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DLR City Airport Extension
Does anyone know what the opening date for the new DLR extension is
yet? Im looking forward to taking my kids to Thames Barrier Park on it. Rob Smith |
DLR City Airport Extension
ROBSM wrote:
Does anyone know what the opening date for the new DLR extension is yet? Im looking forward to taking my kids to Thames Barrier Park on it. Rob Smith Dave Arquati thinks the opening date is 16 December 2005, but I wouldn't be surprised if it opened a few days early, or even a few weeks early! |
DLR City Airport Extension
"TheOneKEA" wrote in message
ups.com... Dave Arquati thinks the opening date is 16 December 2005, but I wouldn't be surprised if it opened a few days early, or even a few weeks early! According to http://www.londonbusroutes.net/changes.htm , the 69 is being cut short to Canning Town on the 17th December, so they must be fairly confident the line will be open by then. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
DLR City Airport Extension
On 4 Nov 2005 01:22:10 -0800, "ROBSM" wrote:
Does anyone know what the opening date for the new DLR extension is yet? Im looking forward to taking my kids to Thames Barrier Park on it. Rob Smith The date I'd heard was Thursday 15th December, however a new timetable will be launched in Friday 18th November - presumably this will be the timetable that includes running to LCY. My guess is that from 18 Nov trains will run empty between Canning Town and King George V, with passenger service introduced mid-December. When the Lewisham extension opened, passenger running was introduced without fanfare mid-morning on a Saturday. The press & VIP opening was two days later. Al Holmes |
DLR City Airport Extension
"ROBSM" wrote in message
ups.com... Does anyone know what the opening date for the new DLR extension is yet? Im looking forward to taking my kids to Thames Barrier Park on it. On the basis that Bank is probably a convenient station for most people to change to the DLR, it looks like a hell of a schlep to get to LCA. I think I'll still avoid it, and use Gatwick or Heathrow. Ian |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Ian F.
writes On the basis that Bank is probably a convenient station for most people to change to the DLR, it looks like a hell of a schlep to get to LCA. Why? The direct service is 22 minutes (no changing). I think I'll still avoid it, and use Gatwick or Heathrow. You can get from Bank to Gatwick or Heathrow in less than 22 minutes? boggle -- Paul Terry |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message . com, ROBSM
writes Does anyone know what the opening date for the new DLR extension is yet? 15th December, according to the London City Airport website. -- Paul Terry |
DLR City Airport Extension
On the basis that Bank is probably a convenient station for most people to change to the DLR, it looks like a hell of a schlep to get to LCA. Why? The direct service is 22 minutes (no changing). I think I'll still avoid it, and use Gatwick or Heathrow. You can get from Bank to Gatwick or Heathrow in less than 22 minutes? boggle Even without the DLR connection the experience of using LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. |
DLR City Airport Extension
"Paul Terry" wrote in message
... Why? The direct service is 22 minutes (no changing). It doesn't seem on the map http://www.tfl.gov.uk/dlr/pdf/network/zones.pdf as though there is a direct service. If so, that makes a difference, yes. You can get from Bank to Gatwick or Heathrow in less than 22 minutes? boggle Heh! No, but it would take me 30 mins to get to Bank and then another, allegedly, 22 to get to LC. I can get to Gatwick by overground train in about 30 minutes. Ian |
DLR City Airport Extension
"TKD" wrote in message
... Even without the DLR connection the experience of using LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. I like airports. I find LCY a tad dull. Ian |
DLR City Airport Extension
On Sat, 5 Nov 2005 11:35:58 -0000, "Ian F."
wrote: "TKD" wrote in message ... Even without the DLR connection the experience of using LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. I like airports. I find LCY a tad dull. I think airports are fascinating from an operational viewpoint. I hate using them though as they are so inefficient in terms of the passengers time - unless you run everything to the wire in terms of check in etc. -- Paul C Admits to working for London Underground! |
DLR City Airport Extension
It was a dark and stormy night when TKD wrote in
article ... On the basis that Bank is probably a convenient station for most people to change to the DLR, it looks like a hell of a schlep to get to LCA. Why? The direct service is 22 minutes (no changing). I think I'll still avoid it, and use Gatwick or Heathrow. You can get from Bank to Gatwick or Heathrow in less than 22 minutes? boggle Even without the DLR connection the experience of using LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. Agreed, in spades. Plus, the view as you take off over the docks and circle over London at low level is quite stunning. |
DLR City Airport Extension
Even without the DLR connection the experience of using LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. I like airports. I find LCY a tad dull. Ah ok. I like being able to walk from the plane to the exit of the airport in less than five minutes. |
DLR City Airport Extension
"TKD" wrote in message
... LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. I've never got through LCY without being searched. I've never been searched at LHR, LGW or STN. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
DLR City Airport Extension
John Rowland wrote:
"TKD" wrote in message ... LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. I've never got through LCY without being searched. I've never been searched at LHR, LGW or STN. What have you got to hide that you object to being searched? Or are you a terrorist sympathiser intent on giving them an easy route into the UK? Perhaps both apply? |
DLR City Airport Extension
LCY is so much more civilised than any of the other airports. I've never got through LCY without being searched. I've never been searched at LHR, LGW or STN. I've used LCY twice a week, every week, for six months and never been searched. That said, I've never been searched at any other airport in the UK either. |
DLR City Airport Extension
Agreed, in spades. Plus, the view as you take off over the docks and
circle over London at low level is quite stunning. I know someone whos an air traffic controller at LCY. Lets just say that some of the near misses there have been apparently quite "stunning" too due to the steep take off and glide slopes. B2003 |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Ian F.
