For those fans of the Routemaster, Route 38 or those who wish to sample
the last really large scale RM operation in London then the last day is
this Friday 28 October 2005.

There will be a fair sprinkling of additional special vehicles running
too. Details via www.lots.org.uk and click on 38 / 159 button.

Shame it looks like rain :-(
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Paul Corfield wrote:
For those fans of the Routemaster, Route 38 or those who wish to sample
the last really large scale RM operation in London then the last day is
this Friday 28 October 2005.

There will be a fair sprinkling of additional special vehicles running
too. Details via www.lots.org.uk and click on 38 / 159 button.

Then retire to The Old Red Lion for a celebration of the Number 38.

http://www.oldredliontheatre.co.uk/tlml/pubevents

--
Mark Etherington

Mark Etherington wrote:
Paul Corfield wrote:
For those fans of the Routemaster, Route 38 or those who wish to sample
the last really large scale RM operation in London then the last day is
this Friday 28 October 2005.

There will be a fair sprinkling of additional special vehicles running
too. Details via www.lots.org.uk and click on 38 / 159 button.

Then retire to The Old Red Lion for a celebration of the Number 38.

http://www.oldredliontheatre.co.uk/tlml/pubevents

--
Mark Etherington


Just a quick word of thanks to all those who made the last day of
Routemasters on the route 38 on Friday such a memorable occasion.

My abiding memory, apart from a lovely journey on RMF1254 (the first
time I had travelled on this fine bus - complete with Sung yellow
ceilings and red moquette seats!) - will the the utter astonishment and
disappointment expressed by every single "non enthusiast" to whom I
spoke, that they are losing their Routemasters. The hordes of "ordinary
people", for whose views Ken Livingstone, Peter Hendy-Bendy and their
cohorts do not give a fig. The "ordinary" people of London being so
badly served by their "elected" representatives. They should all hang
their heads in shame like the monstrous morons (Ken's phrase, not
mine!) they are.

And the best of luck to all the staff (still so freindly and helpful to
the last) from Clapton Garage who will lose their jobs as a result of
this "progress".

Marc.

In message .com,
" writes
Just a quick word of thanks to all those who made the last day of
Routemasters on the route 38 on Friday such a memorable occasion.

I'll second that. I wasn't working on Friday and wasn't even due to be
in London but I travelled down for the day. The 38 has been a "friend"
of mine for as long as I've worked regularly in London (along with the
9, 11 and 15), although I've never gone out as far as Clapton Pond on it
before.

My abiding memory, apart from a lovely journey on RMF1254 (the first
time I had travelled on this fine bus - complete with Sung yellow
ceilings and red moquette seats!) -
Yes, that was my high point, too. I travelled on it on the 1141 (?)
from Victoria to Hackney Bus Garage and wonderful it was, too.

will the the utter astonishment and
disappointment expressed by every single "non enthusiast" to whom I
spoke, that they are losing their Routemasters.
Disappointment yes but astonishment no. I've been surprised by how
"Interested" and "up to date" people are with the RM withdrawal. As
Marc says ordinary people were snapping pictures on their mobiles and
calling friends to tell them. I've never seen anything bus related so
"grab" the attention of ordinary people (or should that be "the man on
the Clapham Omnibus"?!) before. I think it must be similar to the
attention which accompanied the passing of the trams.

I wonder if we'll get "Last Routemaster Week: on 9 December we say
goodbye to London" posters?

And the best of luck to all the staff (still so freindly and helpful to
the last) from Clapton Garage who will lose their jobs as a result of
this "progress".
There was a very pleasant chap (who normally works at Tottenham)
conducting on a journey I took southbound along Rosebery Avenue.

But staff at Victoria Bus Station were becoming *very* exasperated with
the number of photographers in the morning. Not many seemed to be
doing anything wrong like spilling into the roadway (not that I saw
anyway). Another chap and I took a couple of photographs from one of the
raised islands facing the entrance to the bus station. As I left,
three TfL (?) staff asked him to move and - when he questioned why -
gave him a bit of verbal about health & safety. I wouldn't say he was
doing anything wrong but just the sheer numbers of photographers around
seemed to be worrying them. I didn't returned to the bus station until
into the evening. There were still a lot of people around snapping
away then but they weren't attracting any attention from staff. Maybe
they'd just become accustomed to their bus station being invaded! :-)

I can certainly see why they're looking at ending the 159 in the middle
of the day, though.

