On 9 Sep, 19:40, (Colin Rosenstiel) wrote:
In article . com,

(Mizter T) wrote:
Of course a fundamental issue is that the Oxford Circus
cross-platform goodness isn't at all apparent on the Tube map.

What chance this mapping improvement could be made? Has anyone ever
tried?


There could be problems in terms of changing the configuration of the
lines in the central area on the Tube map because...
(a) it follows Beck's basic principle of having the whole of the map
hang of the Northern line on the x axis and the Central line on the y
axis - messing with this could create a bit of a messy jumble in the
middle; and
(b) in this case the map does broadly relate to reality, when one
considers where Waterloo, Euston and Kings Cross are on the ground - a
via Oxford Circus journey does literally involve a swing out to the
west.

I don't recall ever having seen a map that rejigs the lines so as to
emphasise the Oxford Circus cross-platform interchange.

The other way of doing it would involve introducing some extra symbols
- or at least some kind of pictoral device at Oxford Circus - to the
Tube map.

Since his retirement from international diplomacy Mr Thant has become
especially interested in public transport in London, so much so that
he tried his had at doing just that:
http://tinyurl.com/238mn2
(it is as yet unfinished - or perhaps he intends on having the eastern
side of London nuked)

The non-map way of doing things would be to have lots of signs and
posters - possibly with a further highlighted mini-map - advising
passengers going between Waterloo/Embankment/Charing Cross and Euston/
KXSP to use the Bakerloo & Victoria via Oxford Circus.

On 9 Sep, 20:02, Mizter T wrote:
On 9 Sep, 19:40, (Colin Rosenstiel) wrote:

In article . com,

(Mizter T) wrote:
Of course a fundamental issue is that the Oxford Circus
cross-platform goodness isn't at all apparent on the Tube map.

What chance this mapping improvement could be made? Has anyone ever
tried?

There could be problems in terms of changing the configuration of the
lines in the central area on the Tube map because...
(a) it follows Beck's basic principle of having the whole of the map
hang of the Northern line on the x axis and the Central line on the y
axis - messing with this could create a bit of a messy jumble in the
middle; and
(b) in this case the map does broadly relate to reality, when one
considers where Waterloo, Euston and Kings Cross are on the ground - a
via Oxford Circus journey does literally involve a swing out to the
west.

I don't recall ever having seen a map that rejigs the lines so as to
emphasise the Oxford Circus cross-platform interchange.

The other way of doing it would involve introducing some extra symbols
- or at least some kind of pictoral device at Oxford Circus - to the
Tube map.

Since his retirement from international diplomacy Mr Thant has become
especially interested in public transport in London, so much so that
he tried his had at doing just that:http://tinyurl.com/238mn2
(it is as yet unfinished - or perhaps he intends on having the eastern
side of London nuked)

The non-map way of doing things would be to have lots of signs and
posters - possibly with a further highlighted mini-map - advising
passengers going between Waterloo/Embankment/Charing Cross and Euston/
KXSP to use the Bakerloo & Victoria via Oxford Circus.


Whoops - I have erroneously included Euston in my above post when of
course it's irrelevant - passnegers from Waterloo/Embankment/Charing X
to Euston can save themselves the hassle of following my instructions
and changing lines by going direct on the Northern line! D'oh.

"Mizter T" wrote

Going south, for any destination from Stockwell southwards passengers
should stay on the Victoria line, so that leaves Kennington and Oval
as the only other two destinations where one must make a more awkward
change.

though from north of Kings Cross on the Victoria Line one can reach these
stations by one cross-platform change at Euston (not entirely intuitive, as
it involves doubling back via Kings Cross).

Peter

In article .com,
(Mizter T) wrote:

The non-map way of doing things would be to have lots of signs and
posters - possibly with a further highlighted mini-map - advising
passengers going between Waterloo/Embankment/Charing Cross and Euston/
KXSP to use the Bakerloo & Victoria via Oxford Circus.

Ah! The old "Follow the lights" system!

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In article .com,
Mizter T writes

snip

The non-map way of doing things would be to have lots of signs and
posters - possibly with a further highlighted mini-map - advising
passengers going between Waterloo/Embankment/Charing Cross and Euston/
KXSP to use the Bakerloo & Victoria via Oxford Circus.

Whatever happened to the "follow the green lights for Waterloo" etc.
which used to be displayed at many interchange stations?
--
Bill Borland

On 9 Sep, 20:09, "Peter Masson" wrote:
"Mizter T" wrote

Going south, for any destination from Stockwell southwards passengers
should stay on the Victoria line, so that leaves Kennington and Oval
as the only other two destinations where one must make a more awkward
change.

though from north of Kings Cross on the Victoria Line one can reach these
stations by one cross-platform change at Euston (not entirely intuitive, as
it involves doubling back via Kings Cross).

