In article ,
Mizter T wrote:

No, I bought a CDR - that was 6 quid (or 10 with a network railcard)!


I know what went wrong here. You bought a Stratford to Enfield Lock
"via London" CDR - i.e. for a journey that would have routed you via
Liverpool Street. What you really wanted was a Stratford to Enfield
Lock "not London" ticket for a direct journey, which costs the
slightly more reasonable sum of £4.10.

I'm guessing you purchased from a ticket machine, based on your
comments about the Network Railcard price of £10, which is something
would only ever be presented as an option to a passenger by a machine
rather than a human (i.e. a ticket clerk, though perhaps some are on
the edge of being robots)!

Yes.

One thing I'm wondering with hindsight is whether the return portion
of my CDR from Cambridge to London Terminals would have actually been
valid for a trip from Stratford to Enfield Lock? In the event, I ended
up going straight back home from Enfield Lock, changing at Cheshunt,
rather than returning to Stratford.

On 3 Apr, 11:30, Sarah Brown
wrote:

In article ,
Mizter T wrote:

No, I bought a CDR - that was 6 quid (or 10 with a network railcard)!

I know what went wrong here. You bought a Stratford to Enfield Lock
"via London" CDR - i.e. for a journey that would have routed you via
Liverpool Street. What you really wanted was a Stratford to Enfield
Lock "not London" ticket for a direct journey, which costs the
slightly more reasonable sum of £4.10.

I'm guessing you purchased from a ticket machine, based on your
comments about the Network Railcard price of £10, which is something
would only ever be presented as an option to a passenger by a machine
rather than a human (i.e. a ticket clerk, though perhaps some are on
the edge of being robots)!

Yes.

One thing I'm wondering with hindsight is whether the return portion
of my CDR from Cambridge to London Terminals would have actually been
valid for a trip from Stratford to Enfield Lock? In the event, I ended
up going straight back home from Enfield Lock, changing at Cheshunt,
rather than returning to Stratford.

I did think of that, it might have been but I'm just not sure about it.

MIG wrote:

I was told one had to always specifically touch in and out for the DLR,
hence the tunnel readers at Bank.

The explanation for those does seem to be the possibility of arriving
via the lift without passing a gate. I've never had a problem with
not touching there. A touch at the DLR one end and LU the other end,
with no touch while changing, has always resulted in me being charged
for one LU/DLR journey at the right price.

Last week I saw notices by those readers which suggested that they're for
Oyster users going out of zone, not people who've come down in the lift.

Sarah Brown wrote:
One thing I'm wondering with hindsight is whether the return portion
of my CDR from Cambridge to London Terminals would have actually been
valid for a trip from Stratford to Enfield Lock? In the event, I ended
up going straight back home from Enfield Lock, changing at Cheshunt,
rather than returning to Stratford.

I don't think so. The Routeing Guide only gives this one map:
http://www.atoc.org/rsp/_downloads/R...aps/map_wa.htm

Since Stratford isn't a London Terminal, you can't use the branch on
the right on your ticket. But you can use your ticket on that line
north of Tottenham Hale, so you only needed to buy a Stratford-
Tottenham Hale ticket.

Also, as I mentioned, PAYG would also cover Stratford-Tottenham Hale,
though you'd have to get off your train to touch out, then re-enter
with your train ticket and get on the next one.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

On 3 Apr, 12:09, "Tim Roll-Pickering"
wrote:
MIG wrote:
I was told one had to always specifically touch in and out for the DLR,
hence the tunnel readers at Bank.
The explanation for those does seem to be the possibility of arriving
via the lift without passing a gate. *I've never had a problem with
not touching there. * A touch at the DLR one end and LU the other end,
with no touch while changing, has always resulted in me being charged
for one LU/DLR journey at the right price.

Last week I saw notices by those readers which suggested that they're for
Oyster users going out of zone, not people who've come down in the lift.

Yeah, it's possible that you'd enter the system by a cross-platform
interchange and/or ungated station, not needing to touch your Oyster
because of using a travelcard, and then realise that you needed to
travel beyond your zones on LU.

BUT in that case, why only at Bank and only on the DLR? Why can't
they provide them for that purpose on all LU platforms so that you
don't have to go all the way to the exit at the point when you realise
that you are going to use PAYG to complete an unplanned journey (or
extension of a paper travelcard as it happens)?

On Apr 3, 12:11 pm, Mr Thant
wrote:
Sarah Brown wrote:
One thing I'm wondering with hindsight is whether the return portion
of my CDR from Cambridge to London Terminals would have actually been
valid for a trip from Stratford to Enfield Lock? In the event, I ended
up going straight back home from Enfield Lock, changing at Cheshunt,
rather than returning to Stratford.