I rounded off the day taking some night shots from the island in the
middle of Victoria Street, looking north along Buckingham Palace Road.
Whoever the gentleman was with whom I shared ten minutes of pleasant and
non-anorak conversation, thank you for your company if you're reading
this!

Anyway, the TfL, company and special vehicle staff laid on a great show
and did us proud. I'd like to say here how grateful I for one was to
all of them.
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

On Sat, 29 Oct 2005 19:47:28 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

In message .com,
" writes
Just a quick word of thanks to all those who made the last day of
Routemasters on the route 38 on Friday such a memorable occasion.

I'll second that. I wasn't working on Friday and wasn't even due to be
in London but I travelled down for the day. The 38 has been a "friend"
of mine for as long as I've worked regularly in London (along with the
9, 11 and 15), although I've never gone out as far as Clapton Pond on it
before.

And thirded. The 38 has also been a friend to me from when I first moved
to London and when it still ran to Leyton as I lived 5 minutes from Lea
Bridge Road. Even when curtailed to Clapton I've used it many a time in
preference to the Tube as I also used to do with the 73.

My abiding memory, apart from a lovely journey on RMF1254 (the first
time I had travelled on this fine bus - complete with Sung yellow
ceilings and red moquette seats!) -
Yes, that was my high point, too. I travelled on it on the 1141 (?)
from Victoria to Hackney Bus Garage and wonderful it was, too.

I managed to grab a ride from Piccadilly to Clapton on RT3062 which was
bursting at the seams for almost the whole trip with enthusiasts, normal
commuters and people out to sample a taste of history [1].

will the the utter astonishment and
disappointment expressed by every single "non enthusiast" to whom I
spoke, that they are losing their Routemasters.
Disappointment yes but astonishment no. I've been surprised by how
"Interested" and "up to date" people are with the RM withdrawal. As
Marc says ordinary people were snapping pictures on their mobiles and
calling friends to tell them. I've never seen anything bus related so
"grab" the attention of ordinary people (or should that be "the man on
the Clapham Omnibus"?!) before. I think it must be similar to the
attention which accompanied the passing of the trams.

I think some people were a bit surprised - certainly one lady who sat
beside me on the RT was initially bemused at it all but I think the
significance sank in when I explained it was a moment in history and
she'd never get a conductor bus back home to Hackney again.

It felt very like the last day of the 73 to me. Plenty of locals took
the opportunity then for a last ride and a photograph and this was
repeated for the 38. A fair proportion of the locals in Hackney wondered
what was going on and asked about it - all of them were not necessarily
surprised but all of them wanted the Routemasters to stay or had fond
memories of them.

The Arriva staff at Clapton were wonderfully patient when I was there in
the morning and they'd taken the very sensible step of establishing a
small cordon which allowed people into the edge of the depot to take
pictures. A nice and sensible touch.

I wonder if we'll get "Last Routemaster Week: on 9 December we say
goodbye to London" posters?

And the best of luck to all the staff (still so freindly and helpful to
the last) from Clapton Garage who will lose their jobs as a result of
this "progress".
There was a very pleasant chap (who normally works at Tottenham)
conducting on a journey I took southbound along Rosebery Avenue.

I took a ride on the 38 to work earlier the week to "sample" it on a
normal day. I've done this for the 19 and 73 as well because they're all
"on the line of route" for my journey to work. The conductor who worked
that journey was around on Friday. As his bus was about to pull off from
Clapton garage one of his colleagues wished him a happy retirement and
gave him a big hug. As the bus left the colleague nearly had tears in
his eyes as he went back to wait for his bus. I found that very touching
and it seemed to bring home the human element of what these changes mean
- a way of working and a set of relationships will never be the same
again.

But staff at Victoria Bus Station were becoming *very* exasperated with
the number of photographers in the morning. Not many seemed to be
doing anything wrong like spilling into the roadway (not that I saw
anyway). Another chap and I took a couple of photographs from one of the
raised islands facing the entrance to the bus station. As I left,
three TfL (?) staff asked him to move and - when he questioned why -
gave him a bit of verbal about health & safety. I wouldn't say he was
doing anything wrong but just the sheer numbers of photographers around
seemed to be worrying them.

