In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

IIRC, I bought a Saver Return ticket to Gatwick from the ticket
machine at KX Thameslink, which listed Gatwick and London Terminals
as my destinations. Going through the gates and getting out to the
airport was not a problem, but the return was another story as the
gates would not let me exit back at KX Thameslink.

One of the attendents then told me that the ticket was not good as
the destination was London Terminals, although he waved me through.

So,

-- Why was I sold that ticket if there was going to be a problem with

my getting back? Was it actually me who purchased the wrong ticket?
If so, then what ticket should I have purchased?

Because the ticket machine was very badly programmed badly. Anyone
buying tickets at KX Thameslink for a trip to Gatwick quite obviously
wants to use Thameslink through central London to get there. The
ticket machine there shouldn't have even offered anything else.

A properly issued ticket for that journey would have specified Kings
Cross Thameslink as the named station of origin station (*not* London
Terminals).

Isn't a St Pancras International-Gatwick ticket cheaper now as well?

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On 4 Mar, 01:02, (Colin Rosenstiel) wrote:

In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 3 Mar, 20:45, wrote:

IIRC, I bought a Saver Return ticket to Gatwick from the ticket
machine at KX Thameslink, which listed Gatwick and London Terminals
as my destinations. Going through the gates and getting out to the
airport was not a problem, but the return was another story as the
gates would not let me exit back at KX Thameslink.

One of the attendents then told me that the ticket was not good as
the destination was London Terminals, although he waved me through.

So,

-- Why was I sold that ticket if there was going to be a problem with
my getting back? Was it actually me who purchased the wrong ticket?
If so, then what ticket should I have purchased?

Because the ticket machine was very badly programmed badly. Anyone
buying tickets at KX Thameslink for a trip to Gatwick quite obviously
wants to use Thameslink through central London to get there. The
ticket machine there shouldn't have even offered anything else.

A properly issued ticket for that journey would have specified Kings
Cross Thameslink as the named station of origin station (*not* London
Terminals).

Isn't a St Pancras International-Gatwick ticket cheaper now as well?


Cheaper than what?

For London to Gatwick journeys, FCC-only tickets are cheaper than 'Any
Permitted' tickets (though not as cheaper {sic} as they used to be). I
suppose it would be possible for one to obtain a St Pancras Int'l -
Gatwick 'Any Permitted' ticket instead of an FCC-only one, if you
particularly wanted to travel down from London Bridge on the slow
Southern train!

However it is quite possible for one to obtain an FCC-only London
Terminals - Gatwick ticket - the same rules as detailed upthread would
apply, i.e. it would only be valid for journeys starting from City
Thameslink and points south (Blackfriars, London Bridge) though you
would only be able to use it on FCC trains.

Because the world is mad you cannot use 'Any Permitted' tickets on
Gatwick Express - though this problem will shortly be remedied with
the abolishment of Gatwick Express.

Well, that's not quite the story!

On 4 Mar, 00:31, wrote:
The all important sentence from the National Fares Manual is this...

"In addition London Terminals fares are NOT valid if travelling beyond
St. Pancras International from the north or beyond City Thameslink
from the south."- Hide quoted text -


So can I get a priv ticket from Radlett to Farringdon, or would I need
to get out at St Pancras International, surrender the ticket, then use
the oyster for the rest of the journey?


You can get a ticket (whether priv or normal) no problem, you just
need to specify Farringdon as your destination when you start off.

You will actually be issued with a ticket to destination "London
Thameslink" (see bottom left of page A5 of the NFM) - this is a
special group of stations that includes...

St Pancras Int'l, Farringdon, City Thameslink, London Blackfriars,
London Bridge and Elephant & Castle

....so if you have a return you can start from any of those stations
back up to Radlett.

Note that whilst fares *to* these stations are issued to "London
Thameslink", tickets purchased *from* these stations are issued with
the origin as the specific named station.

Mizter T wrote:

However it is quite possible for one to obtain an FCC-only London
Terminals - Gatwick ticket - the same rules as detailed upthread would
apply, i.e. it would only be valid for journeys starting from City
Thameslink and points south (Blackfriars, London Bridge) though you
would only be able to use it on FCC trains.

Because the world is mad you cannot use 'Any Permitted' tickets on
Gatwick Express - though this problem will shortly be remedied with
the abolishment of Gatwick Express.

Is this a general statement, or only about London Terminals-GTW tickets?
--
Michael Hoffman

On 4 Mar, 01:50, Mizter T wrote:
Because the world is mad you cannot use 'Any Permitted' tickets on
Gatwick Express - though this problem will shortly be remedied with
the abolishment of Gatwick Express.

