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Zone changes
I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station
would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? James |
Zone changes
"James Penton" wrote in message ... I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? Yes. See: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf |
Zone changes
James Penton wrote:
I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? I have not seen any text actually mentioning the transfer of the loop to zone 4, but if you look at the new tube zone map for 2007 it is changed. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? -- Olof Lagerkvist ICQ: 724451 Web: http://here.is/olof |
Zone changes
"John Salmon" wrote in message ... Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? Yes. See: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf How did you find that? Odd that it has the filename of the London Connections map, not the tube map... Paul |
Zone changes
"Olof Lagerkvist" wrote in message ... I have not seen any text actually mentioning the transfer of the loop to zone 4, but if you look at the new tube zone map for 2007 it is changed. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? If there was one, its filename would possibly be.... lon_con_2007.pdf - as above - I reckon there has probably been an error... Paul |
Zone changes
Paul Scott wrote:
"Olof Lagerkvist" wrote in message ... I have not seen any text actually mentioning the transfer of the loop to zone 4, but if you look at the new tube zone map for 2007 it is changed. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? If there was one, its filename would possibly be.... lon_con_2007.pdf - as above - I reckon there has probably been an error... Yes, and I guess that is probably the reason why I cannot find the complete connections map... I found the link at the season tickets price list page. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/fares-tick...card-adult.asp ....and when you check the 2006 version of that prices list the corresponding link actually links to the complete "London Connections" map. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/fares-tick...avelcard.shtml -- Olof Lagerkvist ICQ: 724451 Web: http://here.is/olof |
Zone changes
I've heard it mentioned about.
There's also a rumour that all stations north of Krap Room will be changed to zone 7. We'll see if this comes to fruition - I guess this started with the 2006 fares revision, which left all bands A-D paying the same travelcard fares. |
Zone changes
Olof Lagerkvist wrote:
BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? Not a zone change, but the NLL is obviously missing! ESB |
Zone changes
"Paul Scott" wrote "John Salmon" wrote Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? Yes. See: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf How did you find that? Odd that it has the filename of the London Connections map, not the tube map... I cheated - I put "Chigwell zone 4 2007" in a Google search. |
Zone changes
On Sat, 16 Dec 2006 18:23:20 -0000, John Salmon wrote:
Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? Yes. See: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf Next question: why? |
Zone changes
Ernst S Blofeld wrote:
Not a zone change, but the NLL is obviously missing! I'm not sure this is the version intended for leaflets and posters. It's also missing mobility impaired access. Also compared to the June 06 version I note they're now showing a restricted through service for Hainault loop trains at Woodford (previously it was shown as loop trains just terminating), as well as making the Chesham Met branch a clear shuttle with the odd through service, rather than than just sending people to the notes. |
Zone changes
Olof Lagerkvist wrote: BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? No. Seems a faintly odd change, doesn't it? If you look at a map it seems very strange that Chigwell should be in zone 4, yet places like Chingford, Becontree and Chadwell Heath should still be zone 5. Jonn |
Zone changes
BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And
have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? No. Seems a faintly odd change, doesn't it? If you look at a map it seems very strange that Chigwell should be in zone 4, yet places like Chingford, Becontree and Chadwell Heath should still be zone 5. Is it because of some action by Epping Forest DC? The loop also got services after 8pm on weekdays recently, I wonder if they had any hand in it? It could also just be a "simplification" so it doesn't matter which way round the loop you go, the fare will be the same. Chigwell and Becontree are similar distances from Charing Cross (about 12 miles), so it does seem unfair that Becontree is in zone 5 (especially given it is in Greater London, while Chigwell is just outside). |
Zone changes
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Zone changes
On Sun, 17 Dec 2006, Tim Roll-Pickering wrote:
Also compared to the June 06 version I note they're now showing a restricted through service for Hainault loop trains at Woodford (previously it was shown as loop trains just terminating), as well as making the Chesham Met branch a clear shuttle with the odd through service, rather than than just sending people to the notes. Ditto Mill Hill East. Unless i'm being as unobservant as usual and this has been the case for a while. tom -- THE DRUMMER FROM DEF LEPPARD'S ONLY GOT ONE ARM! |
Zone changes
On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Olof Lagerkvist wrote:
