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Door open buttons on London Underground
Greetings.
What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? Regards, Tristan -- _ _V.-o Tristan Miller [en,(fr,de,ia)] Space is limited / |`-' -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= In a haiku, so it's hard (7_\\ http://www.nothingisreal.com/ To finish what you |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Thu, 3 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote:
What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when they don't). tom -- Through the darkness of Future Past the magician longs to see. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On 3 Apr, 21:15, Tom Anderson wrote:
Yes - the past. And the future. The air-conditioned S stock will have doors that automatically close if the train stands in a station too long, to keep the cold air in, and it'll have working door open buttons to get them open again. U -- http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/ A blog about transport projects in London |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote: On Thu, 3 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote: What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when they don't). I recall when I first came to London (Autumn 1997) the District line trains had driver-controlled doors in the summer and passenger-controlled doors in the winter. I don't recall how summer/winter were differentiated; possibly by GMT/BST? In any case, it only lasted a couple of years. I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
"James Farrar" wrote in message ... On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson wrote: Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when they don't). I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. I have heard that the delay caused while pax (both on the train and platform) realised that they had to open the doors themselves made it impossible to keep to the timetable... Paul S |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Apr 3, 9:50*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote: "James Farrar" wrote in message ... On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson wrote: Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when they don't). I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. I have heard that the delay caused while pax (both on the train and platform) realised that they had to open the doors themselves made it impossible to keep to the timetable... It was several years before operators on the Central Line learned how to release the doors less than 30 seconds after the train had arrived at a station. Passengers who had already tried pressing the "open" buttons and found them to do nothing, quite reasonably didn't notice when they were eventually unlocked, adding yet more delay. The same situation now exists on SWT 450s where passengers press the button and nothing happens. Then the guard eventually releases then and somebody eventually notices that the light is on and then presses the button again. Still nothing happens, because the 450 doors are so incredibly slow, so they press again and again while the doors are opening. For some reason the guards don't have the same problem in the 455s. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On 3 Apr, 22:11, MIG wrote:
For some reason the guards don't have the same problem in the 455s.- Hide quoted text - Yes they do!! They now have to actually get out onto the platform before putting the release up! So now passengers furiously stab at the buttons wondering why the doors have not opened straight away like they used to!! As well as that, the ex-508 TSO carriages need a longer button press to get the doors open, so a 455/7, a guard doing it how they want it and the great unwashed all equals....dismay!! |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 15:04:34 -0700 (PDT), Standing at HN28 signal
wrote this gibberish: On 3 Apr, 22:11, MIG wrote: For some reason the guards don't have the same problem in the 455s.- Hide quoted text - Yes they do!! They now have to actually get out onto the platform before putting the release up! So now passengers furiously stab at the buttons wondering why the doors have not opened straight away like they used to!! As well as that, the ex-508 TSO carriages need a longer button press to get the doors open, so a 455/7, a guard doing it how they want it and the great unwashed all equals....dismay!! More than once I've spent a tiring day going around London on the tube and then done a journey, very late and very tired, on a mainline train and when it arrived at my station I just stood there like a muppet waiting for the doors to open, many seconds pass before I realise and press the button. some days the brain is in neutral at 1am... -- Mark. www.MarkVarleyPhoto.co.uk www.TwistedPhotography.co.uk www.TwistedArts.co.uk www.BeautifulBondage.net |
Door open buttons on London Underground
Mr Thant wrote:
The air-conditioned S stock will have doors that automatically close if the train stands in a station too long, to keep the cold air in, and it'll have working door open buttons to get them open again. Maybe they should have revolving doors on the trains. I was once on a crush loaded tube train which pulled into a busy station, but no-one wanted to board at our particular door, so the outside button was not pushed. The people inside all had our backs crushed against the curved door, and when we realised that the door wasn't opening, no-one could work out where the door button was. Extra door buttons on the ceiling would solve the problem, or sensors which automatically open [unlocked] doors if the carriage is crowded. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
Greetings.
