Woolwich Ferry.
 

The current boats are now over 45 years old, and must be coming
towards the end of their life. What is going to happen to the derry,
will new boats be built, will it be replaced by a new bridge or
tunnel, or will it simply be closed?

Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. Only the Easternmost of these can easily be
seen from the bus, as the other is largely hidden by a building, but
they can both be seen on Google Earth, and there is some sort of
building between them. The water in them seems to be separated from
the river by a concrete wall now, but they look rather like small dry
docks. were they used to maintain the old ferries possibly; they look
about the right size, and if so why were they walled off from the
river? Or were they something completely different?

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 5, 9:44*pm, wrote:
The current boats are now over 45 years old, and must be coming
towards the end of their life. *What is going to happen to the derry,
will new boats be built, will it be replaced by a new bridge or
tunnel, or will it simply be closed?

I think there was some suggestion that when the new Thames Gateway
bridge opened, the Woolwich Ferry service would be withdrawn - so
perhaps in light of this there wasn't any particular long term
planning going on with regards to replacement ferries. However whilst
ex-Mayor Ken was keen on it, Mayor Boris however is not, and he has
decided not to pursue the project (I can't recall his pre-election
position on it, if indeed there was one) and so it's not going to
happen. At least, not any time soon - I can well imagine it
resurfacing in years to come.

I was never entirely sure what to think about the Thames Gateway
bridge - to simplify massively, on the one hand it would've helped to
connect up London better and provide improved access to areas that
feel a little stranded (in particular Thamesmead, somewhere that needs
a boost), on the other hand it would have encouraged car journeys -
even with dedicated bus and cycle lanes - and possibly led to some
considerable traffic congestion on the southern side around
Thamesmead, Plumstead and Woolwich.

Woolwich Ferry.
 

Mizter T wrote:

I think there was some suggestion that when the new Thames Gateway
bridge opened, the Woolwich Ferry service would be withdrawn - so
perhaps in light of this there wasn't any particular long term
planning going on with regards to replacement ferries. However whilst
ex-Mayor Ken was keen on it, Mayor Boris however is not, and he has
decided not to pursue the project (I can't recall his pre-election
position on it, if indeed there was one) and so it's not going to
happen. At least, not any time soon - I can well imagine it
resurfacing in years to come.

For what it's worth there's recently been a council by-election in the Royal
Docks ward which covers the north side of the ferry (the ward consists of
Silvertown and North Woolwich - i.e. all of Newham south of the Royal Docks
themselves) and I (on the Conservative campaign team) can't remember the
ferry coming up as a local issue at all, though I'm not sure how much local
use there is of it that isn't covered by the foot tunnel or DLR (I did see
quite a bit of foot traffic using the ferry). And yes, this isn't entirely a
Newham council matter but local elections don't always stick to issues
within the competence of the authority being elected.

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 5, 10:23*pm, Mizter T wrote:

On Apr 5, 9:44*pm, wrote:

The current boats are now over 45 years old, and must be coming
towards the end of their life. *What is going to happen to the derry,
will new boats be built, will it be replaced by a new bridge or
tunnel, or will it simply be closed?

I think there was some suggestion that when the new Thames Gateway
bridge opened, the Woolwich Ferry service would be withdrawn - so
perhaps in light of this there wasn't any particular long term
planning going on with regards to replacement ferries. However whilst
ex-Mayor Ken was keen on it, Mayor Boris however is not, and he has
decided not to pursue the project (I can't recall his pre-election
position on it, if indeed there was one) and so it's not going to
happen. At least, not any time soon - I can well imagine it
resurfacing in years to come.


Just to clarify my comments - the project Mayor Boris is not keen on
is the Thames Gateway Bridge, which was being pursued by TfL under
Ken's mayoralty but is no longer under the new administration. AFAIK
there is no 'project' as such with regards to replacement boats for
the Woolwich ferry service - obviously at some point they'll need
replacing if the ferry is to continue running into the future, however
I've no idea how long the potential lifespan of the existing boats
actually is. If they're running OK now then I can't see any particular
urgency to replace them.

This TfL webpage would certainly have read somewhat differently a year
ago:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/proj...emes/2203.aspx

Woolwich Ferry.
 

wrote:

Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. Only the Easternmost of these can easily be
seen from the bus, as the other is largely hidden by a building, but
they can both be seen on Google Earth, and there is some sort of
building between them. The water in them seems to be separated from
the river by a concrete wall now, but they look rather like small dry
docks. were they used to maintain the old ferries possibly; they look
about the right size, and if so why were they walled off from the
river? Or were they something completely different?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woolwich_Dockyard

Woolwich Ferry.
 

