On 10 Apr, 00:25, Mizter T wrote:
On Apr 9, 10:18*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:





Paul Corfield wrote:
Having had to try to find a validator at Stratford to record an entry
on my (priv) PAYG card while trying to use the NXEA service to T Hale
I ended up walking for nearly 8 minutes to try to find one. *There
are non on the Lea Valley platforms or on the corridors leading to
them. This strikes me as an omission. When I found one on the central
line platforms I ended just getting on the central line instead! *I
imagine most people who have given up 7 minutes before I did. *The
NXEA staff had no idea what I was talking about when I asked where
the nearest validator was.

You've reminded me that I was reading a thread in a rail forum a couple of
days ago where someone was adamant that all the platform interchange
validators had been switched off atLondonBridgeas soon as PAYG went live
on NR.

The main thrust of that discussion was someone asking how he should
correctly use PAYG to commence a journey, having travelled as far as 'London
Terminals' with a paper ticket from somewhere like Portsmouth.

If they really have decided to switch off platform (or paid side)
'interchange validators' as a matter of policy, such passengers from outside
the zones wishing to change to PAYG seem to have little option but to exit
using their paper ticket and re-enter using PAYG. Is this really the current
situation - and is it reasonable?

I will endeavour to swing by the through platforms atLondonBridge
soon and take a look.


I looked at the ones at the end of platform 5/6 yesterday and they
were off.

Mizter T wrote:


By the by, FWIW I successfully used a pink interchange validator to
start a journey at Highbury & Islington (post footie, so the H&I gates
were in the open position to handle the crowds, and it was when the
NLL was still running and hence the NLL platforms accessible). I think
I then went and got on the Vic line - anyhow, there was no unresolved
journey or anything like that. So, going by this the pink validators
at West Brompton can be used to start a PAYG journey at least. Whether
they can end a journey I can't say - I suspect they can, but I haven't
tested that yet. Of course, just to be clear the official TfL guidance
is that pink validators should *not* be used to start or end a journey
- so don't anyone get in trouble by following me!

Going back to the original yellow 'interchange validators' having thought it
through again. With extension to the NR routes they do actually become a
major PAYG loophole don't they. Your previous suggestions about a 'soft
exit' cover the situation. Transfer from LU onto SWT at Wimbledon with a
touch on an interchange validator and the system will treat that as your
exit - if you then don't touch out on exit at an ungated station further
down the line you've saved a few zones. So perhaps most of them will be
removed...

Paul S

"Paul Scott" wrote in message
...


You've reminded me that I was reading a thread in a rail forum a couple of
days ago where someone was adamant that all the platform interchange
validators had been switched off at London Bridge as soon as PAYG went
live on NR.

The main thrust of that discussion was someone asking how he should
correctly use PAYG to commence a journey, having travelled as far as
'London Terminals' with a paper ticket from somewhere like Portsmouth.

If they really have decided to switch off platform (or paid side)
'interchange validators' as a matter of policy, such passengers from
outside the zones wishing to change to PAYG seem to have little option but
to exit using their paper ticket and re-enter using PAYG. Is this really
the current situation - and is it reasonable?

I think the answers are Yes and No. I tend to decide in advance how I'm
going to pay for my journey. Until recently Southern have been offering
Super Off Peak discounted travelcards from Brighton for £8.35, so I've
bought these and kept the Oyster card in my pocket. They're now offering
discounted London Terminals return tickets from Brighton for £7.45 so I'm
able to work with those + Oyster.

The only problem likely to hit me is with changing from paper to Oyster on
the Thameslink route. I tend to do one of the following:

1. for destinations near Farringdon: use City Thameslink and walk the extra
distance.

2. for destinations near Kings X: use Southern to Victoria and the Victoria
line, which is usually faster anyway.