writes "Paul Terry" wrote in message ... Why? The direct service is 22 minutes (no changing). It doesn't seem on the map http://www.tfl.gov.uk/dlr/pdf/network/zones.pdf as though there is a direct service. I suspect that map was produced before the service pattern was determined. It has now been decided to run direct services between Bank and LCY: http://developments.dlr.co.uk/extens..._pattern.shtml If so, that makes a difference, yes. It should do - direct services will run every 10 minutes for much of the working day, which is a better frequency than any of the Heathrow, Stansted or Gatwick expresses (and every 14-16 minutes before 9.30 or after 16.30). You can get from Bank to Gatwick or Heathrow in less than 22 minutes? boggle Heh! No, but it would take me 30 mins to get to Bank and then another, allegedly, 22 to get to LC. I can get to Gatwick by overground train in about 30 minutes. Well, it was you who suggested Bank - obviously, if you live or work closer to another airport, it is likely to be quicker to get to that one! I suspect that much of LCY's traffic emanates from the City, Docklands, and the areas between and around (Bow, Stratford, inner Essex, etc). For them, I can see the DLR extension being extremely worthwhile. -- Paul Terry |
DLR City Airport Extension
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DLR City Airport Extension
"Paul Terry" wrote in message
... Well, it was you who suggested Bank - obviously, if you live or work closer to another airport, it is likely to be quicker to get to that one! Of course! But I'm glad there will be an easier way to get to LCY just in case. Thanks to all for the responses. Ian |
DLR City Airport Extension
Colin Rosenstiel wrote in
: In article , (Martin Underwood) wrote: I wonder whether DLR will run any fast services, non-stop from Bank/Stratford/Lewisham/Beckton to LCY or whether every LCY service will stop at all stations en route. Do they have any option? Are there facilities on the DLR for trains to overtake each other? That was the nub of my question: does the DLR have any crossovers for trains to pass each other on the wrong line and/or are any of the stations on loops off the running lines? It's such a long time since I've been on the DLR that I can't remember. If all the LCY services stop at every intermediate station, it's going to be tedious - in just the same way as the Piccadilly line service from Heathrow is tedious because it stops at everywhere inbetween. |
DLR City Airport Extension
Martin Underwood wrote:
Colin Rosenstiel wrote in : In article , (Martin Underwood) wrote: I wonder whether DLR will run any fast services, non-stop from Bank/Stratford/Lewisham/Beckton to LCY or whether every LCY service will stop at all stations en route. Do they have any option? Are there facilities on the DLR for trains to overtake each other? That was the nub of my question: does the DLR have any crossovers for trains to pass each other on the wrong line and/or are any of the stations on loops off the running lines? It's such a long time since I've been on the DLR that I can't remember. None of the stations are on loops. It might be possible for trains to overtake wrong-way heading eastbound from Bank, between Minories Junction and just east of Shadwell station, but I imagine that would restrict capacity for other services considerably. If all the LCY services stop at every intermediate station, it's going to be tedious - in just the same way as the Piccadilly line service from Heathrow is tedious because it stops at everywhere inbetween. It's still only a 22 minute journey Bank - LCY, and there are nine stops in between - a bit different to the Piccadilly's eighteen stops between Leicester Square and Heathrow for instance. -- Dave Arquati Imperial College, SW7 www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Paul Terry
writes It should do - direct services will run every 10 minutes for much of the working day, which is a better frequency than any of the Heathrow, Stansted or Gatwick expresses (and every 14-16 minutes before 9.30 or after 16.30). Yes, but it's not an express. So a fairer comparison would be the total number of trains. From Gatwick there are 12 trains/hour to London, from Luton Airport Parkway to London around 7 trains/hour, so both have a higher frequency. I've used LCY several times and like the airport, but the new service will only change it from being extremely hard to get to, to being very hard to get to. That's an improvement, but not much. -- Clive Page |
DLR City Airport Extension
Boltar wrote:
I know someone whos an air traffic controller at LCY. Lets just say that some of the near misses there have been apparently quite "stunning" too due to the steep take off and glide slopes. Near collision, not near miss. Let's not let the industry parlance, designed not to upset passengers, prevent us from being truthful about what they really a near collisions. Raoul |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Clive Page