Mizter T gurgled happily, sounding much like they
were saying:

If they're running OK now then I can't see any particular urgency to
replace them.

Big if. I seem to remember them being a bag of unreliable ****e when I
used to use 'em semi-regularly whilst studenting in Woolwich damn-near 20
yrs ago...

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On 5 Apr, 21:44, wrote:
The current boats are now over 45 years old, and must be coming
towards the end of their life. *What is going to happen to the derry,
will new boats be built, will it be replaced by a new bridge or
tunnel, or will it simply be closed?

Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. *Only the Easternmost of these can easily be
seen from the bus, as the other is largely hidden by a building, but
they can both be seen on Google Earth, and there is some sort of
building between them. *The water in them seems to be separated from
the river by a concrete wall now, but they look rather like small dry
docks. *were they used to maintain the old ferries possibly; they look
about the right size, and if so why were they walled off from the
river? *Or were they something completely different?

Both the ferry and the foot tunnel were being well used last sunday.
The DLR less so; I think it was running a reduced service service only
to Canning town.
Ferry will still be needed if a bridge isnt built IMHO

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On 7/4/09 19:03, in article
, "kytelly"
wrote:


Both the ferry and the foot tunnel were being well used last sunday.
The DLR less so; I think it was running a reduced service service only
to Canning town.
Ferry will still be needed if a bridge isnt built IMHO

I used the tunnel late afternoon that day, for the first time in several
years. There were several other people walking in he same direction as me,
Northbound, but I didn't see anybody going the other way until I passed to
people on the stairs at the North end.

When the DLR first opened, before the weekend closures for engineering works
and later the extension to Lewisham, the Greenwich tunnel used to get very
busy on Sunday afternoons. Who were the main users of the tunnels when
first built, dockers on their way to work?

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 7, 9:49*pm, Stephen Furley wrote:

On 7/4/09 19:03, in article
, "kytelly"
wrote:

Both the ferry and the foot tunnel were being well used last sunday.
The DLR less so; I think it was running a reduced service service only
to Canning town.
Ferry will still be needed if a bridge isnt built IMHO

I used the tunnel late afternoon that day, for the first time in several
years. *There were several other people walking in he same direction as me,
Northbound, but I didn't see anybody going the other way until I passed to
people on the stairs at the North end.

When the DLR first opened, before the weekend closures for engineering works
and later the extension to Lewisham, the Greenwich tunnel used to get very
busy on Sunday afternoons. *Who were the main users of the tunnels when
first built, dockers on their way to work?

Yes - my understanding is that both foot tunnels were built with
dockers and associated workers in mind. There was a ferry service from
Greenwich to the Isle of Dogs before the foot tunnel opened.

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 7, 7:03*pm, kytelly wrote:
On 5 Apr, 21:44, wrote:

The current boats are now over 45 years old, and must be coming
towards the end of their life. *What is going to happen to the derry,
will new boats be built, will it be replaced by a new bridge or
tunnel, or will it simply be closed?

Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. *Only the Easternmost of these can easily be
seen from the bus, as the other is largely hidden by a building, but
they can both be seen on Google Earth, and there is some sort of
building between them. *The water in them seems to be separated from
the river by a concrete wall now, but they look rather like small dry
docks. *were they used to maintain the old ferries possibly; they look
about the right size, and if so why were they walled off from the
river? *Or were they something completely different?

Both the ferry and the foot tunnel were being well used last sunday.
The DLR less so; I think it was running a reduced service service only
to Canning town.
Ferry will still be needed if a bridge isnt built IMHO

Without a doubt a continuing ferry service is essential if there's not
to be a bridge - it's a critical link in a major trunk route after all
(between the North and South Circular roads), and like bicycles, HGVs
are not welcome either on the DLR, but unlike bicycles, they're not
welcome in the foot tunnel either.

The DLR is never going to displace the tunnel and ferry for foot
passengers who are just making local journeys - it's £1.60 a shot
after all! Nonetheless glad to here people are still making use of
shank's pony. Of course the ferry offers rather better views than the
glazed white tiles of the tunnel!

Woolwich Ferry.
 

Mizter T wrote:

Of course the ferry offers rather better views than the
glazed white tiles of the tunnel!

Has anyone ever attempted to romanticise the journey a la Staten Island, or
would that be a task too far?

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 7, 11:59*pm, "Tim Roll-Pickering" T.C.Roll-
wrote:

Mizter T wrote:
Of course the ferry offers rather better views than the
glazed white tiles of the tunnel!

Has anyone ever attempted to romanticise the journey a la Staten Island, or
would that be a task too far?