James Penton wrote: I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! I have not seen any text actually mentioning the transfer of the loop to zone 4, but if you look at the new tube zone map for 2007 it is changed. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? Or, even better, an online version of the 'high frequency services' map? tom -- THE DRUMMER FROM DEF LEPPARD'S ONLY GOT ONE ARM! |
Zone changes
Tom Anderson wrote:
On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Olof Lagerkvist wrote: James Penton wrote: I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! I have not seen any text actually mentioning the transfer of the loop to zone 4, but if you look at the new tube zone map for 2007 it is changed. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? Or, even better, an online version of the 'high frequency services' map? For South London there is http://www.overgroundnetwork.com/. |
Zone changes
Colin Rosenstiel wrote:
In article , (tkd) wrote: Chigwell and Becontree are similar distances from Charing Cross (about 12 miles), so it does seem unfair that Becontree is in zone 5 (especially given it is in Greater London, while Chigwell is just outside). Does this make Chigwell the only party of Zone 4 outside Greater London. The Worcester Park station is in zone 4 and it is right at the boundary of Greater London, but I do not know if it is actually within or outside. -- Olof Lagerkvist ICQ: 724451 Web: http://here.is/olof |
Zone changes
Tom Anderson wrote:
On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Olof Lagerkvist wrote: BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? Or, even better, an online version of the 'high frequency services' map? There is a National Rail version of the London Connections map that specifies individual rail services and train operators (for the high frequency services at least). http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/system...onnections.pdf -- Olof Lagerkvist ICQ: 724451 Web: http://here.is/olof |
Zone changes
"Olof Lagerkvist" wrote in message ... There is a National Rail version of the London Connections map that specifies individual rail services and train operators (for the high frequency services at least). http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/system...onnections.pdf I don't think it aims to show 'high frequencies' in the way the of the 'Overground Network', it simply isn't showing services like GNER, MML, GatEx, because they don't stop within the zonal area... Paul |
Zone changes
On Sun, 17 Dec 2006, Michael Hoffman wrote:
Tom Anderson wrote: On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Olof Lagerkvist wrote: James Penton wrote: I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! I have not seen any text actually mentioning the transfer of the loop to zone 4, but if you look at the new tube zone map for 2007 it is changed. http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf BTW... Can anyone see any more changes to the zones on that map? And have anyone found a new version of the "London Connections" map with the zones of all railway stations within Greater London? Or, even better, an online version of the 'high frequency services' map? For South London there is http://www.overgroundnetwork.com/. Not the one i'm thinking of! Both this and the map Olof linked to are useful, but i'd like an electronic copy of the one LU have in many tube stations, which is the London Connections map modified to show which lines have a more frequent service. It's not that there's some specific information i need from it, it's just slightly annoying that there's a perfectly good map which TfL haven't put on their website! tom -- I do not think we will have to wait for long. |
Zone changes
In article , ess (Olof Lagerkvist) wrote:
Colin Rosenstiel wrote: In article , (tkd) wrote: Chigwell and Becontree are similar distances from Charing Cross (about 12 miles), so it does seem unfair that Becontree is in zone 5 (especially given it is in Greater London, while Chigwell is just outside). Does this make Chigwell the only party of Zone 4 outside Greater London. The Worcester Park station is in zone 4 and it is right at the boundary of Greater London, but I do not know if it is actually within or outside. Worcester Park station is situated with the Royal Borough of Kingston upon Thames. -- Colin Rosenstiel |
Zone changes
On Sun, 17 Dec 2006 22:42:12 +0000, Tom Anderson wrote:
Or, even better, an online version of the 'high frequency services' map? For South London there is http://www.overgroundnetwork.com/. Not the one i'm thinking of! Both this and the map Olof linked to are useful, but i'd like an electronic copy of the one LU have in many tube stations, which is the London Connections map modified to show which lines have a more frequent service. It's not that there's some specific information i need from it, it's just slightly annoying that there's a perfectly good map which TfL haven't put on their website! It definitely used to be there. Its url (combining memory with a quick browse of archive.org) was http://tube.tfl.gov.uk/content/tubem...onnections.pdf and it was only available for around a couple of months in Feb/March 2005. Of course archive.org, being its usual self, doesn't have archived the actual file you want. |
Zone changes
On Mon, 18 Dec 2006, asdf wrote:
On Sun, 17 Dec 2006 22:42:12 +0000, Tom Anderson wrote: Or, even better, an online version of the 'high frequency services' map? For South London there is http://www.overgroundnetwork.com/. Not the one i'm thinking of! Both this and the map Olof linked to are useful, but i'd like an electronic copy of the one LU have in many tube stations, which is the London Connections map modified to show which lines have a more frequent service. It's not that there's some specific information i need from it, it's just slightly annoying that there's a perfectly good map which TfL haven't put on their website! It definitely used to be there. Its url (combining memory with a quick browse of archive.org) was http://tube.tfl.gov.uk/content/tubem...onnections.pdf and it was only available for around a couple of months in Feb/March 2005. Of course archive.org, being its usual self, doesn't have archived the actual file you want. Weird. Could there be some sort of copyright issue? tom -- It's amazing how often conversations with you have the imaginary sound of human bones being crushed to rubble in the background. -- itchyfidget, to snowking |
