On Wed, 28 Apr 2010 00:51:47 -0700 (PDT), Abigail Brady
wrote:

I suggest the reason the WLL trains observed hadn't got maps that show
the ELL isn't that they have decided not to, it is that they haven't
got round to putting them on yet. Wait a month, then see...

Once the extension to Highbury and Islington is completed the two
lines will overlap, with a common stop at Canonbury, so they will need
something by then won't they?

On Apr 28, 8:51*am, Abigail Brady wrote:

On Apr 28, 7:32*am, "Peter Masson" wrote:

There are two separate fleets, one (DC only) for the ELL, and another (dual
voltage) for the NLL/WLL/Euston-Watford DC. It makes sense only to include
line diagrams for the lines the trains will run on. Similarly D stock don't
include the Circle/H&C on their line diagrams, and C stock include
Wimbledon - Edgware Road, but not teh rest of the District.

Which may or may not make sense as a principle, but evidently isn't
the principle being followed
for these London Overground maps, 'cos otherwise they wouldn't show
the Goblin (which they do).

I suggest the reason the WLL trains observed hadn't got maps that show
the ELL isn't that they have decided not to, it is that they haven't
got round to putting them on yet. *Wait a month, then see...

I concur - I doubt it's anything more complicated than that.

On 28/04/2010 07:32, Peter Masson wrote:


"Ernesto" wrote

I traveled on the WLL later on in the day, the line diagrams on the
378 I rode on made no mention of the ELL at all, not even as "under
construction".

There are two separate fleets, one (DC only) for the ELL, and another
(dual voltage) for the NLL/WLL/Euston-Watford DC. It makes sense only to
include line diagrams for the lines the trains will run on. Similarly D
stock don't include the Circle/H&C on their line diagrams,

They don't even include HSK - Edgware Road, unless they've changed recently.

and C stock
include Wimbledon - Edgware Road, but not teh rest of the District.

Peter Masson wrote:
"Ernesto" wrote

I traveled on the WLL later on in the day, the line diagrams on the
378 I rode on made no mention of the ELL at all, not even as "under
construction".

There are two separate fleets, one (DC only) for the ELL, and another
(dual voltage) for the NLL/WLL/Euston-Watford DC.

They haven't done that with the maps Peter, the ELL trains have the entire
LO network, including West Croydon and Crystal Palace as you'd expect at
this stage. I don't see how they could include the SLL without a major
rethink though...

Paul S

On Apr 28, 7:07*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

Peter Masson wrote:

"Ernesto" wrote

I traveled on the WLL later on in the day, the line diagrams on the
378 I rode on made no mention of the ELL at all, not even as "under
construction".

There are two separate fleets, one (DC only) for the ELL, and another
(dual voltage) for the NLL/WLL/Euston-Watford DC.

They haven't done that with the maps Peter, the ELL trains have the entire
LO network, including West Croydon and Crystal Palace as you'd expect at
this stage. *I don't see how they could include the SLL without a major
rethink though...

For reference the line diagram/ map (whatever it is) that's in the
378/0s can be seen here - note that this is the pre-ELL version (which
will presumably be updated soon, though maybe not before through
running south of NXG starts in late May):
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24772733@N05/3716599200/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24772733@N05/3717604074/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ceej-muso/3863749969/

On 28/04/2010 07:32, Peter Masson wrote:


"Ernesto" wrote

I traveled on the WLL later on in the day, the line diagrams on the
378 I rode on made no mention of the ELL at all, not even as "under
construction".

There are two separate fleets, one (DC only) for the ELL, and another
(dual voltage) for the NLL/WLL/Euston-Watford DC. It makes sense only to
include line diagrams for the lines the trains will run on. Similarly D
stock don't include the Circle/H&C on their line diagrams, and C stock
include Wimbledon - Edgware Road, but not teh rest of the District.

Peter

Cannot ELL trains be fitted with a pantograph? I'm sure that many will
have noticed that they have pantograph coaches.

wrote

Cannot ELL trains be fitted with a pantograph? I'm sure that many will
have noticed that they have pantograph coaches.

They can, but why cart one around when it's not going to be used.

Peter

wrote:
On 28/04/2010 07:32, Peter Masson wrote:

There are two separate fleets, one (DC only) for the ELL, and another
(dual voltage) for the NLL/WLL/Euston-Watford DC. It makes sense
only to include line diagrams for the lines the trains will run on.
Similarly D stock don't include the Circle/H&C on their line
diagrams, and C stock include Wimbledon - Edgware Road, but not teh
rest of the District.

Cannot ELL trains be fitted with a pantograph? I'm sure that many will
have noticed that they have pantograph coaches.

Yes, all recent EMU builds have included pantograph recesses whatever their
initial use, typified by SWT's entire Desiro fleet, and all the SN 377s -
there is presumably some thought gone into this... The former units have
their cab control switches for the pantograph and presumably a certain
amount of associated wiring...

IIRC the last order of additional 378s (ie the 3 units to support the SLL
extension) will be dual voltage, presumably for additional operating
flexibility...

Paul S

On Apr 28, 12:11*am, Ernesto wrote:
On 27/04/2010 22:23, The Gardener wrote:





On Apr 27, 10:20 pm, *wrote:
On Apr 27, 12:50 am, *wrote: *There's a cab-view video of a test run on the ELl athttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/8620188.stm-rather
entertaining at the end where it seems to be herding track workers
along the line.
* Oh and by the way, they're announcing that the line is open, Monday
to Friday.

In the video I do not see the inside car line diagrams that
underground cars have. *Will these not be a feature of the "London
Overground"? *I always found them very useful.

They are definitely there - I travelled on the ELL this afternoon. The
whole set-up is very impressive, with the rather gloomy exception of
Dalston Junction, which reminds me of Birmingham New Street or
Sunderland about seven years ago.

I traveled on the WLL later on in the day, the line diagrams on the 378
I rode on made no mention of the ELL at all, not even as "under
construction".

--
"It's better to have and not need, than to need and not have..."

I was on the WLL on Monday too and at Shepherds Bush I picked up a
pretty good leaflet about the ELL project. So they do know about each
other...
Tim

On 27/04/2010 22:23, The Gardener wrote:
On Apr 27, 10:20 pm, wrote:
On Apr 27, 12:50 am, wrote: There's a cab-view video of a test run on the ELl athttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/8620188.stm-rather
entertaining at the end where it seems to be herding track workers
along the line.
Oh and by the way, they're announcing that the line is open, Monday
to Friday.


In the video I do not see the inside car line diagrams that
underground cars have. Will these not be a feature of the "London
Overground"? I always found them very useful.

They are definitely there - I travelled on the ELL this afternoon. The
whole set-up is very impressive, with the rather gloomy exception of
Dalston Junction, which reminds me of Birmingham New Street or
Sunderland about seven years ago.
Not the prettiest station, is it?