I've never come across anything like that, but I remember it feeling
quite romantic when I used it in the fresh early morning of a summer's
day a while back - the glistening Thames Barrier, the gleaming towers
of the Docklands in the distance, the seagulls swooping over the river
etc! I was glad I hadn't gone 'through the pipe' (the Blackwall
Tunnel) on that occasion. I doubt it's quite so much fun during the
rush hour!

Woolwich Ferry.
 

The ferry is now operated by Serco on contract from TfL, IIRC for about
£7m a year.

There are undoubtedly longterm plans to replace both the boats and the
linkspans, in which the machinery regularly shows that it is
life-expired.

Since the linkspans were built as one-offs [or should that be
four-offs, to be strictly accurate?] in the early 60s, replacement
components are difficult to find, to say the least.

When they are replaced, the work is likely to be much easier than it
was 40 years ago for a number of reasons:

- improvements in linkspan design, construction and reliability, with
companies such as Sweden's TTS at the fore
- advances in civil engineering techniques
- huge increase in knowledge of the river, the river bed and the ground
below acquired through the building of the Thames Barrier and more
recently the DLR extension to WA

But I'm not sure of the timescale. Is there any more info?





On 2009-04-05 21:44:38 +0100, said:

The current boats are now over 45 years old, and must be coming
towards the end of their life. What is going to happen to the derry,
will new boats be built, will it be replaced by a new bridge or
tunnel, or will it simply be closed?

Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. Only the Easternmost of these can easily be
seen from the bus, as the other is largely hidden by a building, but
they can both be seen on Google Earth, and there is some sort of
building between them. The water in them seems to be separated from
the river by a concrete wall now, but they look rather like small dry
docks. were they used to maintain the old ferries possibly; they look
about the right size, and if so why were they walled off from the
river? Or were they something completely different?


--
Writer / editor on London's River

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 5, 9:44*pm, wrote:
The current boats are now over 45 years old, and must be coming
towards the end of their life. *What is going to happen to the derry,
will new boats be built, will it be replaced by a new bridge or
tunnel, or will it simply be closed?

Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. *

When I last used the ferries frequently there were three boats, and
therefore always at least one parked.

(Called John Burns, Ernest Bevin and James Newman as I recall.)

Woolwich Ferry.
 

Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. *

When I last used the ferries frequently there were three boats, and
therefore always at least one parked.

(Called John Burns, Ernest Bevin and James Newman as I recall.)

It's correct that there are three boats, but to say "just to the west
of the ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating" is also correct! The normal weekday service is
provided by two boats, with the third undergoing maintenance and tied
up next to the workshops EAST of the ferry. When only one boat is
operated, usually on Sundays, the spare operational boat is moored in
the river just WEST of the ferry terminal.

Peter

Woolwich Ferry.
 

Peter Heather wrote:

It's correct that there are three boats

Google Maps shows 4! I can't see the join, either...

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 12, 12:39*pm, Peter Heather wrote:
Also, when riding on the 180 bus, between Lewisham and Abbey Wood,
I've noticed two enclosed areas of water just to the west of the
ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating. *

When I last used the ferries frequently there were three boats, and
therefore always at least one parked.

(Called John Burns, Ernest Bevin and James Newman as I recall.)

It's correct that there are three boats, but to say "just to the west
of the ferry, close to where the spare boat is kept when a single boat
service is operating" is also correct! The normal weekday service is
provided by two boats, with the third undergoing maintenance and tied
up next to the workshops EAST of the ferry. When only one boat is
operated, usually on Sundays, the spare operational boat is moored in
the river just WEST of the ferry terminal.

Peter

For some reason I can't remember anything ever being parked to the
east, but it could be either that my memory is no good after twenty
years or that they have changed.

Woolwich Ferry.
 

On Apr 12, 2:01*pm, "John Rowland"
wrote:

Peter Heather wrote:

It's correct that there are three boats

Google Maps shows 4! I can't see the join, either...

Definitely only three. Unless they've managed to hide one all these
years - perhaps it's part of the strategic battleplan for London
should the third world nuclear war come, where one of the boats would
sail up to central London to collect VIPs for evacuation - in days of
yore perhaps GLC bigwigs from County Hall? Maybe the annual trip up
the river with disadvantaged kids is actually cover for a training
exercise...

In which case, what's the fourth boat called then? Clem Attlee?

Woolwich Ferry.
 

MIG wrote:

When I last used the ferries frequently there were three boats, and
therefore always at least one parked.

(Called John Burns, Ernest Bevin and James Newman as I recall.)

That was the situation when I took the ferry on Thursday - IIRC it was John
Burns that was dry moored on a wooden platform on the south side, in the gap
between the bank and the landing point.