Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Huge" wrote
"DavidR" writes:
"NM" wrote

Yeah great view, especially for those who are stuck with living in
concrete jungles, If they can get access to a car they can at least
experience what life is like beyond walking/bus distances.

Most concrete jungles and drab housing estates seem to have been created
around the car.

Given that they have little or no parking, can I enquire as to where this
ludicrous idea came from?

Ever been to Basingstoke?

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"derek" wrote
"DavidR" wrote:

"NM" wrote

Yeah great view, especially for those who are stuck with living in
concrete jungles, If they can get access to a car they can at least
experience what life is like beyond walking/bus distances.

Most concrete jungles and drab housing estates seem to have been created
around the car. Had they not been built perhaps people would not be
screaming to get out.


You are not making yourself clear.

I have a number of very dreary new towns in mind.

Lower down the social scale, we have the combination of 60's tower blocks
and main roads. Bit like railways were cut 100 years earlier.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In article ,
says...

"David J Rainey" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
Yeah whatever I think you will find I am right

The facts have been posted. You are quite wrong.

David

What facts??? everyone berates me for facts yet provide no sources of their
own other than their senile memories. I said yuppies came from the 1980s,
evertyone said rubbish, I post a link it all goes quiet,

I agree that Yuppies "appeared" in the 1980's or at least that's when
they became known as such.

how many more facts
do you want, I can prove mine can you yours???

I posted links. Repeated below for your convenience:-

In article ,
says...

What about all the other people???? Do you forget the miners strikes when
good ol MT decided to close all of the pits

When did MT decide to close all the pits?

so we imported cheap coal from
Africa. Now most of the pits have closed Africas coal price has risen
dramatically,

No. South Africa, which produces about 95% of African coal did get more
expensive in the last year, but that is from a very low base and SA coal
is still cheaper than it was in 1996.

As indeed it appears to be from all non-EU sources.

http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/eustmimp.html

oh yeah she was an absolute genius! Any 5 year old could have
seen that coming

If Britain had producted a major world market share of coal, the loss of
the pits could have indeed raised prices. However, since UK production
was 2.5% of global tonnage in 1992 and 0.7% by 2001, it seems deeply
unlikely that this was the case here.

http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/iea/table53.html

The pits were shut because the coal they produced was too expensive and
recoverable reserves were only 0.2% of world totals. The loss of related
jobs is sad and painful. But it merely extends and prolongs the pain for
both miners and taxpayers to artificially support an industry which is
doomed.

http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/iea/table82.html


rgds

David

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , Chris Jones
writes
Your view is certainly not shared by me, yes she may have buiilt roads,
but look at what happens road building leads to more traffic, this
has been researched.
This is almost the same argument put forward by one of the landed gentry
on seeing the railways. "Oh no, it'll just encourage the working class
to travel." It's along the lines of, "I'm entitled to travel, but
you've got to stay put.
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , Steve Firth
writes

I have to ask, How? Brindisi/Calais used to take me two long days driving.

Jaguar XJR, and eyes open for Les Flics.

And I'm usually not the fastest thing on the roads.
This is not a bad advert for Ford.
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , iantheengineer
writes

So lets see more cars on the new roads, oh and more cars on the a road
, oh and the b road, oh and yes another car parking space required, and
not forgetting the pollution emitted by the vehicle and its effect in
increasing the congestion.....


Oh and the Sallys friend thinks what a good idea, and then Jane.. and
then John


Are we getting there...do I need to draw a picture for you.

So it's O.K. for you to travel, but not others, or are you going to lead
by example and stay within walking distance of your home all of your
life?
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , iantheengineer
writes

Speed humps are used to prevent speeding idiots and save lives. Do you
REALLY think that a local authority with limited funds would waste it n
putting in humps for the sake of it.

