On Dec 31, 5:41*pm, Paul Corfield wrote:
I assume the inconvenience reference is London Travelwatch considering
the setting of an OEP to be as inconvenient as queuing at a ticket
office to purchase a ticket.

No - the inconvenience is that if I have a z12 Gold Card on Oyster
(which I do) and want the cheapest fare to Surbiton, then I still need
to queue up for a paper BZ2-Surbiton ticket, rather than getting an
IEP, touching in at Waterloo and touching out at Surbiton.

You're speaking from your own experience. I was attempting to translate
the London Travelwatch words. *We seem to have come to two different
conclusions - hardly a shock when it comes to this complex subject!

I wasn't speaking from experience here (since IEPs haven't yet come
in) - just putting in concrete examples to make it a bit clearer. LTW
said:

"If you have an annual ticket (Gold Card) it will be cheaper (and
equally as inconvenient) to get a paper extension, as you need to
currently"

To me, that means:

"If you have an annual Travelcard on Oyster and want to travel outside
your zones on NR, it will be cheaper to get a paper extension ticket
with the Gold Card discount from a manned ticket office (which is
inconvenient, and which you need to do at the moment) than to use the
Oyster PAYG functionality with no Gold Card discount".

IEP doesn't even apply here - this point simply reflects the
unfathomably weird / crooked (according to taste) fact that even
though discounts for YP, Senior and Disabled railcards have been
enabled on Oyster, Network and Gold Card discounts haven't.

You could then go on to say "Also, because IEP means Oyster PAYG will
be a pain in the arse to use with a Travelcard on NR, the
inconvenience of getting an extension ticket is only a bit greater
than that", but LTW don't.

Agreed that their wording could be much better.

--
John Band
john at johnband dot org
www.johnband.org

In article
,
(John B) wrote:

On Dec 31, 5:41*pm, Paul Corfield wrote:
I assume the inconvenience reference is London Travelwatch
considering the setting of an OEP to be as inconvenient as
queuing at a ticket office to purchase a ticket.

No - the inconvenience is that if I have a z12 Gold Card on Oyster
(which I do) and want the cheapest fare to Surbiton, then I still
need to queue up for a paper BZ2-Surbiton ticket, rather than
getting an IEP, touching in at Waterloo and touching out at Surbiton.

You're speaking from your own experience. I was attempting to
the London Travelwatch words. *We seem to have come to two translate
different conclusions - hardly a shock when it comes to this complex
subject!

I wasn't speaking from experience here (since IEPs haven't yet come
in) - just putting in concrete examples to make it a bit clearer. LTW
said:

"If you have an annual ticket (Gold Card) it will be cheaper (and
equally as inconvenient) to get a paper extension, as you need to
currently"

To me, that means:

"If you have an annual Travelcard on Oyster and want to travel outside
your zones on NR, it will be cheaper to get a paper extension ticket
with the Gold Card discount from a manned ticket office (which is
inconvenient, and which you need to do at the moment) than to use the
Oyster PAYG functionality with no Gold Card discount".

I'm not clear what the fares are either way in this example from Saturday.
What are they?

IEP doesn't even apply here - this point simply reflects the
unfathomably weird / crooked (according to taste) fact that even
though discounts for YP, Senior and Disabled railcards have been
enabled on Oyster, Network and Gold Card discounts haven't.

But the only railcard discounts are to caps, so would they apply anyway
for a simple BZ2-Surbiton day return trip?

--
Colin Rosenstiel

wrote

(John B) wrote:


"If you have an annual ticket (Gold Card) it will be cheaper
(and
equally as inconvenient) to get a paper extension, as you need
to
currently"

To me, that means:

"If you have an annual Travelcard on Oyster and want to travel
outside
your zones on NR, it will be cheaper to get a paper extension ticket
with the Gold Card discount from a manned ticket office (which is
inconvenient, and which you need to do at the moment) than to use
the Oyster PAYG functionality with no Gold Card discount".

I'm not clear what the fares are either way in this example from
Saturday.
What are they?

I take it that paper extensions like all in-zone paper singles will be
'Anytime' so I think cheaper only applies if you intend to travel in
the evening peak. At other times "anytime fare less 1/3" won't be more
than
"Oyster Off-Peak"

IEP doesn't even apply here - this point simply reflects the
unfathomably weird / crooked (according to taste) fact that even
though discounts for YP, Senior and Disabled railcards have been
enabled on Oyster, Network and Gold Card discounts haven't.

But the only railcard discounts are to caps, so would they apply
anyway for a simple BZ2-Surbiton day return trip?

Hee !

Now /that/ is in a paper leaflet
_Oyster pay as you go on National Rail - From 2 January 2010_
as well as online

"Senior, 16-25, Disabled Persons and Forces Railcard holders can get
1/3 discounts on the adult Off-Peak Oyster PAYG /fare/ for most
journeys on
National Rail as well as 1/3 reduction on the Off-Peak daily price
cap."

Peak fares, no discount on fares, of course apply for journeys that
start between 06:30-09:30 or between 16:00-19:00.


So further, as above, if a single journey on NR in the evening peak is
the only significant travel that day (no capping) it will be cheaper to
buy
a Rail/Goldcard discounted paper ticket at "anytime fare less 1/3"
than
use Oyster PAYG.

I think.

(Copying from this NG)
The BBC article[1] quotes the 'Mayor's Transport Spokesman' as saying
that Oyster will offer the cheapest fare available; "the only
exceptions are holders of certain national railcards for whom cheaper
paper tickets for travel on national rail maybe available."

--
Mike D