Last night, I got the sleeper down from Fort William to Euston. My
ticket included a tube journey in zones 1 and 2 as well.

It didn't work.

The numpty at the gate line at Euston said it wasn't valid, because it
had yesterday's date on it. Fair enough, I suppose, that he might think
it invalid - except that it said SLEEPER on the ticket, so it's
*obviously* for an overnight journey starting on one day and finishing
on the next. Eventually I asked to speak to his supervisor, and he
vaguely gesticulated then ignored me. I eventually figured out that he
meant that the supervisor's office was -- over there, but ... it's
behind the gate line! Eventually, I found one of his colleagues who
wasn't a dribbling idiot who let me through. I complained to the
supervisor but doubt anything will happen about the first guy's
ignorance and rudeness.

Then at White City, the ticket again wouldn't work the barriers, and
again the chap on the barrier line said it wasn't valid, but at least he
was polite and spoke better English*. When we managed to speak to
someone in the ticket office, she "don't know anything about national
rail tickets", which I find remarkable given that eleventy zillion
NR-issued tickets are valid for journeys to (and I presume from) White
City. I'd understand if she didn't know about that particular unusual
ticket for that particularly unusual overnight journey, but to not know
*anything* about NR tickets is unconscionable. I eventually got out
after telling them that Euston had said it was valid.

Anyway, according to the second chap I spoke to at Euston (the helpful
one who let me through the barriers) their machines *always* fail to
recognise the Sleeper + U12 tickets. LUL obviously don't care because
they don't train the staff properly. I can understand White City staff
being a bit confused, but *Euston* staff - all of them - need to be
trained to recognise sleeper tickets.

* he also had a splendid beard

--
David Cantrell | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david

Good advice is always certain to be ignored,
but that's no reason not to give it -- Agatha Christie

On Mar 16, 12:31*pm, David Cantrell wrote:
The numpty at the gate line at Euston said it wasn't valid, because it
had yesterday's date on it. *Fair enough, I suppose, that he might think
it invalid - except that it said SLEEPER on the ticket, so it's
*obviously* for an overnight journey starting on one day and finishing
on the next.
You'd hope that even if staff hadn't seen one before, they'd be able
to use a little bit of common sense, even if the gates aren't
intelligent enough to pass them.

Anyway, according to the second chap I spoke to at Euston (the helpful
one who let me through the barriers) their machines *always* fail to
recognise the Sleeper + U12 tickets.

My recent experience of +U tickets, FWIW:
U123 - Evesham at Tottenham Court Road: didn't work the barrier,
friendly chap let me through the gate and wished me a good day.
(Didn't need to pass a gateline at Paddington)
On the return, it let me out again at Wood Green, and returned the
ticket.
U12 - Pollokshieds West at Wood Lane: didn't work the barrier, staff
happy to let me through. It did work the barrier at Euston Square.
(Didn't pass any other gatelines. The guard on the train in Glasgow
didn't even bat an eyelid)

One of the easements used to allow a cross-London transfer for sleeper
ticket holders on northbound services. This failed to work the
barriers only once out of ten or so times I used it, and on that
occasion I had to use oyster PAYG from Victoria as I couldn't convince
anyone otherwise.

Not sure if that easement still exists. On another note, is U12 still
only valid for Underground services, or can I use it on NR /
Overground?

On Mar 16, 2:33*pm, stan5001 wrote:
One of the easements used to allow a cross-London transfer for sleeper
ticket holders on northbound services. *This failed to work the
barriers only once out of ten or so times I used it, and on that
occasion I had to use oyster PAYG from Victoria as I couldn't convince
anyone otherwise.

Not sure if that easement still exists. *On another note, is U12 still
only valid for Underground services, or can I use it on NR /
Overground?

U12 is for Underground services, however London Overground accept
Underground tickets across their network (obviously must be valid for
the appropriate zones).

It will not be valid on any other NR services unless there is
ticketing interavailability in place where LU tickets are accepted on
portions of LU routes - e.g. Moorgate/ Kings Cross to Finsbury Park,
Thameslink central section between Kentish Town and Elephant & Castle/
London Bridge.

