line speed! is it a bike, shopping trolley etc on
the track, I'm sure Boltar that you would be the first to complain if an
accident occurred by a driver using your mad method of passing a signal
failure.

Boltar wrote:
They tried the system where trains set off at 2 minute gaps without the
hindereance of signals about 100 years ago.....too many crashes....You might
be a bit late for a meeting or dinner...but this is safe.


I'm not suggesting ignoring signals, I'm just trying to figure out the
logic
behind the system they use now. Signal has failed so go slow across the
next 2 working signals. Don't get it. Signals don't fail to green
(supposedly)
so if the signal after the failed one is green why on earth go slow
past it,
why not just go normal line speed? It just seems OTT.

B2003

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

On Wed, 1 Jun 2005, General Von Clinkerhoffen wrote:

What has caused the signal to fail, if it's a broken rail then you can
drive my A60 at normal line speed! is it a bike, shopping trolley etc on
the track, I'm sure Boltar that you would be the first to complain if an
accident occurred by a driver using your mad method of passing a signal
failure.

Easy, what you need is (a) a cow-catcher and (b) off-road tyres. Bloody
LU, can't even handle the simplest things! :)

tom

--
Gatsos are a stealth tax on motorists in the same way that city centre video cameras are a stealth tax on muggers and DNA testing is a stealth tax on rapists. -- Guy Chapman

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

What has caused the signal to fail, if it's a broken rail then you can
drive my A60 at normal line speed! is it a bike, shopping trolley etc on
the track, I'm sure Boltar that you would be the first to complain if an
accident occurred by a driver using your mad method of passing a signal
failure.

So LU signalling is so advanced it can detect stuff on the tracks? I'm
impressed. And I'm talking about passing a signal at line speed when
the signal is green , not red. You'd have already passed the broken
signal. Unless you're implying that signals actually protect the next
block but one ahead?

B2003

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

No its not that advanced, but stuff on the tracks are one reason for
there being a signal failure.

End of conversation, Goodbye BOLTAR YOU PRAT

Boltar wrote:
What has caused the signal to fail, if it's a broken rail then you can
drive my A60 at normal line speed! is it a bike, shopping trolley etc on
the track, I'm sure Boltar that you would be the first to complain if an
accident occurred by a driver using your mad method of passing a signal
failure.


So LU signalling is so advanced it can detect stuff on the tracks? I'm
impressed. And I'm talking about passing a signal at line speed when
the signal is green , not red. You'd have already passed the broken
signal. Unless you're implying that signals actually protect the next
block but one ahead?

B2003

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

No its not that advanced, but stuff on the tracks are one reason for
there being a signal failure.

If its shorts out the circuit by accident yes, if it doesn't then it
won't
will it. I'm not sure a large block of wood on the tracks will be
detected, unless its a special wood from Iron Trees that perhaps
grow in your back garden.

End of conversation, Goodbye BOLTAR YOU PRAT

Not sure that quite answers my 2nd point but I hope you feel
better soon. Btw , the caplock is the middle key on the left , you
might want to press it again.

B2003

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

In message , Clive D. W. Feather
writes
I don't believe there are any photos on my web site showing it, but
I've certainly seen a signal stay green after a train has passed it
until it reaches the overlap block joint. On the Silverlink lines there
are places where, because of this, a single class 313 can disappear
around a bend before the station starting signal goes back to red.
A lot of years ago, track circuits set signals to red before the track
controlled by the signal was occupied. I seem to remember it was speed
and therefore distance sensitive on LU, but by a fixed 200yds on BR. for
the circuits themselves but about one and a half car lengths to reset
the signal to danger.
--
Clive

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

In article , Clive
writes
A lot of years ago, track circuits set signals to red before the track
controlled by the signal was occupied. I seem to remember it was speed
and therefore distance sensitive on LU, but by a fixed 200yds on BR.
for the circuits themselves but about one and a half car lengths to
reset the signal to danger.

Sorry, but this makes no sense to me. You can't set the signal to red
before the train passes it in case the train stops at the signal.

It sounds like you're misunderstanding how overlaps work. These are,
indeed, 183m (200 yards) on ex-BR and speed-related on LU.

--
Clive D.W. Feather | Home:
Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org
Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work:
Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is:

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

On Wed, 8 Jun 2005, Clive D. W. Feather wrote:

In article , Clive
writes

A lot of years ago, track circuits set signals to red before the track
controlled by the signal was occupied. I seem to remember it was speed
and therefore distance sensitive on LU, but by a fixed 200yds on BR.
for the circuits themselves but about one and a half car lengths to
reset the signal to danger.

Sorry, but this makes no sense to me. You can't set the signal to red
before the train passes it in case the train stops at the signal.

He didn't say it turns red before the train passes the signal, he said it
does so "before the track controlled by the signal was occupied", which,
if you take 'track controlled by the signal' to mean the section entry
into which is controlled by the signal, which seems reasonable, is exactly
what an overlap does.

Unless, of course, i've misunderstood it as well!

tom

--
All we need now is a little energon and a lotta luck

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

In message , Clive D. W. Feather
writes
Sorry, but this makes no sense to me. You can't set the signal to red
before the train passes it in case the train stops at the signal.

It sounds like you're misunderstanding how overlaps work. These are,
indeed, 183m (200 yards) on ex-BR and speed-related on LU.
Maybe I phrased it wrongly. Whilst I agree about the overlaps, a
separate circuit set the signal to red, independent of the track
circuit, after about one and a half cars had passed the signal.
--
Clive

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

In message , Clive
writes

Sorry, but this makes no sense to me. You can't set the signal to red
before the train passes it in case the train stops at the signal.

It sounds like you're misunderstanding how overlaps work. These are,
indeed, 183m (200 yards) on ex-BR and speed-related on LU.
Maybe I phrased it wrongly. Whilst I agree about the overlaps, a
separate circuit set the signal to red, independent of the track
circuit, after about one and a half cars had passed the signal.

From my training: There is an additional block joint known as the
'replacement block joint' which replaces a signal to danger even though
the train hasn't actually reached the section being protected by that
signal. This is so that the signal can't show a green aspect behind a
train.

This applies to LU - I'm not familiar with the 'big trains' to know if
they do the same, although from my limited experience it's not uncommon
for a signal to still show green after a train has passed a signal on
Railtrack.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

Why can't LU cope with a signal failure?
 

"Steve Fitzgerald" ] wrote in message
...
This applies to LU - I'm not familiar with the 'big trains' to know if
they do the same, although from my limited experience it's not uncommon
for a signal to still show green after a train has passed a signal on
Railtrack.

Depends entirely on the location. On plain line it's not uncommon for there
to be only one track circuit per section, and the train can be quite a
distance past the signal until it goes red. In junction layouts it tends to
be much more immediate. I suspect that there is a standard that says new
installations must have a replacing circuit, BICBW.