Come on now get real!!
In my neck of the wood, West Cumbria, yes. We have restricted parking
next to a school in term time, 100yds. Away we have a 24/7/365 20mph.
Limit next to a school. The road planners just don't know what
they're doing, they just have to spend the available money. So we get
speed humps on our roads and very little salt/grit in the winter.
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , iantheengineer
writes

Yes they do I can produce the stats if required from ROSPA that have
been statistically proven to a 90-95% confidence interval, however no
doubt you will doubt these, I have given up with this NG. They seem to
think that government bodies sit thinking of ways to waste momey and
alienate the public, dont you think you are missing the bigger picture???
Who was it said. "There are lies, damn lies and statistics.?
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , David J Rainey
writes

The pits were shut because the coal they produced was too expensive and
recoverable reserves were only 0.2% of world totals. The loss of
related jobs is sad and painful. But it merely extends and prolongs the
pain for both miners and taxpayers to artificially support an industry
which is doomed.
When North sea gas runs out, what are we going to do then to replace it,
the best source of heat for the community.
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

iantheengineer wrote:


How fast would urban public transport be with no cars
on the road? (and no vans, cycles, taxis etc. if that helps).



Is this a question, is it not obvious enough.

It will be exactly the travel time + the stops for pick up/drop off, without
any delay occurring due to congestion, and there would be no need for bus
lanes!
Without busses and bus lanes there would be even less congestion.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , Grant Crozier
writes
With a bit of luck in eighteen months time the UK will be governed by
a decent party with a man at the helm who knows what he is doing .
First of all, they've got to find one.
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"iantheengineer" wrote in message
...

"Nick Finnigan" wrote in message
...
"iantheengineer" wrote in message
...

To continue to build roads will continue the problem. The answer is
puvblic
transport, but public transport cannot cater for all journeys and
therefore
over time journeys will need to become more corridored. For example go
into
any city during the am peak and the tidality of the flow is there to be
seen. IF we were to get all of the people from their cars onto public
transport, or even better living nearer to the workplace, the congestion
would be far less.

cars. Without cars on the urban road network public transport would be
faster and more reliable.

How fast would urban public transport be with no cars
on the road? (and no vans, cycles, taxis etc. if that helps).

Is this a question, is it not obvious enough.

It will be exactly the travel time + the stops for pick up/drop off, without
any delay occurring due to congestion,

And what will the travel speed be, and who long will
each stop take, and how frequently will the stops occur?
Or, alternatively, how fast would a typical journey be?

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

On Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:28:56 +0000, Clive wrote:

In message , David J Rainey
writes

The pits were shut because the coal they produced was too expensive and
recoverable reserves were only 0.2% of world totals. The loss of
related jobs is sad and painful. But it merely extends and prolongs the
pain for both miners and taxpayers to artificially support an industry
which is doomed.
When North sea gas runs out, what are we going to do then to replace it,
the best source of heat for the community.

Pipe it in from Russia or tanker LNG from anywhere. Some while to go before
you'll need to learn the art of skinning furry animals.

--
Take my advice, I don't use it anyway.

Mail john rather than nospam...

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

Clive wrote the following in:


In message , iantheengineer
writes

So lets see more cars on the new roads, oh and more cars on the a
road , oh and the b road, oh and yes another car parking space
required, and not forgetting the pollution emitted by the vehicle
and its effect in increasing the congestion.....


Oh and the Sallys friend thinks what a good idea, and then Jane..
and then John


Are we getting there...do I need to draw a picture for you.

So it's O.K. for you to travel, but not others, or are you going
to lead by example and stay within walking distance of your home
all of your life?

It's completely obvious that's not what he means. It's true that people
use their cars too much. It's ridiculous that people think it's ok to
commute 50 or 100 or whatever miles to work each day in a car with only
one person in it. Obviously people have to get to places some distance
away from their home but there's no need for them to be so ridiculously
far away just so some rich **** can live in a quiet little village.

It's also true that a new road doesn't just relieve congestion. If you
build a new motorway the cars don't just magically appear on it, they
have to go over other roads to get there. And so other roads become
more congested because they're feeding this new motorway. So what's the
solution, make the roads feeding the motorway bigger? Then you have to
make the roads feeding the roads feeding the motorway bigger, and so
on. The solutions to these problems are a lot more complex than just
building more and bigger roads.

--
message by Robin May, but you can call me Mr Smith.
Hello. I'm one of those "roaring fascists of the left wing".

Police Advice: do not approach Cheryl Tweedy as she may be dangerous.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , Robin May
writes

So it's O.K. for you to travel, but not others, or are you going
to lead by example and stay within walking distance of your home
all of your life?

It's completely obvious that's not what he means. It's true that people
use their cars too much. It's ridiculous that people think it's ok to
commute 50 or 100 or whatever miles to work each day in a car with only
one person in it. Obviously people have to get to places some distance
away from their home but there's no need for them to be so ridiculously
far away just so some rich **** can live in a quiet little village.

