Stratford
 

I'm a railfan.

I was reading something on the net about the layout of Stratford station
on the Central Line. I have been there before a few years ago, but I
don't remember the layout myself. The page indicated that it's possible
to transfer between Central Line trains and mainline trains across the
platform. Doesn't this imply that it's possible to board a tube train
without entering a fare-control area? If so, how does one get charged
the proper amount on one's farecard upon exit on the other end of one's
journey?

Peace... Sridhar

Stratford
 

Standard Gauge wrote:

I was reading something on the net about the layout of Stratford station
on the Central Line. I have been there before a few years ago, but I
don't remember the layout myself. The page indicated that it's possible
to transfer between Central Line trains and mainline trains across the
platform. Doesn't this imply that it's possible to board a tube train
without entering a fare-control area? If so, how does one get charged
the proper amount on one's farecard upon exit on the other end of one's
journey?

If arriving at Stratford on a mainline train and using an Oystercard to
continue your journey you need to touch in before boarding the tube (or
v.v.) - there are around 6-8(?) readers on each of the Central line
platforms.

It's not the easiest thing to remember - IME, it's easy to forget to
touch in/out on the DLR if you only use it occasionally. Much better
when gates force you to touch in/out at system boundaries.

Perhaps these standalone Oyster readers could have an
illuminated/flashing sign to remind us forgetful types?

Stratford
 

I was reading something on the net about the layout of Stratford station
on the Central Line. I have been there before a few years ago, but I
don't remember the layout myself. The page indicated that it's possible
to transfer between Central Line trains and mainline trains across the
platform. Doesn't this imply that it's possible to board a tube train
without entering a fare-control area? If so, how does one get charged
the proper amount on one's farecard upon exit on the other end of one's
journey?

If arriving at Stratford on a mainline train and using an Oystercard to
continue your journey you need to touch in before boarding the tube (or
v.v.) - there are around 6-8(?) readers on each of the Central line
platforms.

I suppose the same holds if one enters the platform area from the station ticketing hall?

The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.

It's not the easiest thing to remember - IME, it's easy to forget to
touch in/out on the DLR if you only use it occasionally. Much better
when gates force you to touch in/out at system boundaries.

And how are you charged if you do forget to touch in?

Depends where you touch out. It could be anywhere between £1 and £5.
The journey will be charged in addition to any other journeys you made
that day which might have been 'capped' at a certain price. Worth your
while to rememeber.

Stratford
 

TKD wrote:
I was reading something on the net about the layout of Stratford station
on the Central Line. I have been there before a few years ago, but I
don't remember the layout myself. The page indicated that it's possible
to transfer between Central Line trains and mainline trains across the
platform. Doesn't this imply that it's possible to board a tube train
without entering a fare-control area? If so, how does one get charged
the proper amount on one's farecard upon exit on the other end of one's
journey?

If arriving at Stratford on a mainline train and using an Oystercard to
continue your journey you need to touch in before boarding the tube (or
v.v.) - there are around 6-8(?) readers on each of the Central line
platforms.

I suppose the same holds if one enters the platform area from the station ticketing hall?

The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.

It's not the easiest thing to remember - IME, it's easy to forget to
touch in/out on the DLR if you only use it occasionally. Much better
when gates force you to touch in/out at system boundaries.

And how are you charged if you do forget to touch in?

Depends where you touch out. It could be anywhere between £1 and £5.
The journey will be charged in addition to any other journeys you made
that day which might have been 'capped' at a certain price. Worth your
while to rememeber.

If you are changing from the Central Line to NR, you do have to keep
your wits about you.

If you've already got your NR ticket, you have to touch out on the
platform (or it will assume you've gone to Epping or whatever).

But if you haven't got your NR ticket, you have to not touch out on the
platform, but touch out to get you through to the outside of the
barriers to where the NR tickets are sold (if you can find it).

And then you have to be careful not to absent-mindedly touch back in
with your Oyster, but use the paper ticket you've just bought to get
back in through the barriers instead.

Stratford
 

On 22 Jan 2006 15:20:29 -0800, "MIG"
wrote:

If you are changing from the Central Line to NR, you do have to keep
your wits about you.

If you've already got your NR ticket, you have to touch out on the
platform (or it will assume you've gone to Epping or whatever).

But if you haven't got your NR ticket, you have to not touch out on the
platform, but touch out to get you through to the outside of the
barriers to where the NR tickets are sold (if you can find it).

Does it not charge you the correct fare if you touch out on the
platform and then again when leaving through the barriers?

Stratford
 

The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.

Is the North London Line covered by Oyster (other than the bits that are
duplicated by the District/Jubilee)? It's entirely possible to get between
the NLL and Central without going through a barrier.

It's not the easiest thing to remember - IME, it's easy to forget to
touch in/out on the DLR if you only use it occasionally. Much better
when gates force you to touch in/out at system boundaries.