According to TheTrainLine, there is no Any Permitted London Terminals-
Gatwick fare.

I've used a Gatwick-Finsbury Park "Any Permitted" ticket on the
Gatwick Express without any objection from the ticket inspector, and
it's cheaper than the standard Gatwick Express fare to London.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 4 Mar, 01:02, (Colin Rosenstiel) wrote:

In article

,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 3 Mar, 20:45, wrote:

IIRC, I bought a Saver Return ticket to Gatwick from the ticket
machine at KX Thameslink, which listed Gatwick and London
Terminals as my destinations. Going through the gates and
getting out to the airport was not a problem, but the return
was another story as the gates would not let me exit gates would
gates would not let me exit back at KX Thameslink.

One of the attendents then told me that the ticket was not good
as the destination was London Terminals, although he waved me
through.

So,

-- Why was I sold that ticket if there was going to be a problem
with my getting back? Was it actually me who purchased the wrong
ticket? If so, then what ticket should I have purchased?

Because the ticket machine was very badly programmed badly. Anyone
buying tickets at KX Thameslink for a trip to Gatwick quite
obviously wants to use Thameslink through central London to get
there. The ticket machine there shouldn't have even offered
anything else.

A properly issued ticket for that journey would have specified
Kings Cross Thameslink as the named station of origin station
(*not* London Terminals).

Isn't a St Pancras International-Gatwick ticket cheaper now as
well?

Cheaper than what?

For London to Gatwick journeys, FCC-only tickets are cheaper than
'Any Permitted' tickets (though not as cheaper {sic} as they used to
be). I suppose it would be possible for one to obtain a St Pancras
Int'l - Gatwick 'Any Permitted' ticket instead of an FCC-only one, if
you particularly wanted to travel down from London Bridge on the slow
Southern train!

However it is quite possible for one to obtain an FCC-only London
Terminals - Gatwick ticket - the same rules as detailed upthread
would apply, i.e. it would only be valid for journeys starting from
City
Thameslink and points south (Blackfriars, London Bridge) though you
would only be able to use it on FCC trains.

I was thinking of FCC-only tickets valid for that journey, as offered to
me for Cambridge-Brighton via London journeys.

Anyway, I had to go to City Thameslink today because that's where FCC
have hidden the lost property office we in Cambridge have to use now. It
would be too convenient for them to continue using the Cambridge lost
property office for GN route stuff, after all!

So I made a point of asking the Shere machine at Cambridge not for a
London Terminals day return but one to City Thameslink. It sold me one to
London Terminals anyway, at the usual price.

I asked at the Cambridge barriers whether the barriers at Kings Cross
would take the ticket. They thought they would.

When I got to King's Cross suburban I asked how I was supposed to get to
City Thameslink and they let me through the barrier manually. At St
Pancras International the barrier let me though with the ticket and at
City Thameslink (what a walk to the Holborn Viaduct exit!) the barrier
let me through and swallowed my ticket. So a lot of systems seem not to
agree with the fares manual!

I'd have got there a lot quicker by bike, mind.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

Colin Rosenstiel wrote:
In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 4 Mar, 01:02, (Colin Rosenstiel) wrote:

In article

,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 3 Mar, 20:45, wrote:
IIRC, I bought a Saver Return ticket to Gatwick from the ticket
machine at KX Thameslink, which listed Gatwick and London
Terminals as my destinations. Going through the gates and
getting out to the airport was not a problem, but the return
was another story as the gates would not let me exit gates would
gates would not let me exit back at KX Thameslink.
One of the attendents then told me that the ticket was not good
as the destination was London Terminals, although he waved me
through.
So,
-- Why was I sold that ticket if there was going to be a problem
with my getting back? Was it actually me who purchased the wrong
ticket? If so, then what ticket should I have purchased?
Because the ticket machine was very badly programmed badly. Anyone
buying tickets at KX Thameslink for a trip to Gatwick quite
obviously wants to use Thameslink through central London to get
there. The ticket machine there shouldn't have even offered
anything else.
A properly issued ticket for that journey would have specified
Kings Cross Thameslink as the named station of origin station
(*not* London Terminals).
Isn't a St Pancras International-Gatwick ticket cheaper now as
well?
Cheaper than what?

For London to Gatwick journeys, FCC-only tickets are cheaper than
'Any Permitted' tickets (though not as cheaper {sic} as they used to
be). I suppose it would be possible for one to obtain a St Pancras
Int'l - Gatwick 'Any Permitted' ticket instead of an FCC-only one, if
you particularly wanted to travel down from London Bridge on the slow
Southern train!