writes In message , Paul Terry writes It should do - direct services will run every 10 minutes for much of the working day, which is a better frequency than any of the Heathrow, Stansted or Gatwick expresses (and every 14-16 minutes before 9.30 or after 16.30). Yes, but it's not an express. So a fairer comparison would be the total number of trains. From Gatwick there are 12 trains/hour to London, from Luton Airport Parkway to London around 7 trains/hour, so both have a higher frequency. If frequency is the deciding factor, LCY will actually be getting 12 trains an hour - 6 direct, and 6 involving a change at Canning Town. In a few more years the latter will provide interchange with a large number of other mainline and tube services crossing London, including the Central line, CTRL, (eventually) Crossrail, and SET at Woolwich. Its likely that the LCY will thus become increasingly useful for a growing number of people. I've used LCY several times and like the airport, but the new service will only change it from being extremely hard to get to, to being very hard to get to. That's an improvement, but not much. Surely that depends on where you are coming from? A colleague of mine who lives in Limehouse and flies frequently from LCY will find it a huge improvement. On the other hand, I live close enough to Heathrow to find LCY pretty much of an irrelevance. -- Paul Terry |
DLR City Airport Extension
On Sun, 6 Nov 2005, Raoul wrote:
Boltar wrote: I know someone whos an air traffic controller at LCY. Lets just say that some of the near misses there have been apparently quite "stunning" too due to the steep take off and glide slopes. Near collision, not near miss. Let's not let the industry parlance, designed not to upset passengers, prevent us from being truthful about what they really a near collisions. No. I take your point, and i realise that this is a widely-repeated witticism, but it's based on entirely duff grammar. Clearly, these events are misses, not hits - no planes have ever collided over LCY, as far as i'm aware - and when we say "near miss", we mean "a miss in which the planes were near to each other". A "near hit" would be a hit, which is not what happened. This is the same thing as a "close shave", which, close as it may be, is still a shave, and not an act of metaphorical face-hacking. tom -- THE DRUMMER FROM DEF LEPPARD'S ONLY GOT ONE ARM! |
DLR City Airport Extension
"Paul Terry" wrote in message ... In message , Ian F. writes Well, it was you who suggested Bank - obviously, if you live or work closer to another airport, it is likely to be quicker to get to that one! And hundreds of thousands of people in London live closer to City Airport than to Gatwick, but will still find it quicker to get to Gatwick. The 22 minutes from Bank seems pretty slow compared to East Croydon to Gatwick which covers a greater distance in much less time. BTN |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Sir Benjamin Nunn
writes And hundreds of thousands of people in London live closer to City Airport than to Gatwick, but will still find it quicker to get to Gatwick. Only if they live adjacent to East Croydon station. The 22 minutes from Bank seems pretty slow compared to East Croydon to Gatwick which covers a greater distance in much less time. The time varies between 15 and 22 minutes according to which train you get. But I think you are rather missing the point. London City Airport is so-called because it operates primarily for people working in the city and docklands. -- Paul Terry |
DLR City Airport Extension
"Paul Terry" wrote in message ... In message , Sir Benjamin Nunn writes And hundreds of thousands of people in London live closer to City Airport than to Gatwick, but will still find it quicker to get to Gatwick. Only if they live adjacent to East Croydon station. Or almost anywhere on the London Bridge / Victoria / Clapham Junction lines. or Tramlink. Lots of people South of the river do not live near Underground stations. Still fewer live near Underground stations with quick, direct routes into the centre. The 22 minutes from Bank seems pretty slow compared to East Croydon to Gatwick which covers a greater distance in much less time. The time varies between 15 and 22 minutes according to which train you get. But I think you are rather missing the point. London City Airport is so-called because it operates primarily for people working in the city and docklands. And thus is vastly more useful for people who are visiting London (and tending to stay in the centre) rather than those who already live here and are travelling to Europe. People who work in the City commute from a vast range of different places from all directions, varied distances and travelling times from the centre, and an airport 22 minutes East of Bank is therefore only of convenience to a limited subset of them. If City Airport was actually 22 minutes West of Holborn, 22 minutes North of Euston, or 22 minutes South of Embankment, the impact on visitors to Central London would be minimal, but the subset of Londoners that the airport happened to benefit would be significantly different. BTN |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Sir Benjamin Nunn