It's also true that a new road doesn't just relieve congestion. If you
build a new motorway the cars don't just magically appear on it, they
have to go over other roads to get there. And so other roads become
more congested because they're feeding this new motorway. So what's the
solution, make the roads feeding the motorway bigger? Then you have to
make the roads feeding the roads feeding the motorway bigger, and so
on. The solutions to these problems are a lot more complex than just
building more and bigger roads.
Don't agree. As has already been pointed out here before, France
doesn't have such a problem even with higher car ownership, because they
have a better road infrastructure. The answer is not to try and tax
people off of the roads, but give them the roads for which they pay.
Before you berate me, I am a pro-rail public transport person but I live
in part of the country with bad roads and worse public transport.
(West Cumbria.)
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

Steve Firth wrote:
DavidR wrote:

Ever been to Basingstoke?

Yes, only a ****wit would claim it was designed around the car.

In fact many New Towns were designed around the bus. Probably explains what
unpleasant places to live they are.

--
http://www.speedlimit.org.uk
"If laws are to be respected, they must be worthy of respect."

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

On Wed, 5 Nov 2003 19:34:56 +0000, (Steve Firth)
wrote:

DavidR wrote:

Ever been to Basingstoke?

Yes, only a ****wit would claim it was designed around the car.


LOL! Thats being charitable to ****wits. The best thing about basingstoke
is the road out of it.

greg

--
$ReplyAddress =~ s#\@.*$##; # Delete everything after the '@'
The Following is a true story.....
Only the names have been changed to protect the guilty.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

Robin May wrote:

It's completely obvious that's not what he means. It's true that
people use their cars too much. It's ridiculous that people think
it's ok to commute 50 or 100 or whatever miles to work each day in a
car with only one person in it. Obviously people have to get to
places some distance away from their home but there's no need for
them to be so ridiculously far away just so some rich **** can live
in a quiet little village.


Most really long-distance commuting is done by train, not car. How many
season tickets do GNER issue from Grantham and Newark to London? Is that
somehow better?

--
http://www.speedlimit.org.uk
"If laws are to be respected, they must be worthy of respect."

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

PeterE wrote:

Steve Firth wrote:
DavidR wrote:

Ever been to Basingstoke?

Yes, only a ****wit would claim it was designed around the car.

In fact many New Towns were designed around the bus. Probably explains what
unpleasant places to live they are.

And in Basingstoke it could be said that the bus facilities were designed
around the canal as the bus station was built on the old canal basin (useless
fact 783).

However the new development of Basingstoke *was* designed around the car.

With some embarrassment I now have to hold my hands up and say I was working
for the Development Group and on the planning and design of the main housing
estates :-((

I still cycled to work though.

John B

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In article ,
says...
The pits were shut because the coal they produced was too expensive and
recoverable reserves were only 0.2% of world totals.
When North sea gas runs out, what are we going to do then to replace it,
the best source of heat for the community.

I presume we'll buy it cheap from those places that have the other 99.8%
of world coal.

rgds

David

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

JohnB wrote:
PeterE wrote:

In fact many New Towns were designed around the bus. Probably
explains what unpleasant places to live they are.

And in Basingstoke it could be said that the bus facilities were
designed around the canal as the bus station was built on the old
canal basin (useless fact 783).

However the new development of Basingstoke *was* designed around the
car.

I was thinking particularly of Runcorn - where the New Town was grouped
around a network of busways where 10-minute frequencies were promised but
they quickly dwindled to 30 minutes or an hour.

It does have some really good roads, though, as well :-)

With some embarrassment I now have to hold my hands up and say I was
working for the Development Group and on the planning and design of
the main housing estates :-((

I still cycled to work though.

Good to see the old hair-shirt mentality.

--
http://www.speedlimit.org.uk
"If laws are to be respected, they must be worthy of respect."

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

PeterE wrote:

JohnB wrote:

With some embarrassment I now have to hold my hands up and say I was
working for the Development Group and on the planning and design of
the main housing estates :-((

I still cycled to work though.

Good to see the old hair-shirt mentality.

More that the 'ring roads' sliced across the old access routes into the town
and cycling became the most pleasurable and easiest way to reach the centre.

And when using parts of the ring roads it was quite satisfying to ride past
the queues that, even then, built up at the many roundabouts.