Peter

Quite true, and a good point - and of course it works exactly the same
going north as well.

I don't think that doubling back via Euston has ever crossed my mind -
in the past I'll have always been amongst the throng changing lines
through the passageways at KXSP. Of course with heavy luggage one has
different considerations. I shall bear that idea in mind - it could be
useful for anyone with bags heading from the Vic to London Bridge, for
example.

I suppose that it would likely take a bit longer, though that could
depend somewhat on how clogged up with people KXSP is and thus how
rapidly one can negotiate the station. It's certainly easier though!

On 9 Sep, 20:01, Olof Lagerkvist wrote:
Colin Rosenstiel wrote:
In article m,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On Sep 9, 4:22 pm, Mizter T wrote:

Clapham North and Clapham Common are the only two surviving
subterranean true island platforms on the whole Underground
network.

Have the Glasgow island platforms gone now?

St Enoch has been rebuilt and IIRC one more station (Buchanan Street?),
all other still have island platforms.


It's been a while since I've been in Glasgow but I remember finding
them slightly disconcerting too - not helped by the fact that, at
least as I remember it, there wasn't anything upright on the island
platforms - either to sit or lean on or simply for psychological
reasons (I could grab hold of that just in case!).

Before linking you to some photos I do just want to reassert that I am
a tough guy really... honest!

West Street station:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:G...nderground.jpg
Kelvinhall station:
http://www.urbanrail.net/eu/gla/kelvinhall1.jpg
Shields Road station:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/teflon/518512661/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/nicohogg/74463281/
....though as one of the commentators says one side of this platform at
Buchanon Street station now has a screen...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/sdstrowes/286751141/

And this platform at Kelvinbridge looks somewhat wider that the above
examples:
http://www.urbanrail.net/eu/gla/kelvinbridge1.jpg

Incidentally on the Wikipedia entry I found a link to this fantastic
forum posting full of photos of the Glasgow subway of old -
fascinating:
http://www.hiddenglasgow.com/forums/...pic.php?t=1057

On Sun, 9 Sep 2007 20:56:35 +0100, Bill Borland
wrote:

In article .com,
Mizter T writes

snip

The non-map way of doing things would be to have lots of signs and
posters - possibly with a further highlighted mini-map - advising
passengers going between Waterloo/Embankment/Charing Cross and Euston/
KXSP to use the Bakerloo & Victoria via Oxford Circus.

Whatever happened to the "follow the green lights for Waterloo" etc.
which used to be displayed at many interchange stations?

It must be fairly long dead, since I have no memory of it (despite two
of you mentioning it!)

Mizter T wrote:

On 9 Sep, 20:01, Olof Lagerkvist wrote:

St Enoch has been rebuilt and IIRC one more station (Buchanan Street?),
all other still have island platforms.



It's been a while since I've been in Glasgow but I remember finding
them slightly disconcerting too - not helped by the fact that, at
least as I remember it, there wasn't anything upright on the island
platforms - either to sit or lean on or simply for psychological
reasons (I could grab hold of that just in case!).

Before linking you to some photos I do just want to reassert that I am
a tough guy really... honest!


Yes sure, me too. Hm. Anyway, thanks for the links! I was in Glasgow
last year and I had exactly the same feeling about the island platforms.

And this platform at Kelvinbridge looks somewhat wider that the above
examples:
http://www.urbanrail.net/eu/gla/kelvinbridge1.jpg


Yes it is wider and does not really give the same scary feeling. That
station is also a little bit different because it is a lot deeper below
ground than the others.

--
Olof Lagerkvist
ICQ: 724451
Web: http://here.is/olof

On Sun, 9 Sep 2007, Mizter T wrote:

On 9 Sep, 20:09, "Peter Masson" wrote:
"Mizter T" wrote

Going south, for any destination from Stockwell southwards passengers
should stay on the Victoria line, so that leaves Kennington and Oval
as the only other two destinations where one must make a more awkward
change.

though from north of Kings Cross on the Victoria Line one can reach
these stations by one cross-platform change at Euston (not entirely
intuitive, as it involves doubling back via Kings Cross).

Quite true, and a good point - and of course it works exactly the same
going north as well.

I don't think that doubling back via Euston has ever crossed my mind -

I do it quite often if i have heavy bags, or if i'm tired. Every time i
do, i curse the architects of the Victoria line for putting the
cross-platform interchange at Euston instead of King's Cross!

tom

--
Also, a 'dark future where there is only war!' ... have you seen the
news lately? -- applez