However it is quite possible for one to obtain an FCC-only London
Terminals - Gatwick ticket - the same rules as detailed upthread
would apply, i.e. it would only be valid for journeys starting from
City
Thameslink and points south (Blackfriars, London Bridge) though you
would only be able to use it on FCC trains.

I was thinking of FCC-only tickets valid for that journey, as offered to
me for Cambridge-Brighton via London journeys.

Anyway, I had to go to City Thameslink today because that's where FCC
have hidden the lost property office we in Cambridge have to use now. It
would be too convenient for them to continue using the Cambridge lost
property office for GN route stuff, after all!

So I made a point of asking the Shere machine at Cambridge not for a
London Terminals day return but one to City Thameslink. It sold me one to
London Terminals anyway, at the usual price.

I asked at the Cambridge barriers whether the barriers at Kings Cross
would take the ticket. They thought they would.

When I got to King's Cross suburban I asked how I was supposed to get to
City Thameslink and they let me through the barrier manually. At St
Pancras International the barrier let me though with the ticket and at
City Thameslink (what a walk to the Holborn Viaduct exit!) the barrier
let me through and swallowed my ticket. So a lot of systems seem not to
agree with the fares manual!

I'd have got there a lot quicker by bike, mind.


Southern ticket offices have told me a couple of times in the past 3-4
months that Croydon/Sutton/etc to St Pancras (was KXTL) route Thameslink
tickets are no more, and a London Terminals ticket is now valid though
London by FCC. I queried it each time, but they said it was valid and it
worked the gates. Sutton/Croydon - London Terminals tickets always used
to work the gates at KXTL, though not Farringdon.

--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 17:59:51 -0800 (PST), Mizter T
wrote:

On 4 Mar, 00:31, wrote:
The all important sentence from the National Fares Manual is this...

"In addition London Terminals fares are NOT valid if travelling beyond
St. Pancras International from the north or beyond City Thameslink
from the south."- Hide quoted text -


So can I get a priv ticket from Radlett to Farringdon, or would I need
to get out at St Pancras International, surrender the ticket, then use
the oyster for the rest of the journey?


You can get a ticket (whether priv or normal) no problem, you just
need to specify Farringdon as your destination when you start off.

You will actually be issued with a ticket to destination "London
Thameslink"

Not necessarily. From St Albans I can get a ticket either to
Farringdon Und, route Not Underground, or to London Thameslink. ISTR
that the latter did not work the barrier at Farrongdon but was
accepted by the barrier staff.


--
Peter Lawrence

Arthur Figgis wrote:

Southern ticket offices have told me a couple of times in the past 3-4
months that Croydon/Sutton/etc to St Pancras (was KXTL) route Thameslink
tickets are no more, and a London Terminals ticket is now valid though
London by FCC.

A Southern ticket office told me that a route SOUTHERN ONLY ticket was
valid on Thameslink too. Use a heaping portion of salt.
--
Michael Hoffman

"Paul Oter" wrote in message
...

As some may know, I have Cambridge - London Terminals season ticket
and commute daily to Moorgate, using LU between KX and Moorgate.

I can confirm my ticket gets rejected by the gates at Barbican and
Farringdon (on the occasions when I tried that I used my pre-pay
Oyster instead to leave the station: that was in the days when you
weren't penalised for an unresolved journey).

I would have thought you should be able to use the side gate. The fact that
a ticket is rejected by the gates doesn't mean it's not valid at that
destination - see my comment about East Croydon below.

However my ticket *does* open the gates at St Pancras Low Level,
despite my ticket not being valid there. (I only ever do this on the
occasions when KX Underground is closed due to overcrowding and
passengers are asked to divert to nearby stations).

I think we need to distinguish between ticket validity and the limitations
of the magnetic stripe technology that drives the gates. For example: my
Hove - London Terminals season is valid at East Croydon but it won't open
the ticket gates there - never has done and never will. I would be
interested in informed opinion as to validity at stations north of City
Thameslink - my understanding is that my ticket is not valid, even though it
*might* operate the gates at St Pancras (because it's a London Terminal).

What I would really like is a season ticket that I can use for travel
between my choice of Moorgate, Barbican, Farringdon, Victoria and Hove or
Brighton (yes, really, I don't need the rest of the Underground most of the
time!). I met someone who had a Hove - Farringdon season which, bizarrely,
was slightly cheaper than either Brighton - Farringdon or Hove - London
Terminals. He didn't seem to have any problem using it for the occasions he
travelled Brighton - Victoria, although he had to use the side gate at the
Brighton end (still bizarre. because my Hove season is quite happy opening
the gates at Brighton.

David A Stocks