A U12 ticket would *not* be accepted on NR/ SWT between Vauxhall and
Waterloo, or between New Cross/ NX Gate and London Bridge, to give a
couple of examples, nor say between Peckham Rye and London Bridge or
any other such NR journey one could imagine.

martin wrote

On Mar 16, 12:31*pm, David Cantrell wrote:
The numpty at the gate line at Euston said it wasn't valid, because
it
had yesterday's date on it. *Fair enough, I suppose, that he might
think
it invalid - except that it said SLEEPER on the ticket, so it's
*obviously* for an overnight journey starting on one day and
finishing
on the next.

You'd hope that even if staff hadn't seen one before, they'd be able
to use a little bit of common sense, even if the gates aren't
intelligent enough to pass them.

Way back my local SWT ticket office said "sometimes they don't work"
when I bought a foward dated one.

but what goes on the mag stripe when you buy a Saver Return+U12, ie is
a date range allowable ?

Try a formal complaint to the TOC that issued the ticket.

--
Mike D

On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 01:18:08AM +0000, Michael R N Dolbear wrote:
martin wrote

On Mar 16, 12:31*pm, David Cantrell wrote:
The numpty at the gate line at Euston said it wasn't valid, because
it had yesterday's date on it. *Fair enough, I suppose, that he might
think
it invalid - except that it said SLEEPER on the ticket, so it's
*obviously* for an overnight journey starting on one day and
finishing
on the next.
Try a formal complaint to the TOC that issued the ticket.

They issued me with a valid ticket. The formal complaint will go to
LUL, CCed to Scotrail so they know how LUL are trying to rip them off by
taking their money for the U12 portion of the ticket but trying to not
honour the ticket.

--
David Cantrell | Official London Perl Mongers Bad Influence

Your call is important to me. To see if it's important to
you I'm going to make you wait on hold for five minutes.
All calls are recorded for blackmail and amusement purposes.

On Mar 18, 11:42*am, David Cantrell wrote:

On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 01:18:08AM +0000, Michael R N Dolbear wrote:
Try a formal complaint to the TOC that issued the ticket.

They issued me with a valid ticket. *The formal complaint will go to
LUL, CCed to Scotrail so they know how LUL are trying to rip them off by
taking their money for the U12 portion of the ticket but trying to not
honour the ticket.

I don't know how you worded your complaint to LU, but if it contains
the kind of hyperbole featured above then I'd suggest it's less likely
to have an impact - LUL are not actively "trying" to "rip off"
Scotrail or sleeper passengers.

On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 06:24:45AM -0700, Mizter T wrote:
On Mar 18, 11:42=A0am, David Cantrell wrote:
On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 01:18:08AM +0000, Michael R N Dolbear wrote:
Try a formal complaint to the TOC that issued the ticket.
They issued me with a valid ticket. =A0The formal complaint will go to
LUL, CCed to Scotrail so they know how LUL are trying to rip them off by
taking their money for the U12 portion of the ticket but trying to not
honour the ticket.
I don't know how you worded your complaint to LU, but if it contains
the kind of hyperbole featured above then I'd suggest it's less likely
to have an impact - LUL are not actively "trying" to "rip off"
Scotrail or sleeper passengers.

Naturally :-) And no, they're not actively trying to rip them off, I'm
sure it's just ignorance at work.

--
David Cantrell | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david

You can't spell AWESOME without ME!

David Cantrell wrote

Try a formal complaint to the TOC that issued the ticket.

They issued me with a valid ticket. The formal complaint will go to
LUL, CCed to Scotrail so they know how LUL are trying to rip them off
by
taking their money for the U12 portion of the ticket but trying to
not
honour the ticket.

Whether the ticket was technically valid is quite a subtle point.

But since it did not work the barriers it was faulty and that is what I
suggest should be the formal complaint.

I would also like to know if a similar sleeper (or just overnight on a
sleeper train) ticket which continued across London (Maltese Cross
symbol) would have the same problem on LU or NR.

--
Mike D

Michael R N Dolbear wrote:
I would also like to know if a similar sleeper (or just overnight on a
sleeper train) ticket which continued across London (Maltese Cross
symbol) would have the same problem on LU or NR.

Any ticket where you can't complete the journey by the last train is valid
as long as you restart your journey before noon. So a ticket from Woking to
Welwyn would be valid on the morning tube if you happened to start your
journey on the last train.

Whether staff will accept this is another question...

Theo