This is a difficult issue really. Some enthusiasts forget themselves
completely and act in a silly manner. While I understand how their
interest or desire to get a picture can "take over" it won't be much use
if they are dead or on the way to hospital. The transport system isn't a
museum or an entertainment show - it still has to get people from a to b
even on a day like Friday. Therefore someone has to try to ensure safety
and to keep the buses on the move. On the other hand some TfL inspectors
are appalling and heavy handed. I "did" Victoria very briefly on
Thursday and stayed away on Friday as I'd seen what happened on the last
days of the 36 when things started to get a bit silly.

I also saw a police car turn up at Clapton garage late afternoon as I
went past in the RT. I hope that was not a result of anything to do with
the "event".

I did contemplate going to Clapton to see the very last bus arrive but
decided against it simply because of the unpredictability of the
situation. Some of the previous last days have been marred by negativity
from a small number of enthusiasts who seem to view the end of the
Routemasters as the end of civilisation. I don't wish to be associated
with that sort of reaction as it can simply put at risk any future
events.

I can certainly see why they're looking at ending the 159 in the middle
of the day, though.

The 159 is going to be very difficult. Just taking into account the poor
photographic conditions with diminishing light and long shadows will be
hard enough. I dread to think what it will be like if it rains or is
very dull. While the 159 will be "last" it doesn't feel as special for
me as the 38. The only real bits of the 159 that are worth capturing are
views on Westminster Bridge with Big Ben and the river in shot as they
are a truly iconic London combination. While I may well be out on the
day for the specials on the Thursday I doubt very much that the Friday
will be even worth contemplating given the progressive switch over and
the likely enormous demand for last rides. If the last bus is at
lunchtime then I may try to get a last look - we shall see.

Anyway, the TfL, company and special vehicle staff laid on a great show
and did us proud. I'd like to say here how grateful I for one was to
all of them.

It was certainly a good day and we were thankfully spared the weather
horrors that were forecast which was a distinct bonus.

[1] a mum with her two young daughters. She wasn't looking forward to
bendy buses.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

In message , Paul Corfield
writes
It felt very like the last day of the 73 to me.
I wasn't able to make that day. It's made me more determined since to
try to do my farewells, work and family commitments permitting.

The Arriva staff at Clapton were wonderfully patient when I was there in
the morning and they'd taken the very sensible step of establishing a
small cordon which allowed people into the edge of the depot to take
pictures. A nice and sensible touch.
I noticed that and wondered if that's what it was.

Is the traffic in the Northern (Southbound only) section of Mare Street
*always* that bad in the middle of the day? Or was it caused by the RM
festivities? Or by something else?

I took a ride on the 38 to work earlier the week to "sample" it on a
normal day. I've done this for the 19 and 73 as well because they're all
"on the line of route" for my journey to work. The conductor who worked
that journey was around on Friday. As his bus was about to pull off from
Clapton garage one of his colleagues wished him a happy retirement and
gave him a big hug. As the bus left the colleague nearly had tears in
his eyes as he went back to wait for his bus. I found that very touching
and it seemed to bring home the human element of what these changes mean
- a way of working and a set of relationships will never be the same
again.
For various reasons, none of them sentimental, I can foresee the
reintroduction of conductors or something rather like them at some point
in the future.

But staff at Victoria Bus Station were becoming *very* exasperated with
the number of photographers in the morning. Not many seemed to be
doing anything wrong like spilling into the roadway (not that I saw
anyway). Another chap and I took a couple of photographs from one of the
raised islands facing the entrance to the bus station. As I left,
three TfL (?) staff asked him to move and - when he questioned why -
gave him a bit of verbal about health & safety. I wouldn't say he was
doing anything wrong but just the sheer numbers of photographers around
seemed to be worrying them.

This is a difficult issue really. Some enthusiasts forget themselves
completely and act in a silly manner.
I;ve seen that before (and cringed). I didn't really see it on Friday.
But the numbers were obviously an issue.

While I understand how their
interest or desire to get a picture can "take over" it won't be much use
if they are dead or on the way to hospital. The transport system isn't a
museum or an entertainment show - it still has to get people from a to b
even on a day like Friday.
Absolutely what was going through my mind.

Therefore someone has to try to ensure safety
and to keep the buses on the move. On the other hand some TfL inspectors
are appalling and heavy handed.
There is in the transport industry a sometimes quite unpleasant dislike
of those who (usually quite harmlessly) enjoy looking at or
photographing vehicles. I;ve heard a lot of abuse from coach drivers
with whom I've been working when we've encountered enthusiasts. (I
usually keep my interest to myself when working!)