Quite apart from the problem of transfer to the North London/Jubilee Line (I
still can't make out if Oyster charges you for interchanging through those
barriers - I use a travelcard), I just can't imagine trying to add gates
along what are already very narrow island platforms!

Stratford
 

"Tim Roll-Pickering" wrote in message
...
The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned
and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.

Is the North London Line covered by Oyster (other than the bits that are
duplicated by the District/Jubilee)? It's entirely possible to get between
the NLL and Central without going through a barrier.

No.
--
David Biddulph

Stratford
 

asdf wrote:
On 22 Jan 2006 15:20:29 -0800, "MIG"
wrote:

If you are changing from the Central Line to NR, you do have to keep
your wits about you.

If you've already got your NR ticket, you have to touch out on the
platform (or it will assume you've gone to Epping or whatever).

But if you haven't got your NR ticket, you have to not touch out on the
platform, but touch out to get you through to the outside of the
barriers to where the NR tickets are sold (if you can find it).

Does it not charge you the correct fare if you touch out on the
platform and then again when leaving through the barriers?


I'd hope so, but not sure I'd want to risk it. I also wonder what
happens if one touches either once or twice in changing from the
Central to the DLR (eg if you were at the end of the platform and
assumed that you were touching into the DLR rather than out of the
Central, or vice versa).

With logical thought, it would probably be possible to program in ways
of deducing what people were doing, but there isn't much logical
thought in the railways.

Given the attitude of the railway authorities, eg closing twenty ticket
offices while placing gangs of twenty inspectors to hassle people who
can't get tickets, people inevitably feel threatened and liable to
ripoffs. That's not due to Oyster, it's due to past experience.

Stratford
 

Barry Salter wrote:

Is the North London Line covered by Oyster (other than the bits that are
duplicated by the District/Jubilee)? It's entirely possible to get between
the NLL and Central without going through a barrier.

According to the TfL Fares and Tickets leaflet, PAYG Oyster (formerly
PrePay) is only valid on the NLL between Richmond and Gunnersbury, and
between Canning Town and Stratford.

Hmm - I can't remember if the NLL is shown on the tube maps these days.
Wouldn't it be a heck of a lot easier to make the tube map show all and only
Oyster validity?

Stratford
 

Tim Roll-Pickering wrote:

Hmm - I can't remember if the NLL is shown on the tube
maps these days. Wouldn't it be a heck of a lot easier to
make the tube map show all and only Oyster validity?

The NNL is shown on the Tube Map, but (except for
between Gunnersbury and Richmond, where it shares
tracks with the District Line) doesn't accept Oyster PrePay.
I would imagine that when TfL takes over control of
SilverLink Metro services PrePay will be introduced
fairly quicky. It would be quite easy to implement: most
of the NNL stations are self-contained or have interchange
only with LU, and those that aren't often have a clear
division between SilverLink and other services (e.g.
Willesden Junction, where SilverLink use the high level,
or Stratford where they use the low level).

Or you could turn control of the NNL over to LU, with all
the security, frequency and service improvements that
would bring ...


Matt

Stratford
 

In article . com,
Matt Ashby wrote:
I would imagine that when TfL takes over control of
SilverLink Metro services PrePay will be introduced
fairly quicky. It would be quite easy to implement: most
of the NNL stations are self-contained or have interchange
only with LU, and those that aren't often have a clear
division between SilverLink and other services (e.g.
Willesden Junction, where SilverLink use the high level,
or Stratford where they use the low level).

When TfL take over the NLL, it will be cut back from Woolwich,
and the Stratford terminus will have moved.

--
RIP Morph (1977-2005)

Stratford
 

In message . com, Matt
Ashby writes

Or you could turn control of the NNL over to LU, with all
the security, frequency and service improvements that
would bring ...

I see that the Mayor has already announced that an absolute requirement
of the franchise, up for grabs next year, will be staffing of all
stations on the Silverlink network at all times they are open:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4644556.stm

--
Paul Terry

Stratford
 

TKD wrote:
I was reading something on the net about the layout of Stratford station
on the Central Line. I have been there before a few years ago, but I
don't remember the layout myself. The page indicated that it's possible
to transfer between Central Line trains and mainline trains across the
platform. Doesn't this imply that it's possible to board a tube train
without entering a fare-control area? If so, how does one get charged
the proper amount on one's farecard upon exit on the other end of one's
journey?
If arriving at Stratford on a mainline train and using an Oystercard to
continue your journey you need to touch in before boarding the tube (or
v.v.) - there are around 6-8(?) readers on each of the Central line
platforms.
I suppose the same holds if one enters the platform area from the station ticketing hall?

The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.