Basingstoke is a clear example of a town planned almost solely for the car
that shows the folly of such a narrow minded policy.

John B

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Huge" wrote
"DavidR" writes:

Ever been to Basingstoke?

Why on Earth would I want to do that?

No doubt many people using its (excellent) ring road wonder about that too.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Clive" wrote in message
...

Don't agree. As has already been pointed out here before, France
doesn't have such a problem even with higher car ownership, because they
have a better road infrastructure.

Only one of the possible reasons.

Different population density patterns, "jobs for life" (not quite, but not
like the uk) etc. make a big difference too.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
...
iantheengineer wrote:

Not everything works on the same principles are you so stupid??? Water
flows
under gravity does that mean rock will too???

Well yes it does actually.

Avalanche.

Thats not rock.

Continental drift

That is not caused (directly) by gravity.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
.. .
W K

That is not caused (directly) by gravity.

The rock in the convection cell would not move without gravity. It is a
direct result of gravity.

That isn't water flowing.

Its not analogous with any flow effect I can think of in water.
Closest I can think of is the scum/foam that you get when boiling
vegetables.

The reason why I put the (directly) in there is its CAUSED by convection,
which although it needs gravity, would not immediately be called "flowing
under gravity", esp as the rock is not moving in the direction of the
gravity field.

How did this start?

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

W K wrote:
"Steve Firth" wrote in message
...
iantheengineer wrote:

Not everything works on the same principles are you so stupid???
Water flows under gravity does that mean rock will too???

Well yes it does actually.

Avalanche.

Thats not rock.


pedant mode on

Rocks can avalanche!

pedant mode off

--
cupra (remove nospam please to mail)

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
.. .
W K wrote:

The rock in the convection cell would not move without gravity. It is
a
direct result of gravity.

That isn't water flowing.

No, it's rock flowing. It's rock flowing under gravity.

The actually continents drifting are not "rock flowing under gravity".

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
.. .
W K wrote:

No, it's rock flowing. It's rock flowing under gravity.

The actually continents drifting are not "rock flowing under gravity".

I didn't claim they were, however I could not think of an appropriate
shorthand for a convection cell of flowing rock.

Maybe in terms of friction[1], along the lines of theory of a continuum of
models of friction separated only by orders of distance and time, quantum
level through to red-blue shift in astronomy, gravitational forces at
geological scale figuring in there according to considerations of single
planetary body with or without external forces thrown in.
[1] First define /friction/, what causes forces opposing motion; I like the
/noise/ theory myself.

Everything moves...

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"JNugent" wrote in message
...
wrote:

"JNugent" wrote:

[ ... ]

Motorways take about 50 square miles of the UK - 0.05% of the
total land area.

So?????

So it makes you look pretty silly when you ranted: "So where do you
stop, when the whole country is one great network of
asphalt???", doesn't it?

Look it up, an analogy. It was an extreme statement of a truth we
are ina a society that would keep paving over green areas to provide
faster access.

Look up "analogy". It doesn't mean what you seem to think it means.
Look up "truth". It doesn't mean what you seem to think it means.
I have never heard the expression "an extreme statement of a truth"
before, but I don't think characterising motorway land-usage of
0.05% as "the whole country is one great network of asphalt" has
much to do with truth, let alone any concept of "extreme statement"
of it.

I suggest you re-read the definition of analogy, I did look it up
before I used it

Why?

Didn't you know what it means?

Oops! Of course you didn't...

and it says "partial similarity"

There is *no* similarity between a motorway land-take of 0.05% of the UK's
landmass and your fearful phrase "the whole country is one great network
of
asphalt" - not even a "partial similarity".

Admit it - you thought the percentage was *much* higher than 0.05%, didn't
you? :-)



Not at all I had no idea of the figure, I wasnt alluding to figure just
saying that if we keep paving to satisfy demand we will pave over a hell of
a lot more green areas

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
...
iantheengineer wrote:

Not everything works on the same principles are you so stupid??? Water
flows
under gravity does that mean rock will too???

Well yes it does actually.

Avalanche.
Landslip.
Continental drift
Lava flow

These appear to be some concepts missing from your limited education.

[snip waffle]

Anyway Steve I think theres a village missing an idiot

Why not apply for the vacancy then numbnuts?

--
Having problems understanding usenet? Or do you simply need help but
are getting unhelpful answers? Subscribe to: uk.net.beginners for
friendly advice in a flame-free environment.

