In uk.transport.london message ,
Wed, 22 Sep 2010 13:34:48, Ian Jelf posted:

In message , Recliner
writes
there would almost certainly be some quiet carriages on Underground
trains where phones were banned.

Oh yeah, that's going to work (and be enforceable), isn't it?!

Metallised windows?

--
(c) John Stockton, near London.
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"Rupert Moss-Eccardt" wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
"Rupert wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
"tony wrote in message
...
In , Steve Terry
scribeth thus
"Roy wrote in message
...
On 22 Sep, 11:55, wrote:
"Roy wrote in message



On 22/09/10 11:24, Recliner wrote:
snip

Well done. How about the actual operational needs.
To pick a simple example. Tetra works on the TGV, GSM doesn't


GSM could, GSM is now possible on airliners using cells on the aircraft
linked up to satellite or down to ground stations, and GSM is regularly
used on sea going Ferries using similar systems.

A more practical example is when i was in Hong Kong in 2002 i was using
GSM all over their MTR underground railway.
Obviously if the public have GSM down there, so did the staff and any
emergency services.

Tetra is a badly conceived and applied standard that should never have
existed and only does because of the vast amounts of money and
bureaucracy dedicated to it.

Dolphin has proved it to be a commercial failure.

Steve Terry
--
"I would like to plead for my right to investigate natural phenomena
without having guns pointed at me.
I also ask for the right to be wrong without being hanged for it."
- Wilhelm Reich, November 1947

Steve Terry wrote:
snip

Well done. How about the actual operational needs.
To pick a simple example. Tetra works on the TGV, GSM doesn't


GSM could, GSM is now possible on airliners using cells on the aircraft
linked up to satellite or down to ground stations, and GSM is regularly
used on sea going Ferries using similar systems.

A more practical example is when i was in Hong Kong in 2002 i was using
GSM all over their MTR underground railway.
Obviously if the public have GSM down there, so did the staff and any
emergency services.

Translation: Steve Terry doesn't understand the issues. Think why I
chose TGV especially, rather than another line. Umm. Perhaps it is to
do with the speed of the handset relative to the basestation.

Tetra is a badly conceived and applied standard that should never have
existed and only does because of the vast amounts of money and
bureaucracy dedicated to it.

Dolphin has proved it to be a commercial failure.

No, Dolphin has proved to be a commercial failure. There are
commercially succesful Tetra networks in a number of countries.

I realise you know very little. Perhaps you should Google a bit and
develop your understanding.

"Rupert Moss-Eccardt" wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
snip

Well done. How about the actual operational needs.
To pick a simple example. Tetra works on the TGV, GSM doesn't

GSM could, GSM is now possible on airliners using cells on the aircraft
linked up to satellite or down to ground stations, and GSM is regularly
used on sea going Ferries using similar systems.

A more practical example is when i was in Hong Kong in 2002 i was using
GSM all over their MTR underground railway.
Obviously if the public have GSM down there, so did the staff and any
emergency services.

Translation: Steve Terry doesn't understand the issues. Think why I chose
TGV especially, rather than another line. Umm. Perhaps it is to do with
the speed of the handset relative to the basestation.


Of course i understand the speed limitations of GSM, that's why i pointed
out
the use of GSM on airliners using onboard cells.

Maybe you haven't noticed but airliners travel faster than the TGV

So which do you think a member of the emergency services would
use to make a call on such an airliner, GSM or their Tetra?

Steve Terry
--
"I would like to plead for my right to investigate natural phenomena
without having guns pointed at me.
I also ask for the right to be wrong without being hanged for it."
- Wilhelm Reich, November 1947

Steve Terry wrote:
"Rupert wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
snip

Well done. How about the actual operational needs.
To pick a simple example. Tetra works on the TGV, GSM doesn't

GSM could, GSM is now possible on airliners using cells on the aircraft
linked up to satellite or down to ground stations, and GSM is regularly
used on sea going Ferries using similar systems.

A more practical example is when i was in Hong Kong in 2002 i was using
GSM all over their MTR underground railway.
Obviously if the public have GSM down there, so did the staff and any
emergency services.

Translation: Steve Terry doesn't understand the issues. Think why I chose
TGV especially, rather than another line. Umm. Perhaps it is to do with
the speed of the handset relative to the basestation.


Of course i understand the speed limitations of GSM, that's why i pointed
out
the use of GSM on airliners using onboard cells.


You have to have the cells onboard and onboard cells are still sparse.


Maybe you haven't noticed but airliners travel faster than the TGV

So which do you think a member of the emergency services would
use to make a call on such an airliner, GSM or their Tetra?

Well, the users I represented would use their Airwave handsets to the
fixed wing following behind. And, because Tetra has been designed in
this way, they would be able to have a talk group with people ahead and
behind the plane. Oh, and could have quick call set up. Oh and do this
even in the event of riot and civil commotion. Oh and talk directly with
other agencies. And quite a lot else besides which I won't go into here
coz it won't help

In article , Steve Terry
scribeth thus
"Rupert Moss-Eccardt" wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
"tony wrote in message
...
In , Steve Terry
scribeth thus
"Roy wrote in message
...
On 22 Sep, 11:55, wrote:
"Roy wrote in message



On 22/09/10 11:24, Recliner wrote:
snip
Tetra has nothing to do with sound engineering reasons, it's entirely
political and a means of funnelling large quantities of taxpayers
money to O2 Airwave.

Some fairly bald assertions, there. And wrong, too.