DAS

On Apr 9, 9:39*pm, Paul Corfield wrote:

On Fri, 9 Apr 2010 13:07:59 -0700 (PDT), Mizter T
wrote:

I was in Stratford last September and saw something quite bizarre - a
couple of the Jubbly gates (in each direction) had standalone
validators fitted next to them and these featured pink (interchange)
pads, so it almost seemed as if some pax were going to be expected to
validate twice to get through the gates. This kinda blew my mind! I
did take a couple of very bad photos, but the Jubilee was closed that
weekend so I never saw if this arrangement was ever actually used. I'd
intended to post here about it, but things happened and I wasn't on
utl for a while thereafter, so I never got round to it. I'll try and
find said photos (which is something I'm sure I've said beforehand
though!). When I was next passing through Stratford in December (I
think), I took a look and found the gates locked open (with Oyster
pads inactive/ turned off), and the four or so standalone readers
active with yellow pads - this remained the situation a week or so
ago.

I'm wondering if the extra standalone validators were some far out
kludge that someone had devised to supposedly sort out some
horrifically complicated issue connected with the PAYG expansion - if
so, thankfully it got vetoed at some point (because it would have been
too confusing for words!). But these extra standalone readers were
definitely new installations as of sometime late summer '09, so
whatever it was had got far enough along the line to leave the drawing
board and assume a physical manifestation in the real world.

Remember though that Oyster routing validators were introduced with PAYG
in September last year. *The population expanded a bit when Oyster on NR
happened. It will expand a wee bit more when ELLX opens. * Again more
speculation from me but the Oyster route validators must create a
special transaction on the Oyster card which is used by the validation
device on final exit to charge the correct fare. *In effect it is an
"interchange" transaction with a purpose. *The JLE gateline also used to
set an "interchange" entry or exit transaction but it had no routing
purpose because there was only ever one PAYG fare prior to the "pink
invasion". * I would speculate that TfL decided that one form of
interchange transaction record had rather more value than one specific
to one location on the system.

I am sure that the things you saw there were put in to allow people
travelling from the east of Stratford, on the NLL and on NXEA from
Tottenham Hale to register their route so as to be charged via Zone 2/3
rather than via Zone 1.

I will dig the photos out and post them up somewhere (rather than
wasting time and effort jousting with Luko elsewhere!). It was a very
bizarre arrangement, but as I said I was never there to see it in
action (if it ever was in action). Afraid my abject failure to post
something timely on here means we're discussing it now when it's all
now history!


What is not clear from the photos I've seen of Stratford since the gates
went is whether there are still routing validators near the Jubilee Line
platforms. *It would make sense for them to be still there given the
need to log your route remains.

When I saw the very same validators later - in December, or maybe it
was January actually, then again a week or so ago, they'd changed from
pink to yellow pads. No photographic evidence this time I'm afraid,
but I'm 100% certain of it. No idea if there's anything there now -
I'll try and route myself via Stratford soon and have a butchers.


Having had to try to find a validator at Stratford to record an entry on
my (priv) PAYG card while trying to use the NXEA service to T Hale I
ended up walking for nearly 8 minutes to try to find one. *There are non
on the Lea Valley platforms or on the corridors leading to them. This
strikes me as an omission. When I found one on the central line
platforms I ended just getting on the central line instead! *I imagine
most people who have given up 7 minutes before I did. *The NXEA staff
had no idea what I was talking about when I asked where the nearest
validator was.

Not ideal, no. The new NLL platforms have them, but of course the NLL
platforms are very much closed at present. Others are on the Central
line platforms and at the entrance to the (existing) DLR platforms.
There weren't any validators at the end of platform 10 (?) where the
stop for the bus link for Stratford Int'l is located - though that
doesn't provide for access to the great outside.

(Quite separately I wonder how well used the highspeed services to
Stratford are by commuters, specifically those bound for Docklands/
Canary Wharf which must surely be the bulk of the potential market -
though maybe a few of those City bound might find getting on an NXEA
Great Eastern to Liverpool Street do-able, what with all the Central
line interchangees who alight at Stratford for the tube? Though the
Met/Circle line from KXSP will probably remain the preferable choice.)