An avalanche ( arent these made of snow which formed water!!!) made of rock
, I think you are talking of a pyroclastic cloud. Go on then Steve upto what
level and in what areas are you educated too???

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In article ,
says...

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
...
iantheengineer wrote:

Not everything works on the same principles are you so stupid??? Water
flows
under gravity does that mean rock will too???

Well yes it does actually.

Avalanche.
Landslip.
Continental drift
Lava flow



An avalanche ( arent these made of snow which formed water!!!) made of rock
, I think you are talking of a pyroclastic cloud. Go on then Steve upto what
level and in what areas are you educated too???

You're thinking of a pyroclastic _flow_, which is hot rocks & dust from a
volcano, behaving in _exactly_ the same way as water.

One of these is what "destroyed" Pompeii.

BTW, isn't rocks rolling down a hillside, behaving like water called a
"Rockslide"? (I'd personally have used the term Avalanche too - I've seen
it used in relationship to rocks before).

Pete.

--
NOTE! Email address is spamtrapped. Any email will be bounced to you
Remove the news and underscore from my address to reply by mail

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"NM" wrote in message
m...
iantheengineer wrote:


How fast would urban public transport be with no cars
on the road? (and no vans, cycles, taxis etc. if that helps).



Is this a question, is it not obvious enough.

It will be exactly the travel time + the stops for pick up/drop off,
without
any delay occurring due to congestion, and there would be no need for
bus
lanes!
Without busses and bus lanes there would be even less congestion.


How many cars does it take to move 72 people, at say 5 seats per car 15,
okay and what area does a car take up 5.75m by 2.5m roughly so 14.4m2 times
15 = 216m2, and what area does a double decker take 12.9m long by 2.5m =
32.25m2, hmm I need say no more.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"JNugent" wrote in message
...
wrote:

"JNugent" wrote:

[ ... ]

Motorways take about 50 square miles of the UK - 0.05% of the
total land area.

So?????

So it makes you look pretty silly when you ranted: "So where do you
stop, when the whole country is one great network of
asphalt???", doesn't it?

Look it up, an analogy. It was an extreme statement of a truth we
are ina a society that would keep paving over green areas to provide
faster access.

Look up "analogy". It doesn't mean what you seem to think it means.
Look up "truth". It doesn't mean what you seem to think it means.
I have never heard the expression "an extreme statement of a truth"
before, but I don't think characterising motorway land-usage of
0.05% as "the whole country is one great network of asphalt" has
much to do with truth, let alone any concept of "extreme statement"
of it.

I suggest you re-read the definition of analogy, I did look it up
before I used it

Why?

Didn't you know what it means?

Oops! Of course you didn't...

and it says "partial similarity"

There is *no* similarity between a motorway land-take of 0.05% of the UK's
landmass and your fearful phrase "the whole country is one great network
of
asphalt" - not even a "partial similarity".

Admit it - you thought the percentage was *much* higher than 0.05%, didn't
you? :-)



The reason for looking it up was for clarification so that pmpous pricks
like yourself dont question itts usage, in my eyes irt was correctly used,
if you are sad enough to analyse every word tyou need help.

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

iantheengineer wrote:

How many cars does it take to move 72 people, at say 5 seats per car 15,
okay and what area does a car take up 5.75m by 2.5m roughly so 14.4m2 times
15 = 216m2, and what area does a double decker take 12.9m long by 2.5m =
32.25m2, hmm I need say no more.


Very good. Now get the bus to go in 15 different directions at the same
time. :-)

--
Ian Edwards

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

In message , iantheengineer
writes

The reason for looking it up was for clarification so that pmpous
pricks like yourself dont question itts usage, in my eyes irt was
correctly used, if you are sad enough to analyse every word tyou need
help.
Alcohol is nice, isn't it.
--
Clive

Britains Crap Roads, Answers wanted
 

"Ian Edwards" wrote in message
...
iantheengineer wrote:

How many cars does it take to move 72 people, at say 5 seats per car 15,
okay and what area does a car take up 5.75m by 2.5m roughly so 14.4m2
times
15 = 216m2, and what area does a double decker take 12.9m long by 2.5m =
32.25m2, hmm I need say no more.


Very good. Now get the bus to go in 15 different directions at the same
time. :-)

congestion is usually less severe where people are going in all different
directions.