Zone changes
Colin Rosenstiel wrote:
In article , (John Salmon) wrote: "James Penton" wrote in message ... I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? Yes. See: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/lon_con_2007.pdf Hmm. The North London Line removed from the tube map again. -- Colin Rosenstiel This isn't necessarily a new edition of the standard Tube map - as the zones are colour-coded it may just be a special version for passengers to work out what zones they need for their Travelcard season or something like that. Compare it with the current Tube map which doesn't colour-code the zones but merely shades alternate zones in grey as a visual aid: http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/pdfdocs/colourmap.pdf That said maybe I'm wrong and it is the new edition of the standard Tube map. |
Zone changes
"James Penton" wrote in message ... I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? BBC covering this today, interesting that the change is to attempt to get more passengers to use the stations. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6215701.stm Paul |
Zone changes
On Fri, 29 Dec 2006, Paul Scott wrote:
"James Penton" wrote in message ... I was at Chigwell earlier today and saw a poster stating that the station would be moving to zone 4 from 2nd January 2007 (it's currently in zone 5). This is the first I've heard of this, and there's nothing on the TfL website about it. I'm sure I didn't imagine the poster! Anyone know any more, are any other stations moving - I'd guess the whole Hainault loop is going into zone 4? BBC covering this today, interesting that the change is to attempt to get more passengers to use the stations. Interesting. That implies that LU think that there's a large pool of potential passengers who currently get about by other means. What would those be? Is everyone getting a bus to the Woodford branch and catching the tube there? Or driving into town? Is it not possible that the stations are so quiet because there are five stations on 4.39 km of line that runs along the outer edge of a fairly low-density wedge of suburb? Methinks closing Barkingside and Hainault might be a better way to make the station numbers look better - if perhaps not the overall ridership! Also, any ideas why Roding Valley was built northeast of Woodford Junction, rather than immediately to the south of it, thus supplying twice the number of trains? tom -- It's just really ****ing good and that's all. -- Gabe, on the Macintosh |
Zone changes
Tom Anderson wrote:
Also, any ideas why Roding Valley was built northeast of Woodford Junction, rather than immediately to the south of it, thus supplying twice the number of trains? Many using Roding valley will live a similar distance to Buckhurst Hill or Woodford, it's a 15 minute walk from Roding valley to either station, and the houses follow the rail ribbon. |
Zone changes
Paul Scott wrote:
BBC covering this today, interesting that the change is to attempt to get more passengers to use the stations. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6215701.stm Exactly where are they expecting these extra passengers to go to? The line is not exactly full of vacant seats west (at least) of Stratford! |
Zone changes
In message , Tim Roll-Pickering
writes Exactly where are they expecting these extra passengers to go to? The line is not exactly full of vacant seats west (at least) of Stratford! Perhaps to Canary Wharf, changing at Stratford - I know a number of people who work in Docklands and live in the Fairlop loop area. -- Paul Terry |
Zone changes
On Fri, 29 Dec 2006, Paul Weaver wrote:
Tom Anderson wrote: Also, any ideas why Roding Valley was built northeast of Woodford Junction, rather than immediately to the south of it, thus supplying twice the number of trains? Many using Roding valley will live a similar distance to Buckhurst Hill or Woodford, it's a 15 minute walk from Roding valley to either station, and the houses follow the rail ribbon. Right. None of which would be much different if the station was 300 metres further south, where it could get more trains. Or is the point that there isn't the need for that many trains, so putting it north of the junction avoided forcing Epping trains to either stop or get stuck behind stopping loop trains? tom -- Don't ask me man, i didn't do it. |
Zone changes
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Zone changes
"Colin Rosenstiel" wrote in message ... In article , (Tom Anderson) wrote: On Fri, 29 Dec 2006, Paul Weaver wrote: Tom Anderson wrote: Also, any ideas why Roding Valley was built northeast of Woodford Junction, rather than immediately to the south of it, thus supplying twice the number of trains? Many using Roding valley will live a similar distance to Buckhurst Hill or Woodford, it's a 15 minute walk from Roding valley to either station, and the houses follow the rail ribbon. Right. None of which would be much different if the station was 300 metres further south, where it could get more trains. Or is the point that there isn't the need for that many trains, so putting it north of the junction avoided forcing Epping trains to either stop or get stuck behind stopping loop trains? When was Roding valley station opened? Woodford opened: 14/12/1947 Line extended to Loughton and Hainault 21/11/1948 (Newbury Park to Hainault opened 31/5/1948) By LT or in GE days? No idea. tim |
