In message
, at
07:24:46 on Mon, 1 Jun 2009, Mizter T remarked:

Ashford is a run-down provincial town (sorry, but that's the
reality), and I can't see why people would want to travel from there
to London and back on a premium service outside commuter hours.

Though come the full service there will be 2tph off-peak from Ashford
into London.

Because that's what they had to promise.

And Ashford could also perhaps provide a P&R style
offering for those in the surrounding area, areas of which at least
are quite affluent. Also, I don't know Ashford at all well but
wikipedia pointed me in the way of this Channel 4 survey where they
judged it the fourth best place to live in the UK! See:
http://tinyurl.com/C4-best-places-to-live-05

They have very strange criteria. In any event I worked in Ashford for a
few months, and it's not as hot as they suggest. Maybe they are thinking
about some of the surrounding villages?

does anyone know what catering they *are* providing on these trains?

None - or rather I should so I'm not sure there us going to be any, at
least I haven't heard of anything.

Not even a trolley?

--
Roland Perry

On 1 June, 13:18, Roland Perry wrote:
Perhaps they are expecting people to use Ebbsfleet as a P&R for London.
I'd certainly give that try if I lived nearby on the M25. Ashford is a
run-down provincial town (sorry, but that's the reality), and I can't
see why people would want to travel from there to London and back on a
premium service outside commuter hours.

Since - as you point out - Ashford has no amenities of its own, the
only way to have an evening out is to go up to London, and currently
that requires spending the best part of 3 hours on a train for the
round trip.

I can't see who would be stingy enough not to take the premium
service.

(and not forgetting it's the junction station for a large part of
Kent)

U

In message , at 15:30:29 on
Mon, 1 Jun 2009, Paul Scott remarked:
Perhaps they are expecting people to use Ebbsfleet as a P&R for
London.

I think that's a given, 2500 spaces aren't going to fill up with Eurostar
pax going the other way are they?

How big is the E* carpark at Ashford?
--
Roland Perry

In message
, at
07:46:37 on Mon, 1 Jun 2009, Mr Thant
remarked:
Since - as you point out - Ashford has no amenities of its own, the
only way to have an evening out is to go up to London

I'm afraid I don't relate to the concept of "evening out" combined with
"spending more than half an hour travelling".
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 15:30:29 on
Mon, 1 Jun 2009, Paul Scott remarked:
Perhaps they are expecting people to use Ebbsfleet as a P&R for
London.

I think that's a given, 2500 spaces aren't going to fill up with
Eurostar pax going the other way are they?

How big is the E* carpark at Ashford?

Googles for a while...

2000 (Eurostar). And I now discover that Ebbsfleet has 6000 spaces built out
of 9000 for which they have planning permission.

I think that is fairly large as P&Rs normally go whatever the right figure
turns out to be...

Paul S

On Jun 1, 3:36*pm, Roland Perry wrote:

In message
, at
07:24:46 on Mon, 1 Jun 2009, Mizter T remarked:

Ashford is a *run-down provincial town (sorry, but that's the
reality), and I can't *see why people would want to travel from there
to London and back on a *premium service outside commuter hours.

Though come the full service there will be 2tph off-peak from Ashford
into London.

Because that's what they had to promise.

Indeed - but I wouldn't be surprised to see a market emerge for the
new HS service, a mix of transferred traffic from the Mainline routes
and new passenger


And Ashford could also perhaps provide a P&R style
offering for those in the surrounding area, areas of which at least
are quite affluent. Also, I don't know Ashford at all well but
wikipedia pointed me in the way of this Channel 4 survey where they
judged it the fourth best place to live in the UK! See:
http://tinyurl.com/C4-best-places-to-live-05

They have very strange criteria. In any event I worked in Ashford for a
few months, and it's not as hot as they suggest. Maybe they are thinking
about some of the surrounding villages?