Firstly, perhaps you can point us at a capabilities specification for GSM
Pro and take us through how it meets the requirements that Tetra meets to
match the ERC specification.

That would be the ERC spec that allows Tetra multiplexing at 17.6Hz that
the Police Association are litigating for health damage to their officers.
A problem that wouldn't exist with GSM
Trower report:
http://www.tetrawatch.net/papers/trower_report.pdf


Some really good science there eh;?....

It is believed that during the daytime light going through our eyes passes a
message to the pineal glands in the brain which slows down the production of
melatonin. At night when no light goes through our eyes the production of
melatonin is speeded up. Melatonin is believed to scavenge cancer cells and
impurities in our bodies and boost the immune system. If an officer is sleeping
in quarters within range of the TETRA transmitter, the microwave radiation is
believed to act on the pineal gland and suppress the night-time melatonin to
daytime levels; hence the good work of the melatonin at night will be restricted
leading to suppression of the immune system.


Ummmm ....


Wasn't there a female Bobby based in Manchester that claimed that a TETRA radio got
her pregnant;?..

Now that would be really interesting to research;!...




Secondly, the TfL Tetra rollout doesn't involved Airwave, other than
requiring interworking.


Let me guess, you work for Airwave Tetra or TFL Tetra?
And Turkeys don't vote for Christmas.

In 2000 whist visiting Sweden i spoke to police officers about
their new GSM Pro personal radios (at the time using waterproof
Ericsson R250s) and they were very satisfied with them.
(retail price for Ericsson R250s at the time was around £100 each)
http://www.gsmarena.com/ericsson_r250s_pro-119.php

These 450 MHz versions?. With PPT I presume?..

Also if required additional encryption can be added to each phone.

I thought that GSM was well encrypted as it was?..


We of course years later had to reinvent the wheel, at the cost of billions
to the public for the benefit of private companies, and to the detriment
of the public allowing them to share an improved GSM network.

Are you suggesting that the public shared a security network?..

Steve Terry

--
Tony Sayer

In article , Steve Terry
scribeth thus
"Rupert Moss-Eccardt" wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
"Rupert wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
"tony wrote in message
...
In , Steve Terry
scribeth thus
"Roy wrote in message
...
On 22 Sep, 11:55, wrote:
"Roy wrote in message



On 22/09/10 11:24, Recliner wrote:
snip

Well done. How about the actual operational needs.
To pick a simple example. Tetra works on the TGV, GSM doesn't


GSM could, GSM is now possible on airliners using cells on the aircraft
linked up to satellite or down to ground stations, and GSM is regularly
used on sea going Ferries using similar systems.

A more practical example is when i was in Hong Kong in 2002 i was using
GSM all over their MTR underground railway.
Obviously if the public have GSM down there, so did the staff and any
emergency services.

Tetra is a badly conceived and applied standard that should never have
existed and only does because of the vast amounts of money and
bureaucracy dedicated to it.

But quite why?..

Dolphin has proved it to be a commercial failure.

Dolphin was never planned properly, never worked as it should have done,
and no one understood it and what it could and couldn't do;!;..

Steve Terry

--
Tony Sayer

In article , Rupert Moss-Eccardt
scribeth thus
Steve Terry wrote:
snip

Well done. How about the actual operational needs.
To pick a simple example. Tetra works on the TGV, GSM doesn't


GSM could, GSM is now possible on airliners using cells on the aircraft
linked up to satellite or down to ground stations, and GSM is regularly
used on sea going Ferries using similar systems.

A more practical example is when i was in Hong Kong in 2002 i was using
GSM all over their MTR underground railway.
Obviously if the public have GSM down there, so did the staff and any
emergency services.

Translation: Steve Terry doesn't understand the issues. Think why I
chose TGV especially, rather than another line.


Umm. Perhaps it is to
do with the speed of the handset relative to the basestation.



Think about that one;?....

--
Tony Sayer

In article , Steve Terry
scribeth thus

"Rupert Moss-Eccardt" wrote in message
...
Steve Terry wrote:
snip

Well done. How about the actual operational needs.
To pick a simple example. Tetra works on the TGV, GSM doesn't

GSM could, GSM is now possible on airliners using cells on the aircraft
linked up to satellite or down to ground stations, and GSM is regularly
used on sea going Ferries using similar systems.

A more practical example is when i was in Hong Kong in 2002 i was using
GSM all over their MTR underground railway.
Obviously if the public have GSM down there, so did the staff and any
emergency services.

Translation: Steve Terry doesn't understand the issues. Think why I chose
TGV especially, rather than another line. Umm. Perhaps it is to do with
the speed of the handset relative to the basestation.


Of course i understand the speed limitations of GSM, that's why i pointed
out
the use of GSM on airliners using onboard cells.


Maybe you haven't noticed but airliners travel faster than the TGV

Not a lot to do with it really?..


So which do you think a member of the emergency services would
use to make a call on such an airliner, GSM or their Tetra?

Aircraft radio...

Steve Terry

--
Tony Sayer

In article
s.com, martin scribeth thus
On Sep 23, 1:12*am, "Steve Terry" wrote:

Tetra has nothing to do with sound engineering reasons, it's entirely
political and a means of funnelling large quantities of taxpayers
money to O2 Airwave.

FYI: O2 sold Airwave to our friends at Macquarie in 2007:
http://www.zdnet.co.uk/news/networki...uity-snaps-up-
o2-airwave-39286784/

Yea.. The meek shall not inherit the communications earth 'cos the
Aussies have it all;!..
--
Tony Sayer