In article , James Farrar wrote: On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson wrote: On Thu, 3 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote: What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. Neither of these explanations seems particularly satisfying. I've used plenty of public transport systems in Europe where it was necessary to push a button (or even pull a handle!) to open the carriage door. Surely if continental types can learn to push a button, then so can Londoners. With respect to close-door buttons, that's not really germane to this discussion, as we're talking about open-door buttons. I've never seen an underground carriage with close-door buttons. On systems where there is an open-door button, pushing it causes the door to remain open for some fixed period of time, or until the train is about to leave the station. Regards, Tristan -- _ _V.-o Tristan Miller [en,(fr,de,ia)] Space is limited / |`-' -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= In a haiku, so it's hard (7_\\ http://www.nothingisreal.com/ To finish what you |
Door open buttons on London Underground
Surely
if continental types can learn to push a button, then so can Londoners. My experience of using the overgound (North London Line) with buttons to push suggests a significant proportion of travellers on trains around here have "special needs" in the learning to push buttons curriculum. -- Robin |
Door open buttons on London Underground
Central line 92 stock has door-close buttons, although in common with
other lines as described by others, they haven't been operational for a number of years. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Fri, 4 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote:
In article , James Farrar wrote: On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson wrote: On Thu, 3 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote: What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. Neither of these explanations seems particularly satisfying. I've used plenty of public transport systems in Europe where it was necessary to push a button (or even pull a handle!) to open the carriage door. Surely if continental types can learn to push a button, then so can Londoners. Do you have to use the open button at all stations, or are there some stations where the driver opens all the doors automatically? If not, then these systems are using the same principle as NR trains here, which Londoners do seem to manage to use without too much difficulty. If they do, then it does seem that continentals are cleverer than Londoners. This is where the problem arose here - in some stations, the driver would open the doors, so there was no point pushing the buttons. In some, he wouldn't, so passengers would have to push the button. This is where confusion sets in, because if the door in front of you isn't open, you can never be sure if it's the driver being tardy opening it, in which case you should wait, or a station where he's not going to, in which case you should push the button. This is where the little light on the button comes in - it means "you need to push me to open the door", but this was perhaps not clear enough for the tired commuting brain to reliably handle. tom -- BUTTS LOL |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Apr 5, 12:20*pm, Tom Anderson wrote:
On Fri, 4 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote: In article , James Farrar wrote: On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson wrote: On Thu, 3 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote: What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? *On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. *Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. Neither of these explanations seems particularly satisfying. *I've used plenty of public transport systems in Europe where it was necessary to push a button (or even pull a handle!) to open the carriage door. *Surely if continental types can learn to push a button, then so can Londoners. Do you have to use the open button at all stations, or are there some stations where the driver opens all the doors automatically? If not, then these systems are using the same principle as NR trains here, which Londoners do seem to manage to use without too much difficulty. If they do, then it does seem that continentals are cleverer than Londoners. This is where the problem arose here - in some stations, the driver would open the doors, so there was no point pushing the buttons. In some, he wouldn't, so passengers would have to push the button. This is where confusion sets in, because if the door in front of you isn't open, you can never be sure if it's the driver being tardy opening it, in which case you should wait, or a station where he's not going to, in which case you should push the button. This is where the little light on the button comes in - it means "you need to push me to open the door", but this was perhaps not clear enough for the tired commuting brain to reliably handle. The ceasing of using open buttons on LU seemed to coincide with the installation of platform-edge doors on the Jubilee extension. Certainly on the rest of the Jubilee, rapidly followed by the rest. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Fri, 4 Apr 2008 02:18:37 +0100, John Rowland wrote:
The air-conditioned S stock will have doors that automatically close if the train stands in a station too long, to keep the cold air in, and it'll have working door open buttons to get them open again. Maybe they should have revolving doors on the trains. I was once on a crush loaded tube train which pulled into a busy station, but no-one wanted to board at our particular door, so the outside button was not pushed. The people inside all had our backs crushed against the curved door, and when we realised that the door wasn't opening, no-one could work out where the door button was. Extra door buttons on the ceiling would solve the problem, or sensors which automatically open [unlocked] doors if the carriage is crowded. Or just having the driver open all the doors at busy stations/times. (This would save time anyway as it would avoid the delay between the driver releasing the doors and a passenger pressing the button.) |
Door open buttons on London Underground
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Door open buttons on London Underground
On Apr 5, 3:05*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote: "Colin Rosenstiel" wrote in message .co.uk... In article , (asdf) wrote: Or just having the driver open all the doors at busy stations/times. (This would save time anyway as it would avoid the delay between the driver releasing the doors and a passenger pressing the button.) This makes me ask why some NR stock, e.g. Class 365 networkers, will open the doors immediately after the driver door release if someone is pressing the button while newer stock, e.g. Turbostars, Electrostars and Desiros, not only seem to take longer for the drivers to operate the door releases in the first place but also will not open the door if the button is pressed; you have to release it and press again after the door release. The differences in station dwell times on GN and SWT are horrendous. SWT Desiro doors are released by the guard, but only after he has released his own door and looked down the platform... *Not exactly the fastest operating routine I should think... I'm also fairly sure that plug doors on Networkers are actually faster- moving than the sliding doors on 376s. The Desiro doors are so slow that they alone must add to the dwell time. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Thu, Apr 03, 2008 at 09:43:34PM +0100, James Farrar wrote:
the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. Right, cos drivers never do that. -- David Cantrell | Hero of the Information Age fdisk format reinstall, doo-dah, doo-dah; fdisk format reinstall, it's the Windows way |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On 7 Apr, 12:08, David Cantrell wrote:
On Thu, Apr 03, 2008 at 09:43:34PM +0100, James Farrar wrote: * * * * * * * * * * * *the other being that there were fears of passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other passengers. Right, cos drivers never do that. Drivers certainly do, but in those days there weren't bleepers when passengers closed the doors, so the risks were a bit higher. (I accidentally leant on a button in a crowded 465 and closed the door bleeplessly on someone. For what very limited use they have, it would be better if they weren't there.) |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Apr 3, 8:06 pm, Tristan Miller
wrote: Greetings. What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? The odd thing is that often one will see a passenger - often a tourist- type but occasionally a commuter-type looking person - who presses the Open Door button. I imagine these freaks going to work with a huge feeling of euphoria: "I helped out all those people!" |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Apr 3, 8:06 pm, Tristan Miller
wrote: Greetings. What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? Here is a question you can ask fellow-travellers. On either side of the inside of doors on a Northern Line train there are two vertical yellow bars. ( You can see them in this picture http://tinyurl.com/5uws7q). These slightly slanting yellow bars are the same as any other yellow bars, vertical or horizontal, in the carriage, EXCEPT that there is a black bit of plastic about 6 inches from the top. The question is: What is that piece of black plastic there for? |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Mon, 7 Apr 2008 21:32:32 -0700 (PDT), Offramp
wrote this gibberish: On Apr 3, 8:06 pm, Tristan Miller wrote: Greetings. What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? Here is a question you can ask fellow-travellers. On either side of the inside of doors on a Northern Line train there are two vertical yellow bars. ( You can see them in this picture http://tinyurl.com/5uws7q). These slightly slanting yellow bars are the same as any other yellow bars, vertical or horizontal, in the carriage, EXCEPT that there is a black bit of plastic about 6 inches from the top. The question is: What is that piece of black plastic there for? I'm going to be on the northern line in an hour and now this is going to be really bugging me, what is it there for? -- Mark. www.MarkVarleyPhoto.co.uk www.TwistedPhotography.co.uk www.TwistedArts.co.uk www.BeautifulBondage.net |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Apr 8, 9:49 am, MarkVarley - MVP