I don't think so. The Routeing Guide only gives this one map:http://www.atoc.org/rsp/_downloads/R...aps/map_wa.htm

Since Stratford isn't a London Terminal, you can't use the branch on
the right on your ticket. But you can use your ticket on that line
north of Tottenham Hale, so you only needed to buy a Stratford-
Tottenham Hale ticket.

Also, as I mentioned, PAYG would also cover Stratford-Tottenham Hale,
though you'd have to get off your train to touch out, then re-enter
with your train ticket and get on the next one.


I was in a similar situation recently. I was at North Greenwich and
decided to go home to Cambridge via Stratford and Tottenham Hale,
mainly for the novelty of travelling a line I rarely use. I hold a
Cambridge - London Terminals season, which I know isn't valid via
Stratford except for the direct trains that take that route to
Liverpool Street on Sundays).

So I touched in with my PAYG Oyster at North Greenwich, caught a
Jubilee line train and then touched "out" again at Stratford at the
Jubilee gateline. This took me to the confusing interchange area/
concourse that Sarah mentioned. Like her I had difficulty finding the
right platform for the train: I found the platform number on a monitor
but there seemed to be a complete absence of signs telling you how to
get there. Eventually I found the platform, in an obscure corner of
the station, and boarded my train.

I was aware that PAYG was valid between Stratford and Tottenham Hale.
As I had touched in at North Greenwich (and because I believed that
touching out at the unique Jubilee Line "inner-gateline" at Stratford
would be counted as an interchange rather than actually leaving the
system) I assumed I was carrying a valid ticket for this short
journey.

However I got to Tottenham Hale I didn't get off and touch out; I was
now on a route covered by my paper season ticket and simply stayed on
the train as far as Bishop's Stortford where I changed to a Cambridge
train. My thinking was that failing to touch out wouldn't leave me
with an unfinished journey since I had touched out at Stratford.

So if I've got this right, I made a perfectly legal PAYG journey from
Stratford to TH, but where touching out at the TH was entirely
optional.

Do people agree?

PaulO

MIG wrote:

Last week I saw notices by those readers which suggested that they're
for
Oyster users going out of zone, not people who've come down in the lift.

Yeah, it's possible that you'd enter the system by a cross-platform
interchange and/or ungated station, not needing to touch your Oyster
because of using a travelcard, and then realise that you needed to
travel beyond your zones on LU.

BUT in that case, why only at Bank and only on the DLR?

There aren't actually that many other in station Underground-DLR
interchanges that I can think of - Stratford and Canning Town are the only
ones that spring to mind and I don't know if the latter has any internal
readers, but it did used to have a non-Oyster service.

Was the original idea perhaps that DLR would be keep distinct and people
expected to always touch in upon entry.

Why can't
they provide them for that purpose on all LU platforms so that you
don't have to go all the way to the exit at the point when you realise
that you are going to use PAYG to complete an unplanned journey (or
extension of a paper travelcard as it happens)?

Because that would be too convenient for customers?

On 3 Apr, 14:01, Paul Oter wrote:
On Apr 3, 12:11 pm, Mr Thant
wrote:





Sarah Brown wrote:
One thing I'm wondering with hindsight is whether the return portion
of my CDR from Cambridge to London Terminals would have actually been
valid for a trip from Stratford to Enfield Lock? In the event, I ended
up going straight back home from Enfield Lock, changing at Cheshunt,
rather than returning to Stratford.

I don't think so. The Routeing Guide only gives this one map:http://www.atoc.org/rsp/_downloads/R...aps/map_wa.htm

Since Stratford isn't a London Terminal, you can't use the branch on
the right on your ticket. But you can use your ticket on that line
north of Tottenham Hale, so you only needed to buy a Stratford-
Tottenham Hale ticket.

Also, as I mentioned, PAYG would also cover Stratford-Tottenham Hale,
though you'd have to get off your train to touch out, then re-enter
with your train ticket and get on the next one.

I was in a similar situation recently. I was at North Greenwich and
decided to go home to Cambridge via Stratford and Tottenham Hale,
mainly for the novelty of travelling a line I rarely use. I hold a
Cambridge - London Terminals season, which I know isn't valid via
Stratford except for the direct trains that take that route to
Liverpool Street on Sundays).

So I touched in with my PAYG Oyster at North Greenwich, caught a
Jubilee line train and then touched "out" again at Stratford at the
Jubilee gateline. This took me to the confusing interchange area/
concourse that Sarah mentioned. Like her I had difficulty finding the
right platform for the train: I found the platform number on a monitor
but there seemed to be a complete absence of signs telling you how to
get there. Eventually I found the platform, in an obscure corner of
the station, and boarded my train.