I "did" Victoria very briefly on
Thursday and stayed away on Friday as I'd seen what happened on the last
days of the 36 when things started to get a bit silly.
Victoria BS doesn't lend itself to this sort of thing, does it?

The 159 is going to be very difficult. Just taking into account the poor
photographic conditions with diminishing light and long shadows will be
hard enough. I dread to think what it will be like if it rains or is
very dull. While the 159 will be "last" it doesn't feel as special for
me as the 38. The only real bits of the 159 that are worth capturing are
views on Westminster Bridge with Big Ben and the river in shot as they
are a truly iconic London combination.
I would have liked to see the Heritage 9 or 15 extended down Whitehall
either to Parliament Square or even across Westminster Bridge to serve
the London Eye. These are the two "missing icons" from the repertoire
enjoyed by these routes.

I wonder how they'll fare? Given the interest in varied "special"
vehicles turning up for these "last day" commemorations, I wonder if
there'll be mileage (no pun intended) in doing that on the heritage
Routes from time to time? Maybe a London equivalent of Fleetwood's
"Tram Sunday"?
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

Hello

I was fortunate to have this week off from work which meant that I got into
London on the Thursday to sample them on the last 'normal' day and even
then, the photographers were out in force!

I must say there was a very courteous and gentlemanly atmosphere at the head
of the 38 lane at Victoria on the Thursday between us various photographers
who were there.

My regular journey from Vic to Museum Street was one of the few highlights
of London, standing on the rear platform from the New Oxford Street traffic
lights around the curve into the Museum Street stop.

I also made it up on the Friday to witness the amazing festivities. Pics
here BTW:
http://gallery42239.fotopic.net/c741890.html

I tended to concentrate on the 'ordinary' RM's and RML's about but got
plenty of the specials as well.

Best moment was the point when I was on a traffic island about halfway
between Green Park and Piccadilly and the bus lane at one point was filled
with a glut of nothing but half cab RT's RM' etc.

Lowest point of the day (apart from my fourth and last run to Museum Street
again!) was the pratt in the parcel company van who pulled in onto double
yellows in the middle of Piccadilly alongside the bus lane and wrecked the
one decent camera angle view just as a whole line of RMLs and RTs was
approaching. Does our friends at the Met Police no longer employ traffic
wardens anymore?

Being followed by the RMF as far as Shaftesbury Avenue was an interesting
experience, especially watching as people tried to board at the back only to
find no platform!!

Well done to one and all on a memorable event. Sadly I will not be able to
attend the last day of the 159 (As it is all being ditched by lunchtime, no
doubt amid a lunatic media frenzy) I feel there may not be much point
anyway.

I did take a ride to Museum Street on the 38 on Saturday as well, front seat
in the Bendy as well. Oh dear....

If anyone can explain the logic in replacing a seventy seater vehicle with a
forty nine seater vehicle (less than that with standing passengers in the
way so you cannot get to them in reality) and expecting the majority to
stand (up to a 100!) is beyond me. Since when had making the vast majority
of your passengers stand all the way been an 'improvement'? At least the 8
went over to proper double deckers!

Regards
John M Upton

My Fotopic Collections:
South Central/Southern, Model Railway & Other Rail Pictures:
http://gallery39764.fotopic.net/

Bus Pics:
http://gallery42239.fotopic.net/

"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
news
The 38 has also been a friend to me from when I first moved
to London and when it still ran to Leyton as I lived 5 minutes from
Lea Bridge Road. Even when curtailed to Clapton I've used it
many a time in preference to the Tube as I also used to do
with the 73.

It's one of those routes that crosses so many other routes en-route that
many many people have got used to the sight of it.

I managed to grab a ride from Piccadilly to Clapton on RT3062 which was
bursting at the seams for almost the whole trip with enthusiasts, normal
commuters and people out to sample a taste of history [1].

There were a lot of normal, ordinary people out and about who wanted to
witness the death knell of a 'proper' bus in their area. Many of them
weren't making special trips, they were just doing what they do anyway.

The Arriva staff at Clapton were wonderfully patient when I was there in
the morning and they'd taken the very sensible step of establishing a
small cordon which allowed people into the edge of the depot to take
pictures. A nice and sensible touch.

Definately a sensible approach and just the right amount of room during the
day, although it did take a little while for everyone to disperse after the
final return to the garage and photocall.