I offered that list with no particular comment one way or the other,
just as a contrast to your words - that said I'm pretty sceptical of
such things. Maybe they were thinking about some of the surrounding
countryside, which is rather pleasant.

Also, as Mr Thant eloquently phrased it downthread, Ashford is "the
junction station for a large part of
Kent" - given the quicker journey, I can imagine people being willing
to shell out on the HS1 premium so as to spend longer having a day out
in London instead of spending that time on the train getting there and
back - of course it all depends on the circumstances (or should I say
their circumstances), e.g. how big the travelling party is, what the
child fares are like, whether Group Save discounts will be available,
will Network Railcards be valid etc.


does *anyone know what catering they *are* providing on these trains?

None - or rather I should so I'm not sure there us going to be any, at
least I haven't heard of anything.

Not even a trolley?

Pass - dunno.

On Jun 1, 3:54*pm, Roland Perry wrote:

In message , at 15:30:29 on
Mon, 1 Jun 2009, Paul Scott remarked:

Perhaps they are expecting people to use Ebbsfleet as a P&R for
London.

I think that's a given, 2500 spaces aren't going to fill up with Eurostar
pax going the other way are they?

How big is the E* carpark at Ashford?

NRE tells me that car parks A, B and F are 139+315+165 = 619 spaces.
See:
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations/afk/details.html

No idea what happened to car parks C, D and E!

Meanwhile the Eurostar website tells me that car parking charges at
Ashford Int'l are "£4.50 for up to 5 hours or £11.50 for up to 24
hours" - see:
http://tinyurl.com/Ashford-International-info

On Jun 1, 3:57*pm, Roland Perry wrote:

In message
, at
07:46:37 on Mon, 1 Jun 2009, Mr Thant
remarked:

Since - as you point out - Ashford has no amenities of its own, the
only way to have an evening out is to go up to London

I'm afraid I don't relate to the concept of "evening out" combined with
"spending more than half an hour travelling".

"Big night out" is perhaps a more apt phrase - though maybe that just
relates to the intake of intoxicants...

(And I'm not quite sure the cultcharati of Ashford heading to the West
End for a play would quite describe it as a "big night out"!)

On Jun 1, 3:46*pm, Mr Thant
wrote:

On 1 June, 13:18, Roland Perry wrote:

Perhaps they are expecting people to use Ebbsfleet as a P&R for London.
I'd certainly give that try if I lived nearby on the M25. Ashford is a
run-down provincial town (sorry, but that's the reality), and I can't
see why people would want to travel from there to London and back on a
premium service outside commuter hours.

Since - as you point out - Ashford has no amenities of its own, the
only way to have an evening out is to go up to London, and currently
that requires spending the best part of 3 hours on a train for the
round trip.

I can't see who would be stingy enough not to take the premium
service.

Put like that, yes. But on the flip side there's folk heading for a
day out in London - perhaps a family-type group or just some
youngsters - where the extra expense might well add up to rather
stretch the budget, and where said money might be better spent during
their day in London town. Plus at least for some such groups (e.g.
young family) the train trip itself might be part of the fun, so in
that sense going the relatively 'slow way' might work out for them.


(and not forgetting it's the junction station for a large part of
Kent)

Very true.

The other factor is what changes are being made to "Mainline" services
to/from Ashford under the new timetable, i.e. whether they'll be
slower and less frequent.

On Mon, 1 Jun 2009 13:37:55 +0100 someone who may be "Peter Masson"
wrote this:-

There's a gap between E* departures from St Pancras between 1100 and 1229
(except on Fridays and Sundays). However there is no corresponding gap
between arrivals, which are at approximately hourly intervals at that sort
of time of day.

Is work (including inspections) banned on both lines when trains are
running at normal speed, or is work permitted on one line when the
other is open for normal running? It was reported here that this was
banned in France after the death of some staff and either both lines
are closed or a speed restriction imposed on both of them (can't
remember which, it may vary).





--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54