The first time I changed at Stratford, I fell foul of the mess of this
station. I was arriving by Jubilee, and departing by central, on
prepay. When I arrived at the gateline off the Jubilee platforms, I
asked the man there whether I also had to touch in on the central line
platforms, as I was already using my oyster here. He told me I didn't
have to, so I didn't, and the obvious problem occured when I arrived at
my destination: it wouldn't let me out of the gates because I was
supposed to have touched in on the central.

Robin

Stratford
 

R.C. Payne wrote:

The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.

The first time I changed at Stratford, I fell foul of the mess of this
station. I was arriving by Jubilee, and departing by central, on prepay.
When I arrived at the gateline off the Jubilee platforms, I asked the man
there whether I also had to touch in on the central line platforms, as I
was already using my oyster here. He told me I didn't have to, so I
didn't, and the obvious problem occured when I arrived at my destination:
it wouldn't let me out of the gates because I was supposed to have touched
in on the central.

Nice! Despite using the station almost every day I have never seen anything
about this.

Do you have to touch in going the other way? And do you get charged for two
journeys?

It's chaos like this (as well as the National Rail problem) that makes me
seriously doubt I'll ever succumb to Oyster Pre Pay.

Stratford
 

The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.

The first time I changed at Stratford, I fell foul of the mess of this station. I was arriving by
Jubilee, and departing by central, on prepay. When I arrived at the gateline off the Jubilee
platforms, I asked the man there whether I also had to touch in on the central line platforms, as
I was already using my oyster here. He told me I didn't have to, so I didn't, and the obvious
problem occured when I arrived at my destination: it wouldn't let me out of the gates because I
was supposed to have touched in on the central.

The system never stops you from leaving through the gates at your
destination under these circumstances.

The only reason the system would not let you *exit* the system is if you
present your card twice at the same gateline. For example if the person in
front of you went through on your ticket and the barriers close on you and
you touch again to try and get out.

Stratford
 

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:17:17 +0000, "R.C. Payne"
wrote:

The first time I changed at Stratford, I fell foul of the mess of this
station. I was arriving by Jubilee, and departing by central, on
prepay. When I arrived at the gateline off the Jubilee platforms, I
asked the man there whether I also had to touch in on the central line
platforms, as I was already using my oyster here. He told me I didn't
have to, so I didn't, and the obvious problem occured when I arrived at
my destination: it wouldn't let me out of the gates because I was
supposed to have touched in on the central.

That's interesting. I regularly transfer CentralJubilee at
Stratford. I have never touched in or out on the Central platform,
but have to touch at the Jubilee barrier. This has never given a
problem with my Oyster pre-pay in either direction.

Stratford
 

"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:17:17 +0000, "R.C. Payne"
wrote:

The first time I changed at Stratford, I fell foul of the mess of this
station. I was arriving by Jubilee, and departing by central, on
prepay. When I arrived at the gateline off the Jubilee platforms, I
asked the man there whether I also had to touch in on the central line
platforms, as I was already using my oyster here. He told me I didn't
have to, so I didn't, and the obvious problem occured when I arrived at
my destination: it wouldn't let me out of the gates because I was
supposed to have touched in on the central.

That's interesting. I regularly transfer CentralJubilee at
Stratford. I have never touched in or out on the Central platform,
but have to touch at the Jubilee barrier. This has never given a
problem with my Oyster pre-pay in either direction.

It wouldn't. You do not need to touch the Central line validators if
changing from the Jubilee.

Stratford
 

TKD wrote:
The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.
The first time I changed at Stratford, I fell foul of the mess of this station. I was arriving by
Jubilee, and departing by central, on prepay. When I arrived at the gateline off the Jubilee
platforms, I asked the man there whether I also had to touch in on the central line platforms, as
I was already using my oyster here. He told me I didn't have to, so I didn't, and the obvious
problem occured when I arrived at my destination: it wouldn't let me out of the gates because I
was supposed to have touched in on the central.

The system never stops you from leaving through the gates at your
destination under these circumstances.

The only reason the system would not let you *exit* the system is if you
present your card twice at the same gateline. For example if the person in
front of you went through on your ticket and the barriers close on you and
you touch again to try and get out.

Uh huh. When I "sought assistance", the guy at the station (very
friendly) told me that, as far as the "sytstem" was concerned, I had
completed my last journey at Stratford and not started a new one. He
let me out on his pass, and when I checked the card for its journey
history, it said I had travelled from (I think) London Bridge to
Stratford and nothing more (which would imply that it wasn't a case of
someone else walking through the gate on my touch-out). Having followed
this newsgroup, I am aware of the need to be careful with this sort of
thing, which is why I asked at Stratford whether or not I needed to use
the Central line platform validators. Man at Stratford said, "no," man
at other station (I think it was Leyton) said, "yes" (and was backed up
by not-opening gates).