wrote: On Mon, 7 Apr 2008 21:32:32 -0700 (PDT), Offramp wrote this gibberish: On Apr 3, 8:06 pm, Tristan Miller wrote: Greetings. What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? Here is a question you can ask fellow-travellers. On either side of the inside of doors on a Northern Line train there are two vertical yellow bars. ( You can see them in this picturehttp://tinyurl.com/5uws7q). These slightly slanting yellow bars are the same as any other yellow bars, vertical or horizontal, in the carriage, EXCEPT that there is a black bit of plastic about 6 inches from the top. The question is: What is that piece of black plastic there for? I'm going to be on the northern line in an hour and now this is going to be really bugging me, what is it there for? -- Mark.http://www.MarkVarleyPhoto.co.ukwww....fulBondage.net I hope you get this in time. If Visually Impaired People put their hands on the black bit then their hand is level with the Open Door switch. That was how they were meant to find it. |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 02:15:07 -0700 (PDT), Offramp
wrote this gibberish: On Apr 8, 9:49 am, MarkVarley - MVP wrote: On Mon, 7 Apr 2008 21:32:32 -0700 (PDT), Offramp wrote this gibberish: On Apr 3, 8:06 pm, Tristan Miller wrote: Greetings. What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used? Here is a question you can ask fellow-travellers. On either side of the inside of doors on a Northern Line train there are two vertical yellow bars. ( You can see them in this picturehttp://tinyurl.com/5uws7q). These slightly slanting yellow bars are the same as any other yellow bars, vertical or horizontal, in the carriage, EXCEPT that there is a black bit of plastic about 6 inches from the top. The question is: What is that piece of black plastic there for? I'm going to be on the northern line in an hour and now this is going to be really bugging me, what is it there for? -- Mark.http://www.MarkVarleyPhoto.co.ukwww....fulBondage.net I hope you get this in time. If Visually Impaired People put their hands on the black bit then their hand is level with the Open Door switch. That was how they were meant to find it. I just got back to see this, I figured it was because the handrails on the trains are colour coded to their routes (lines) but the northern line being black someone decided to make the handrails yellow as it looks nicer and brighter and added black bits for the colour coding. Thats what I came up with anyway :-) -- Mark. www.MarkVarleyPhoto.co.uk www.TwistedPhotography.co.uk www.TwistedArts.co.uk www.BeautifulBondage.net |
Door open buttons on London Underground
On 8 Apr, 16:39, MarkVarley - MVP wrote: On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 02:15:07 -0700 (PDT), Offramp wrote this gibberish: On Apr 8, 9:49 am, MarkVarley - MVP wrote: On Mon, 7 Apr 2008 21:32:32 -0700 (PDT), Offramp wrote this gibberish: (snip) Here is a question you can ask fellow-travellers. On either side of the inside of doors on a Northern Line train there are two vertical yellow bars. (You can see them in this picture http://tinyurl.com/5uws7q). These slightly slanting yellow bars are the same as any other yellow bars, vertical or horizontal, in the carriage, EXCEPT that there is a black bit of plastic about 6 inches from the top. The question is: What is that piece of black plastic there for? I'm going to be on the northern line in an hour and now this is going to be really bugging me, what is it there for? I hope you get this in time. If Visually Impaired People put their hands on the black bit then their hand is level with the Open Door switch. That was how they were meant to find it. I just got back to see this, I figured it was because the handrails on the trains are colour coded to their routes (lines) but the northern line being black someone decided to make the handrails yellow as it looks nicer and brighter and added black bits for the colour coding. Thats what I came up with anyway :-) I hadn't noticed them before but I immediately thought of the explanation that Offramp has subsequently offered - it makes sense. The handrails were never going to be coloured black for the Northern line trains these days, not given the emphasis now placed on 'safety by design' - they need to be a clear prominent colour so they can easily be seen by VIPs (Visually Impaired Persons) and indeed anyone and everyone else. The seat moquettes on the Northern line trains used to be of a specific Northern line design (as can be seen in the photo linked to above) - as indeed was the case on all LU lines - but the Tube Lines infraco, responsible for the Jubilee, Piccadilly and Northern lines has instead replaced most (if not all) the seat moquettes on 'their' lines with a new, standard design. (Someone will be along shortly to say I'm incorrectly using moquette in the plural!) Losing the distinctive line identities on the seat fabrics is in many ways a shame - however that said on the Northern line at least the new, colourful design is perhaps more vibrant and cheery than its black and grey predecessor. |
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