I was aware that PAYG was valid between Stratford and Tottenham Hale.
As I had touched in at North Greenwich (and because I believed that
touching out at the unique Jubilee Line "inner-gateline" at Stratford
would be counted as an interchange rather than actually leaving the
system) *I assumed I was carrying a valid ticket for this short
journey.

However I got to Tottenham Hale I didn't get off and touch out; I was
now on a route covered by my paper season ticket and simply stayed on
the train as far as Bishop's Stortford where I changed to a Cambridge
train. *My thinking was that failing to touch out wouldn't leave me
with an unfinished journey since I had touched out at Stratford.

So if I've got this right, I made a perfectly legal PAYG journey from
Stratford to TH, but where touching out at the TH was entirely
optional.

Do people agree?

PaulO- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

It wouldn't leave an unresolved journey, and the Oyster fare for both
journeys is £1, but not touching out at Tottenham Hale technically
retrospectively left you without a valid ticket for Stratford to
Tottenham Hale (although it was potentially valid until you left
Tottenham Hale.)

On 3 Apr, 14:32, Matthew Dickinson
wrote:
On 3 Apr, 14:01, Paul Oter wrote:



On Apr 3, 12:11 pm, Mr Thant
wrote:

Sarah Brown wrote:
One thing I'm wondering with hindsight is whether the return portion
of my CDR from Cambridge to London Terminals would have actually been
valid for a trip from Stratford to Enfield Lock? In the event, I ended
up going straight back home from Enfield Lock, changing at Cheshunt,
rather than returning to Stratford.

I don't think so. The Routeing Guide only gives this one map:http://www.atoc.org/rsp/_downloads/R...aps/map_wa.htm

Since Stratford isn't a London Terminal, you can't use the branch on
the right on your ticket. But you can use your ticket on that line
north of Tottenham Hale, so you only needed to buy a Stratford-
Tottenham Hale ticket.

Also, as I mentioned, PAYG would also cover Stratford-Tottenham Hale,
though you'd have to get off your train to touch out, then re-enter
with your train ticket and get on the next one.

I was in a similar situation recently. I was at North Greenwich and
decided to go home to Cambridge via Stratford and Tottenham Hale,
mainly for the novelty of travelling a line I rarely use. I hold a
Cambridge - London Terminals season, which I know isn't valid via
Stratford except for the direct trains that take that route to
Liverpool Street on Sundays).

So I touched in with my PAYG Oyster at North Greenwich, caught a
Jubilee line train and then touched "out" again at Stratford at the
Jubilee gateline. This took me to the confusing interchange area/
concourse that Sarah mentioned. Like her I had difficulty finding the
right platform for the train: I found the platform number on a monitor
but there seemed to be a complete absence of signs telling you how to
get there. Eventually I found the platform, in an obscure corner of
the station, and boarded my train.

I was aware that PAYG was valid between Stratford and Tottenham Hale.
As I had touched in at North Greenwich (and because I believed that
touching out at the unique Jubilee Line "inner-gateline" at Stratford
would be counted as an interchange rather than actually leaving the
system) I assumed I was carrying a valid ticket for this short
journey.

However I got to Tottenham Hale I didn't get off and touch out; I was
now on a route covered by my paper season ticket and simply stayed on
the train as far as Bishop's Stortford where I changed to a Cambridge
train. My thinking was that failing to touch out wouldn't leave me
with an unfinished journey since I had touched out at Stratford.

So if I've got this right, I made a perfectly legal PAYG journey from
Stratford to TH, but where touching out at the TH was entirely
optional.

Do people agree?

PaulO- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

It wouldn't leave an unresolved journey, and the Oyster fare for both
journeys is £1, but not touching out at Tottenham Hale technically
retrospectively left you without a valid ticket for Stratford to
Tottenham Hale (although it was potentially valid until you left
Tottenham Hale.)

After typing my previous posting I walked over to a nearby tube
station and checked my Oyster journey history. I was charged £1 for
North Greenwich to Stratford with no unresolved journey.

However the fare finder on www.tfl.gov.uk tells me that the fare from
North Greenwich to Tottenham Hale is also £1 so I haven't underpaid,
though I accept that this is a happy coincidence, and I could have
easily ended up underpaying for my total journey despite holding a
valid ticket at every stage of the journey.

PaulO

On 3 Apr, 12:21, MIG wrote:


BUT in that case, why only at Bank and only on the DLR? *Why can't
they provide them for that purpose on all LU platforms so that you
don't have to go all the way to the exit at the point when you realise
that you are going to use PAYG to complete an unplanned journey (or
extension of a paper travelcard as it happens)?

Because, as previously stated, you can use the lift at street level in
King William Street and arrive on the dockloands concourse without
having an option of touching in.