Robin

Stratford
 

"R.C. Payne" wrote in message ...
TKD wrote:
The whole station is a fare control area. The only entrance is owned and
managed by London Underground with a tube style gateline. There is a
second gateline between the Jubilee line and the rest of the station so
anyone starting their journey at Stratford or interchanging from the
Jubilee line will be forced to pass a barrier.

Validators on the island platforms are provided for transfer between
'one' services to/from the east and Central/DLR.
The first time I changed at Stratford, I fell foul of the mess of this station. I was arriving
by Jubilee, and departing by central, on prepay. When I arrived at the gateline off the Jubilee
platforms, I asked the man there whether I also had to touch in on the central line platforms, as
I was already using my oyster here. He told me I didn't have to, so I didn't, and the obvious
problem occured when I arrived at my destination: it wouldn't let me out of the gates because I
was supposed to have touched in on the central.

The system never stops you from leaving through the gates at your
destination under these circumstances.

The only reason the system would not let you *exit* the system is if you
present your card twice at the same gateline. For example if the person in
front of you went through on your ticket and the barriers close on you and
you touch again to try and get out.

Uh huh. When I "sought assistance", the guy at the station (very friendly) told me that, as far
as the "sytstem" was concerned, I had completed my last journey at Stratford and not started a new
one. He let me out on his pass, and when I checked the card for its journey history, it said I
had travelled from (I think) London Bridge to Stratford and nothing more (which would imply that
it wasn't a case of someone else walking through the gate on my touch-out). Having followed this
newsgroup, I am aware of the need to be careful with this sort of thing, which is why I asked at
Stratford whether or not I needed to use the Central line platform validators. Man at Stratford
said, "no," man at other station (I think it was Leyton) said, "yes" (and was backed up by
not-opening gates).

Unfortunately getting two different stories out of transport staff is not
a rare situation. The training has been at best woefully inadequate.

I've gone from West Ham to Leyton via Stratford a few times and it has
always charged me correctly. On the prepay statement it shows as a journey
starting at West Ham and ending at Stratford followed by a journey starting
at West Ham ending at Leyton. With the charge being made for the second
"full" journey only.

At Leyton the card would show a completed journey ending at Stratford until
the card was successfully validated at the Leyton gateline. Which would indicate
for some reason the validator on the barrier at Leyton was not reading the card
properly.

Stratford
 

On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 13:27:25 -0000, "TKD" wrote:

That's interesting. I regularly transfer CentralJubilee at
Stratford. I have never touched in or out on the Central platform,
but have to touch at the Jubilee barrier. This has never given a
problem with my Oyster pre-pay in either direction.

It wouldn't. You do not need to touch the Central line validators if
changing from the Jubilee.

So I wonder what happened to my name-sake?

Stratford
 

"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 13:27:25 -0000, "TKD" wrote:

That's interesting. I regularly transfer CentralJubilee at
Stratford. I have never touched in or out on the Central platform,
but have to touch at the Jubilee barrier. This has never given a
problem with my Oyster pre-pay in either direction.

It wouldn't. You do not need to touch the Central line validators if
changing from the Jubilee.

So I wonder what happened to my name-sake?

The fact that no exit was recorded at Leyton would suggest that the
card was not read properly by the validator.

Stratford
 

TKD wrote:
"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 13:27:25 -0000, "TKD" wrote:

That's interesting. I regularly transfer CentralJubilee at
Stratford. I have never touched in or out on the Central platform,
but have to touch at the Jubilee barrier. This has never given a
problem with my Oyster pre-pay in either direction.
It wouldn't. You do not need to touch the Central line validators if
changing from the Jubilee.
So I wonder what happened to my name-sake?

The fact that no exit was recorded at Leyton would suggest that the
card was not read properly by the validator.

But it opened the gates, and (when I checked the record later) had a
completed journey from London Bridge to Stratford on it. Perhaps they
changed the system at Stratford because people were facing this problem?
It wasn't that long after the introduction of prepay that I had this
experience.

Robin

Stratford
 

"R.C. Payne" wrote in message ...
TKD wrote:
"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 13:27:25 -0000, "TKD" wrote:

That's interesting. I regularly transfer CentralJubilee at
Stratford. I have never touched in or out on the Central platform,
but have to touch at the Jubilee barrier. This has never given a
problem with my Oyster pre-pay in either direction.
It wouldn't. You do not need to touch the Central line validators if
changing from the Jubilee.
So I wonder what happened to my name-sake?

The fact that no exit was recorded at Leyton would suggest that the
card was not read properly by the validator.

But it opened the gates, and (when I checked the record later) had a completed journey from London
Bridge to Stratford on it. Perhaps they changed the system at Stratford because people were
facing this problem? It wasn't that long after the introduction of prepay that I had this
experience.

I thought the whole point fo this story was it didn't open the gates at Leyton?