"Stephen Furley" wrote in message

How do they get around the ban on new unprotected third rail
electrifications?

Don't know the rules but I doubt a test line would count.

--
Nick




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Stephen Furley wrote:
On 15 Feb, 08:45, "Nick Lawford" wrote:

Aylesbury to Claydon is also not electrified at all.

While Old Dalby is currently (excuse the pun) NR 25 kV AC and Movias
need LU 660 VDC, the grid feeder substation and switching gear will
already be in place, along with linseside fencing to latest standards
and so on. Its rather simpler to convert an already existing
electrification from one to another sytem even if they are very
different.

How do they get around the ban on new unprotected third rail
electrifications? Does this not apply to third/fourth rail systems?
Does it not apply to this line as it's not open to the public? Does
this count as an extension to an existing system (the London
Underground) even though it's not physically connected to it? Would
they have to obtain a special excemption from the regulations to do
this?

My understanding is the ban comes from regulations about exposed
electrical conductors in the workplace, the workplace relating to track
workers and the like. Presumably on a test line it is relatively
straightforward to set up the safety case in such a way that the rails
are switched off an earthed down before anyone goes out onto the track.

Robin

In message , at 11:55:01 on Thu, 15
Feb 2007, R.C. Payne remarked:
My understanding is the ban comes from regulations about exposed
electrical conductors in the workplace, the workplace relating to track
workers and the like. Presumably on a test line it is relatively
straightforward to set up the safety case in such a way that the rails
are switched off an earthed down before anyone goes out onto the track.

That would tend to suggest driverless trains. Or if one breaks down on
the test track, a very long wait for the driver to be "rescued".
--
Roland Perry

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 09:58:59 +0000 (UTC), "Nick Lawford"
wrote:

"Stephen Furley" wrote in message

How do they get around the ban on new unprotected third rail
electrifications?

Don't know the rules but I doubt a test line would count.

I would hazard a guess that the rules are related more to
factory/industrial installations than public transport. Anyway, isn't
the new third-rail ban merely DfT policy rather than any actual
regulation ?

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 09:07:59 -0000, "Peter Masson"
wrote:


"Nick Lawford" wrote in message
news:d7e237510223bcf79eba9448f66a7e52.97781@mygat e.mailgate.org...
"Jack Taylor" wrote in message



Peter Lawrence wrote:

That must be the reason for going so far from London! Otherwise I
would have thought that, say, Aylesbury - Claydon would involve far
less haulage.

The stock is being built by Bombardier in Derby, so by using Old Dalby
it
can be commissioned whilst on delivery.


Aylesbury to Claydon is also not electrified at all.

While Old Dalby is currently (excuse the pun) NR 25 kV AC and Movias
need LU 660 VDC, the grid feeder substation and switching gear will
already be in place, along with linseside fencing to latest standards
and so on. Its rather simpler to convert an already existing
electrification from one to another sytem even if they are very
different.

Old Dalby will be available for testing full time. Aylesbury to Claydon has
booked trains (binliners), and because of the low speed and long block
section the binliners wouldn't actually leave a lot of time for testing. Old
Dalby also has a depot which was built and used for the Pendolino testing.

Aylesbury to Claydon is also used as part of a diversionary route to
MOD Bicester.

In article om,
Stephen Furley writes
How do they get around the ban on new unprotected third rail
electrifications? Does this not apply to third/fourth rail systems?
Does it not apply to this line as it's not open to the public? Does
this count as an extension to an existing system (the London
Underground) even though it's not physically connected to it? Would
they have to obtain a special excemption from the regulations to do
this?

Have we established that there are such regulations, as opposed to just
a rumour of a position from HSE?

--
Clive D.W. Feather | Home:
Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org
Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work:
Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is:

On Feb 14, 6:30 pm, "Nick Lawford" wrote:
While they are at it why not commission 25 kV on S-stock so that e.g.
District line trains can penetrate the Tilbury lines. Do it now rather

What for? Its being designed for the tube system , not national rail.
Different radio
systems, different ATP systems , possibly a slightly different loading
gauge,. not to mention
the 4th rail shoes dangling inbetween the rails that could foul some
mainline track systems.

Anyway , why would district stock ever run through to tilbury anyway?

B2003

Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:55:01 on Thu, 15
Feb 2007, R.C. Payne remarked:
My understanding is the ban comes from regulations about exposed
electrical conductors in the workplace, the workplace relating to
track workers and the like. Presumably on a test line it is
relatively straightforward to set up the safety case in such a way
that the rails are switched off an earthed down before anyone goes out
onto the track.

That would tend to suggest driverless trains. Or if one breaks down on
the test track, a very long wait for the driver to be "rescued".

Surely on a test facility there will be people on the ground monitoring
and controlling things? It can't be that hard for the driver to radio
control, tell them he's broken down or needs to get off, and have them
turn the current off. Wouldn't work to run a mainline railway like
that, but I can't see it being such a problem for a test track.

Robin

In message .com
"Boltar" wrote:

On Feb 14, 6:30 pm, "Nick Lawford" wrote:
While they are at it why not commission 25 kV on S-stock so that e.g.
District line trains can penetrate the Tilbury lines. Do it now rather

What for? Its being designed for the tube system , not national rail.
Different radio
systems, different ATP systems , possibly a slightly different loading
gauge,. not to mention
the 4th rail shoes dangling inbetween the rails that could foul some
mainline track systems.

Anyway , why would district stock ever run through to tilbury anyway?



Some District Line trains ran through to Southend before the war. Service
lasted from 1 Jun 1910 to 30 Sep 1939. The trains were hauled by pairs of
District Line electric locos from Ealing to Barking where LTS*steam locos
took over.

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html

"Boltar" wrote

Anyway , why would district stock ever run through to tilbury anyway?

1910 - 1939 there were through trains between Ealing Broadway and Southend,
electric-hauled over the District between Ealing Broadway and Barking, and
changing engines there.

Peter