In message , Bob Wood
writes
Ian Jelf wrote:

I don't think they actually close Coventry Garden on Saturday
afternoons any more, do they? (Checks TfL site: no they don't; the
Tube Map simply states that the station gets very busy and
suggests alternatives.)

Covent Garden is 'Way Out only' at all times until the end of the year.

*Really*?! Then it shows that TfL's encouragement to use other
stations to get there works; despite spending a lot of time in CG it's
ages since I've used the tube station there!

Interestingly, there's nothing to this effect on the downloadable Tube
Map (which was where I checked for my original posting). I had to go
to Live Travel News to find the closure. (Not that I didn't believe
you, Bob!)
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

In message , Ian Jelf
writes

In message , Bob Wood
writes

Covent Garden is 'Way Out only' at all times until the end of the year.

*Really*?! Then it shows that TfL's encouragement to use other
stations to get there works;

The reason is actually because TfL are currently enlarging the ticket
hall and providing five new exit gates, which also means that there is
currently no room for either ticket machines or a ticket office, hence
the station is exit only until December.

Its the second stage in the improvement plan announced a couple of years
ago (the first being improved signage).

The third stage, if it goes ahead, will be the addition of a second
ticket hall and more lifts, or possibly escalators.
--
Paul Terry

David of Broadway wrote:

Catching up? With three exceptions, every single subway station in New
York is open around the clock. (The three exceptions are the two
northernmost stations on the 3, which are replaced by bus service at
night, and Broad Street on the J/M/Z, which is closed on weekends, when
the J is cut back to Chambers Street.)

Actually, there's a fourth exception: the Aqueduct Racetrack station is
only open when the racetrack itself is open. And southbound trains
never stop there, since the platform is on the northbound side, adjacent
to the racetrack. Good thing the Aqueduct-N. Conduit Boulevard station
is so close by.
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA

James Farrar wrote:
On Wed, 01 Aug 2007 00:06:47 -0400, David of Broadway
wrote:

But London also has a good number of stations that have strange hours.
Closed weekends.

Just Cannon Street now, is it not?

Also Barbican, no? Or is Barbican open Saturdays but closed Sundays? I
forget.

Rush hours only. Rush hours and Sunday mornings only.

Can't think of an example of either of these.

For the former, Aldwych and the entire Ongar line. For the latter,
Shoreditch. Of course, all are in the past tense.

Open for exit and interchange only at certain times. Etc.

Ah, yes. Camden Town and Covent Garden - the latter mainly because
people refuse to actually look at a map and see that Covent Garden is
very close at street level to various other stations not on the
Piccadilly line, leading to almost everyone going there cramming
through the tiny station.

But the Underground map doesn't show distances at street level!

I'm not questioning the reasons for the anomalies. Even if they've been
instituted for the best of reasons, an anomaly is still a potential
point of confusion, especially if in an area frequented by tourists and
other irregular users.
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA

In message , David of Broadway
writes

Also Barbican, no? Or is Barbican open Saturdays but closed Sundays? I
forget.

Barbican has been open 7 days a week for many years now.

--
Paul Terry

On 1 Aug, 04:53, David of Broadway
wrote:
Many lines have three tracks, although only a few actually have regular
service scheduled to run on the middle track. On the others, the middle
track is still available for scheduled and unscheduled reroutes.
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA

How does that work, exactly?
I thought the third track was always used for express services in the
peak direction.

sweek wrote:
On 1 Aug, 04:53, David of Broadway
wrote:
Many lines have three tracks, although only a few actually have regular
service scheduled to run on the middle track. On the others, the middle
track is still available for scheduled and unscheduled reroutes.

How does that work, exactly?
I thought the third track was always used for express services in the
peak direction.

On some lines (the Flushing line, the Pelham line, the lower White
Plains Road line, the Concourse line, and part of the Broadway-Brooklyn
line), the middle track indeed carries express trains in the peak
direction, either rush hours only or also middays on weekdays. Other
lines (the West End line, the Sea Beach line, the Culver line, part of
the Broadway-Brooklyn line, both segments of the Upper Broadway line,
the upper White Plains Road line, and the Jerome Avenue line) don't have
any regularly scheduled express service, but the middle track is still
available if necessary - for instance, to run around a stalled train on
the local track or to allow for weekend track work on the local track.
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA

Paul Terry wrote:
In message , David of Broadway
writes

Also Barbican, no? Or is Barbican open Saturdays but closed Sundays?
I forget.

Barbican has been open 7 days a week for many years now.

Excellent! I never understood that closure.
--
David of Broadway
New York, NY, USA

On Tue, 31 Jul 2007, David of Broadway wrote:

Tom Anderson wrote:
On Mon, 30 Jul 2007, David of Broadway wrote:

The statements about your lack of express services were probably
referring to the Underground, where they're largely accurate, except
on the western Piccadilly and Metropolitan.

Strictly speaking, that're true, but my point was that NR trains act as
expresses for LU lines in some situations. For example, the Great
Northern from King's Cross, which only has stations north of Finsbury
Park (if you forget about Moorgate and all that) is the express service
of the northeastern Piccadilly. The London, Tilbury and Southend line
is the express service of the eastern District. Other lines don't have
such close correspondence to LU lines, but often serve overlapping
areas at the edge of town, providing a quicker service in.

And we in New York have the LIRR between Jamaica and Penn Station and
Metro-North between various points in the Bronx and Grand Central.
(Granted, the subway has substantially lower fares.)

Absolutely. I wasn't for a moment trying to imply that London had
something that New York didn't - perish the thought! Just that it doesn't
give a complete view to say that London has no expresses, as this implies
that wherever you are, you're looking at a
one-stop-each-and-every-500-metres ride into town.

In New York, I might hop on a 1 local train at 116th Street, transfer to the
2/3 express at 96th Street, transfer back to the 1 local at 14th Street, and
get off at Houston Street. (Whether I save any time in the process is a
different question - in my experience, depending on the time of day, it could
jump me ahead one or two locals. OTOH, if there's a long wait for the
express, I might not even catch the local I started on.)

Or maybe I'm taking a relatively short trip, one for which the time savings
on the express are minimal. I can simply take whichever train comes first,
since the local and express stop at the same station, usually at the same
platform.

Or if a train breaks down on one track, the following trains can be rerouted
around it on the other track. The resulting congestion is sometimes painful,
and local passengers may have to backtrack, but at least the trains can keep
moving.

And, as has been pointed out elsewhere, parallel tracks make track work much
easier to carry out while the trains are still running.

Yes, yes, i'm not debating the superiority of the NYC system. Merely
making an observation about London!

I really do wish we had the kind of robustness multi-tracking affords,
though. Even bidirectional signalling and a few more crossovers would be
something.

tom

--
The girlfriend of my friend is my enemy.

On Tue, 31 Jul 2007, Mr Thant wrote:

On Jul 31, 5:04 pm, James Farrar wrote:

The greatest advantage of the four-track system [1] is that it allows
24-hour running.

I don't think this is actually as important as it's made out to be. The
system has a lot of two track sections that are also 24 hour, and even
in the four track sections one pair is generally in use 24 hours a day,
with only occasional diversions for engineering. It'd be interesting to
find out what working practices allow this and whether they could be
applied in London.

I would also like to know this.

tom

--
The girlfriend of my friend is my enemy.