In message
, at
16:13:36 on Sun, 8 Feb 2009, lonelytraveller
remarked:
On 8 Feb, 21:47, Roland Perry wrote:
That's presumably why the modern lift in the old lift shaft is on the
far right hand (ie. eastern) side, ie. adjacent to, but missing, the
junction - so that it can have an intermediate landing, perhaps for
providing some access to the picadilly line via that route.
That depends a bit on whether the passage from there to the Piccadilly
area is a level (and rather long dog-leg) passage. Or does it have an
escalator upwards a northwards as one diagram I have shows.
It could have an escalator, and a lift - there's nothing stopping one
side extending next to the escalator to reach a lift shaft (or vice-
versa at the top side of the escalator).

Only that fact that none of the various plans show such a thing.

The top end of this lift isn't accessible to the public
At the moment... Hence why it would be a good idea for them to close
the passage from ticket hall to GNER and turn it into a slope down,
going from airside ticket hall, to one floor below the ticket hall
level at the top end of this lift.

I'm not that sure they are trying to alter the layout, at this stage.

No lifts to the Victoria Line as far as I can tell.
Apart from the ones they are putting in on the other side of the
stairs from the former thameslink passage?
That would be a logical place, but my "map of all the lifts" doesn't
show it.
Then maybe you might like to adjust the map to account for the facts
underground?

The "map of all the lifts" that I have been looking at doesn't go that
far east, so would require quite a big modification.

I'll add the lifts to the passage-way plan I've been using in my
composite pictures, and post it later today. I'll have to guess where
the Victoria Line lift goes, is it directly ahead as you arrive from the
Piccadilly, or when you arrive from the old KX Thameslink stations, or
in between; and north or south of the passage parallel to the platforms?

|
=============================
| 3 4
ssss----------sssstairs
1 2 |
=============================
|

ie at site 1,2,3,or 4?
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 07:40:40 on Mon, 9 Feb
2009, Roland Perry remarked:

Hmm, what's the opposite of TOC-side.

I just remembered that I know the answer to this, it's "Public Realm".

Give thanks for railway jargon.
--
Roland Perry

The top end of this lift isn't accessible to the public
At the moment... Hence why it would be a good idea for them to close
the passage from ticket hall to GNER and turn it into a slope down,
going from airside ticket hall, to one floor below the ticket hall
level at the top end of this lift.
I'm not that sure they are trying to alter the layout, at this stage.
What layout would that be? The GNER-to-tube passage is being filled in
anyway, as they will be demolishing the 70s concourse, and its layout
was always up for alteration.

I'll have to guess where
the Victoria Line lift goes, is it directly ahead as you arrive from the
Piccadilly, or when you arrive from the old KX Thameslink stations, or
in between; and north or south of the passage parallel to the platforms?

* * * * * * * * * * *|
* * * *=============================
* * * * * * * * * * *| 3 4
* * * * * * * ssss----------sssstairs
* * * * * * * * * * *1 2 |
* * * *=============================
* * * * * * * * * * * * *|

ie at site 1,2,3,or 4?
I'm not exactly sure what your diagram represents, as the passage
south of the victoria line should join up with the passage north of
it. But essentially, the lift is being added in the position you've
written "ssss" on the left hand side of the "----"

A more accurate diagram for the victoria line would look like
|
=============================
|
Lift | stairs
|
=============================
|

On 9 Feb, 07:40, Roland Perry wrote:
And the lift is not for public use, either now or in the future, I
reckon. That's the important aspect.
I can't see why it wouldn't be, its in an excellent location for the
northern ticket hall access.
It's buried in the office area behind the ticket counters, and
landside[1], so the possibilities seem limited.
Only at ticket hall level, hence using a gentle slope to go one floor
below ticket hall level would make it very accessible

In uk.transport.london message , Sun,
8 Feb 2009 23:16:38, Andrew Heenan posted:
"Tom Anderson" :
airside
We have to come up with a better term for this!
I think i've seen fare-paid used in this way, but it's not as snappy.
How about railside?
Trainside expresses the essence of it. Railside and trackside seem
better suited to the land between the tracks and the fences which is used
only for the placement of railway accessories.
You're right that trackside is already taken. Trainside makes sense.
Analogy to the aviation term would suggest steelside!