I took a ride on the 38 to work earlier the week to "sample" it on a
normal day. I've done this for the 19 and 73 as well because they're all
"on the line of route" for my journey to work. The conductor who worked
that journey was around on Friday. As his bus was about to pull off from
Clapton garage one of his colleagues wished him a happy retirement and
gave him a big hug. As the bus left the colleague nearly had tears in
his eyes as he went back to wait for his bus. I found that very touching
and it seemed to bring home the human element of what these changes mean
- a way of working and a set of relationships will never be the same
again.

That's the side of things a lot of people forget about; it's not the buses
themselves disappearing which is the most tragic thing, it's the whole
experience, which is (was) only made possible by the people who worked the
buses. I have no idea whether the conductors have all simply been made
redundant or what the arrangements are, such as offering other jobs within
the company etc. Ditto the drivers, did they lose their jobs if they didn't
want to get bent?

I also saw a police car turn up at Clapton garage late afternoon as I
went past in the RT. I hope that was not a result of anything to do with
the "event".

I think there was an incident on Mare Street itself at around half four, not
within the garage or Bohemia Place.

I did contemplate going to Clapton to see the very last bus arrive but
decided against it simply because of the unpredictability of the
situation. Some of the previous last days have been marred by negativity
from a small number of enthusiasts who seem to view the end of the
Routemasters as the end of civilisation. I don't wish to be associated
with that sort of reaction as it can simply put at risk any future
events.

From where I was, it all seemed to pass off quite well. Everyone remained
behind the tape until the last bus arrived, then the staff set them up for a
quick photocall, and everyone was happy. They began to try and get everyone
to leave and someone did say someone had stolen something from a bus itself,
but I wouldn't be surprised if that was simply a coaxer to try and get
everyone there to go home! I was well back, so don't know, but all in all it
seemed very well organised and remained so.

"Ian Jelf" wrote in message
...
In message , Paul Corfield
writes

Is the traffic in the Northern (Southbound only) section of Mare Street
*always* that bad in the middle of the day? Or was it caused by the RM
festivities? Or by something else?

No, it's always that bad! Just as bad this afternoon. Actually, slightly
worse because of a bendy bus having issues with the rear doors which
wouldn't close (don't know if someone used the emergency button to jump off)
and it was stuck at the Northern end of Mare Street with the driver opening
and closing all doors to try and get them to close. -eventually- they did..
Make me wonder - presumably there's an interlock which prevents the bus from
moving until the doors are closed? Long queue behind that bus though!

I "did" Victoria very briefly on
Thursday and stayed away on Friday as I'd seen what happened on the last
days of the 36 when things started to get a bit silly.

Victoria BS doesn't lend itself to this sort of thing, does it?

I didn't think the garage entrance would on Friday, but actually it did so
very well, thanks to the staff cordening off the sides for safe access.

"JMUpton2000" securitynovels @ freeuk.com wrote in message
eenews.net...

Lowest point of the day (apart from my fourth and last run to Museum
Street
again!) was the pratt in the parcel company van who pulled in onto double
yellows in the middle of Piccadilly alongside the bus lane and wrecked the
one decent camera angle view just as a whole line of RMLs and RTs was
approaching.

To be honest, there were a lot of people with cameras (this is not directed
at you personally) who thought they had the ultimate right to get 'their
shot' and nothing else mattered. To me, people, vehicles etc., that are
visible or prevent 100% visibility of the thing you are photographing only
add to the image - they help make it real. A couple of the nicest photos I
got have actually got people 'in the way' some might say, but they actually
give a nice dose of reality.

Well done to one and all on a memorable event. Sadly I will not be able to
attend the last day of the 159 (As it is all being ditched by lunchtime,
no
doubt amid a lunatic media frenzy) I feel there may not be much point
anyway.

I think effectively splitting the end of the 159 across two days is a very
sensible decision. Certainly more sensible than the decision to end their
use.

I did take a ride to Museum Street on the 38 on Saturday as well, front
seat
in the Bendy as well. Oh dear....

If anyone can explain the logic in replacing a seventy seater vehicle with
a
forty nine seater vehicle (less than that with standing passengers in the
way so you cannot get to them in reality) and expecting the majority to
stand (up to a 100!) is beyond me. Since when had making the vast
majority
of your passengers stand all the way been an 'improvement'? At least the
8
went over to proper double deckers!

The ASA have already agreed it is not an improvement, hence the replacement
tag line on TfL literature. No longer getting better from every angle!