Zone changes
"tim....." wrote in message
... "Colin Rosenstiel" wrote in message ... In article , (Tom Anderson) wrote: On Fri, 29 Dec 2006, Paul Weaver wrote: Tom Anderson wrote: Also, any ideas why Roding Valley was built northeast of Woodford Junction, rather than immediately to the south of it, thus supplying twice the number of trains? Many using Roding valley will live a similar distance to Buckhurst Hill or Woodford, it's a 15 minute walk from Roding valley to either station, and the houses follow the rail ribbon. Right. None of which would be much different if the station was 300 metres further south, where it could get more trains. Or is the point that there isn't the need for that many trains, so putting it north of the junction avoided forcing Epping trains to either stop or get stuck behind stopping loop trains? When was Roding valley station opened? Woodford opened: 14/12/1947 Line extended to Loughton and Hainault 21/11/1948 (Newbury Park to Hainault opened 31/5/1948) By LT or in GE days? No idea. Subject to the customary caveat on the source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roding_Valley_tube_station "The station itself was opened as Roding Valley Halt by the London & North Eastern Railway, successors to the GER, on 3 February 1936 ... . The post-war extension of the Central Line meant that the LNER station closed on 29 November 1947, and Roding Valley re-opened on 21 November 1948 as a London Underground station." -- David Biddulph |
Zone changes
"David Biddulph" wrote in message ... "tim....." wrote in message ... "Colin Rosenstiel" wrote in message ... In article , (Tom Anderson) wrote: On Fri, 29 Dec 2006, Paul Weaver wrote: Tom Anderson wrote: Also, any ideas why Roding Valley was built northeast of Woodford Junction, rather than immediately to the south of it, thus supplying twice the number of trains? Many using Roding valley will live a similar distance to Buckhurst Hill or Woodford, it's a 15 minute walk from Roding valley to either station, and the houses follow the rail ribbon. Right. None of which would be much different if the station was 300 metres further south, where it could get more trains. Or is the point that there isn't the need for that many trains, so putting it north of the junction avoided forcing Epping trains to either stop or get stuck behind stopping loop trains? When was Roding valley station opened? Woodford opened: 14/12/1947 Line extended to Loughton and Hainault 21/11/1948 (Newbury Park to Hainault opened 31/5/1948) By LT or in GE days? No idea. Subject to the customary caveat on the source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roding_Valley_tube_station "The station itself was opened as Roding Valley Halt by the London & North Eastern Railway, successors to the GER, on 3 February 1936 ... . The post-war extension of the Central Line meant that the LNER station closed on 29 November 1947, and Roding Valley re-opened on 21 November 1948 as a London Underground station." Ah, this little bit of underground history was not known to me. This explains why so much of this 'new' line was opened so quickly. It was just converted from an overground railway that was already there. tim |
Zone changes
"tim....." wrote in message ... Subject to the customary caveat on the source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roding_Valley_tube_station "The station itself was opened as Roding Valley Halt by the London & North Eastern Railway, successors to the GER, on 3 February 1936 ... . The post-war extension of the Central Line meant that the LNER station closed on 29 November 1947, and Roding Valley re-opened on 21 November 1948 as a London Underground station." Ah, this little bit of underground history was not known to me. This explains why so much of this 'new' line was opened so quickly. It was just converted from an overground railway that was already there. Its also helps explain why there appear to be far more 'underground' lines north of the river. It suited the mainline railways to have certain commuter routes transferred to LT as extensions of their routes - many of the current lines are the result of transfers from the 'mainline' railways... Paul |
Zone changes
In article , notvalidpmscott@btinternet
com (Paul Scott) wrote: "tim....." wrote in message ... Ah, this little bit of underground history was not known to me. This explains why so much of this 'new' line was opened so quickly. It was just converted from an overground railway that was already there. Its also helps explain why there appear to be far more 'underground' lines north of the river. It suited the mainline railways to have certain commuter routes transferred to LT as extensions of their routes - many of the current lines are the result of transfers from the 'mainline' railways... More the other way round, though. The Southern preferred to electrify its network between the wars than to transfer it to the Underground, to the extent that it was willing to build the Wimbledon-Sutton line in the 1920s and 30s rather than have the District extended to Sutton. The Northern to Mill Hill East and High Barnet and the Central extensions West of Ealing and East of Liverpool St are the main tube takeovers of main line railways in the post-grouping era. The Bakerloo to Watford Junction (to some extent as the main line usage always remained), the Central to Ealing, the Northern to Edgware and the Piccadilly to Cockfosters were all earlier new lines. -- Colin Rosenstiel |
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