writes Or almost anywhere on the London Bridge / Victoria / Clapham Junction lines. or Tramlink. London Bridge to Gatwick is 29 minutes. London Bridge to LCY will be 24 minutes (allowing 5 minutes for the change at Canning Town). Obviously, if you are nearer to a Brighton-line station then Gatwick will be the better option. And thus is vastly more useful for people who are visiting London (and tending to stay in the centre) rather than those who already live here and are travelling to Europe. It depends entirely on where such people live. If they live near Luton, Stansted or Heathrow, any of those are likely to be a better option than London City or Gatwick. People who work in the City commute from a vast range of different places from all directions, varied distances and travelling times from the centre, and an airport 22 minutes East of Bank is therefore only of convenience to a limited subset of them. Exactly. That's why London has 5 airports - to cater for as many subsets as possible. LCY will get increasingly better connected (even to South London) in a few years time, when the branch is extended south to Woolwich Arsenal and north to Stratford International. Even more so when Crossrail is built. If City Airport was actually 22 minutes West of Holborn, 22 minutes North of Euston, or 22 minutes South of Embankment, the impact on visitors to Central London would be minimal, but the subset of Londoners that the airport happened to benefit would be significantly different. But its not, is it? I can't really see what your point is, other than the obvious one that different airports are closer to different groups of people in the London area. -- Paul Terry |
DLR City Airport Extension
"Paul Terry" wrote in message
... Obviously, if you are nearer to a Brighton-line station then Gatwick will be the better option. Unless you want to go to Paris, in which case forget about Gatwick! |
DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Paul Terry
writes But its not, is it? I can't really see what your point is, other than the obvious one that different airports are closer to different groups of people in the London area. LCY will never be a major player because it's planes need a 6% approach as opposed to the 3% of all other major airports. -- Clive |
DLR City Airport Extension
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DLR City Airport Extension
In message , Vernon writes
Unless you want to go to Paris, in which case forget about Gatwick! Some decades ago there used to be a wonderful "hedge-hopper" service from Gatwick to Le Touquet (twin-engined prop, as I recall, which hardly had time to rise more than a few thousand feet before beginning the descent). It was met by a train on the tarmac at Le Touquet that sped to Paris, with only a brief stop at Amiens. It was the bee's knees in terms of speed and low cost in those days - probably faster than anything available today, given the almost instantaneous check-in and go. -- Paul Terry |
DLR City Airport Extension
Martin Underwood wrote:
Clive wrote in : In message , Paul Terry writes But its not, is it? I can't really see what your point is, other than the obvious one that different airports are closer to different groups of people in the London area. LCY will never be a major player because it's planes need a 6% approach as opposed to the 3% of all other major airports. When you say "6% approach" are you referring to the rate of descent - normally 300 feet/mile? I can imagine Canary Wharf and all the other tower blocks of central London having a pretty serious effect for approach from the west or departure to the west, but I presume approach/departure in the other direction is much less restricted. It's actually 5.5% glide slope compared to 3% at most airports, and it applies in both directions. It's largely for noise abatement reasons. Would a steep descent/take-off be enough to restrict the usage of an airport or would it just make life more "interesting" for pilots? The main factors restricting the use of the airport are the noise limits, which severely restrict the aircraft types that may be used, also runway length (only 1319 metres compared to, say, Luton at 2160 m), and limits on operating hours and numbers of movements imposed by the local planning authority (L.B. of Newham). -- Richard J. (to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address) |
DLR City Airport Extension
On Sat, 5 Nov 2005 11:34:56 -0000, "Ian F."
wrote: Heh! No, but it would take me 30 mins to get to Bank and then another, allegedly, 22 to get to LC. I can get to Gatwick by overground train in about 30 minutes. So you live nearer to Gatwick than to LC. Is this of general interest? |
DLR City Airport Extension
"Paul Terry" wrote in message ... In message , Vernon writes Unless you want to go to Paris, in which case forget about Gatwick! Some decades ago there used to be a wonderful "hedge-hopper" service from Gatwick to Le Touquet (twin-engined prop, as I recall, which hardly had time to rise more than a few thousand feet before beginning the descent). It was met by a train on the tarmac at Le Touquet that sped to Paris, with only a brief stop at Amiens. It was the bee's knees in terms of speed and low cost in those days - probably faster than anything available today, given the almost instantaneous check-in and go. "Anything" now equals "nothing"! No service to Paris. |
DLR City Airport Extension
In article , Paul Terry
writes Unless you want to go to Paris, in which case forget about Gatwick! Some decades ago there used to be a wonderful "hedge-hopper" service from Gatwick to Le Touquet (twin-engined prop, as I recall, which hardly had time to rise more than a few thousand feet before beginning the descent). It was met by a train on the tarmac at Le Touquet that sped to Paris, with only a brief stop at Amiens. It was the bee's knees in terms of speed and low cost in those days The Carvairs from Southend to Le Touquet were also met by these trains for those passengers without their cars. -- Clive D.W. Feather | Home: Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is: |
DLR City Airport Extension
It's now open. Passengers were carried from about 17:00 this evening,
Friday 2 December. Al Holmes |
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