Tocside - no room for confusion.

That sounds like one half of a pendulum clock.

--
(c) John Stockton, nr London, UK. Turnpike v6.05.
Web URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/ - w. FAQish topics, links, acronyms
PAS EXE etc : URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/programs/ - see 00index.htm
Dates - miscdate.htm moredate.htm js-dates.htm pas-time.htm critdate.htm etc.

wrote in
news
In article , (Roland
Perry) wrote:

In message , at
16:34:57 on Sat, 7 Feb 2009, remarked:
The access from the concourse doesn't close till tomorrow.

I keep forgetting it's been delayed.

Only until today, though.

When I first used that entrance regularly - maybe around 1980 - there was a
boarded-up escalator from the passage-that-has-just-been-closed up to the
mainline station concourse, adjoining the stairs. Later, it was removed
and the stairs were widened. I often wondered (as I lugged my bags up the
stairs) whether it was ever in use and why it was removed.

Peter

--
Peter Campbell Smith ~ London ~ pjcs00 (a) gmail.com

In message
, at
03:18:37 on Mon, 9 Feb 2009, lonelytraveller
remarked:
* * * * * * * * * * *|
* * * *=============================
* * * * * * * * * * *| 3 4
* * * * * * * ssss----------sssstairs
* * * * * * * * * * *1 2 |
* * * *=============================
* * * * * * * * * * * * *|

ie at site 1,2,3,or 4?
I'm not exactly sure what your diagram represents,

It's the way the passages are shown on the diagram I have used when
constructing:

http://www.perry.co.uk/images/kx-composite.jpg

as the passage
south of the victoria line should join up with the passage north of
it. But essentially, the lift is being added in the position you've
written "ssss" on the left hand side of the "----"

A more accurate diagram for the victoria line would look like
|
=============================
|
Lift | stairs
|
=============================
|

That is what they call the "phase 1" layout (albeit with the lift
missing), but my diagram above is base don the "phase 2" final version.

Or are they not doing that final bit of adjusting after all?
--
Roland Perry

In message
, at
03:18:51 on Mon, 9 Feb 2009, lonelytraveller
remarked:
And the lift is not for public use, either now or in the future, I
reckon. That's the important aspect.
I can't see why it wouldn't be, its in an excellent location for the
northern ticket hall access.
It's buried in the office area behind the ticket counters, and
landside[1], so the possibilities seem limited.
Only at ticket hall level, hence using a gentle slope to go one floor
below ticket hall level would make it very accessible

But they've just finished a huge re-building of that area without such a
slope, and it's not shown on any of the plans.
--
Roland Perry

"Andrew Heenan" wrote in message
...

Tocside - no room for confusion.

Except we are discussing barriers in an LU station, and there are plenty of
TOC run stations that have no barriers, and both LU & TOCs are generally
responsible for the whole station anyway, whichever side of the barrier you
are on. Unless you are in a major main line station managed by Network Rail,
or a minor main line station run by LU etc etc...

So as you say, no room for confusion at all...

Paul S

On 9 Feb, 16:38, Roland Perry wrote:
That is what they call the "phase 1" layout (albeit with the lift
missing), but my diagram above is base don the "phase 2" final version.

Or are they not doing that final bit of adjusting after all?

I had a good nose around on the way home tonight:
- They're relining the passageway north of the Victoria Line, which
suggests it isn't closing as the crowd-modelling diagram suggests
- There's a hoarding on the west side of the passageway, but no
corresponding hoarding at platform level. In fact, the hoarding is the
only sign of major construction work in the area.
- There are no existing cross passages between the two the crowd-
modelling diagram shows the new passageways connecting to.

I also noticed there is indeed a modern lift in one of the Northern
Line shafts. It even has the fancy scrolling LED screens above the
doors and by the call button that the new public ones at KXSP have.
But it's hidden behind a vented door at platform level.

U