"John Salmon" wrote:

[cross-posted to uk.railway]

"David Cantrell" wrote:

Mizter T wrote:
For the record, I'll copy and paste the relevant bits below:

---quote---
* Southern
Boxing Day - limited service between Victoria and Brighton, London
Bridge to East Croydon via Norwood Junction and London Bridge and
East Croydon via Selhurst.

That has to be London *Victoria* and East Croydon via Selhurst.

The train service database seems to think that there is a Sutton-West
Croydon-Selhurst-Balham stopping service, an East Croydon-Crystal
Palace-Balham stopping service and a Brighton-Victoria service with calls
at Selhurst and Streatham Common. A rail replacement bus service runs
Balham - Wandsworth Common - Clapham Jn - Battersea Park - Victoria.


As I made clear in my post on utl, the text I copied and pasted (which is
shown above) came from a still extant BBC London webpage which detailed
*last year's* festive period rail services - i.e. 2009/2010. At the time of
writing that post, NRE had not yet put up their guide to xmas/new year rail
travel for this year (2010/2011) - though they appear to have done so this
morning (see my separate uk.r post on this).

I have no idea whether or not the Selhurst service mentioned above went into
London Bridge last year, as the text on the BBC webpage states, or whether
that was a mistake and it went into Victoria.

The aforementioned BBC London webpage for last year is he
http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/h...00/8413759.stm
or via http://tinyurl.com/Festive-rail-travel-2009-2010

On Nov 11, 1:11*pm, Roland Perry wrote:
In message
, at
03:32:34 on Thu, 11 Nov 2010, martin
remarked:

I work shifts. This year, I'm due to work on the morning of December
25th and the 26th. My employer recognises that it's a bit of an
antisocial time to work, so provides transport, an extra payment, and
lays on some food and drink. The policy clearly states that the
payments apply for the 25th and 26th, and not for the Christmas Day /
Boxing Day holiday.

Are they assuming that public transport is back in operation?

I'm not sure if the transport's part of the written policy; rather
it's a long standing local agreement - if you usually use public
transport to get to work, and it's not running, then they'll pay for
reasonable taxi costs. There's a bit of management discretion involved
too - the year before last, they paid for me to get a cab in for an
early shift on January 1st, even though I could have taken the tube.

Bringing things back on topic, even though we sometimes have to work
over Christmas, and Christmas sometimes falls on a weekend, there's
never a dispute about which day attracts extra payments. Shame a
large employer like LUL hasn't got this sorted.

On Nov 11, 2:17 pm, martin wrote:

On Nov 11, 1:11 pm, Roland Perry wrote:

In message
,
at 03:32:34 on Thu, 11 Nov 2010, martin
remarked:

I work shifts. This year, I'm due to work on the morning of December
25th and the 26th. My employer recognises that it's a bit of an
antisocial time to work, so provides transport, an extra payment, and
lays on some food and drink. The policy clearly states that the
payments apply for the 25th and 26th, and not for the Christmas Day /
Boxing Day holiday.

Are they assuming that public transport is back in operation?

I'm not sure if the transport's part of the written policy; rather
it's a long standing local agreement - if you usually use public
transport to get to work, and it's not running, then they'll pay for
reasonable taxi costs. There's a bit of management discretion involved
too - the year before last, they paid for me to get a cab in for an
early shift on January 1st, even though I could have taken the tube.

Bringing things back on topic, even though we sometimes have to work
over Christmas, and Christmas sometimes falls on a weekend, there's
never a dispute about which day attracts extra payments. Shame a
large employer like LUL hasn't got this sorted.


I dare say it is sorted as per the contractual terms, it's just that the
unions like to try and extract that bit extra - indeed, perhaps in previous
years ex-gratia payments have been made (and in a sense that wouldn't be
that different to the concept concept of there being things done outside of
the 'written policy', e.g. some management discretion, 'long standing local
agreement' etc) - and maybe the issue is that nothing of the sort is being
countenanced by LU this year (as the kitty is empty). Add onto that the
general disquiet about the future.

Perhaps the best place to find out more would be the District Dave forum -
plenty of LU staff pop in there. I might ask, if the issue isn't live there
already.

Anyhow, will they pay you for a new set of tyres if you cycle in?

On Nov 11, 2:17 pm, martin wrote:

On Nov 11, 1:11 pm, Roland Perry wrote:

In message
,
at 03:32:34 on Thu, 11 Nov 2010, martin
remarked:

I work shifts. This year, I'm due to work on the morning of December
25th and the 26th. My employer recognises that it's a bit of an
antisocial time to work, so provides transport, an extra payment, and
lays on some food and drink. The policy clearly states that the
payments apply for the 25th and 26th, and not for the Christmas Day /
Boxing Day holiday.

Are they assuming that public transport is back in operation?

I'm not sure if the transport's part of the written policy; rather
it's a long standing local agreement - if you usually use public
transport to get to work, and it's not running, then they'll pay for
reasonable taxi costs. There's a bit of management discretion involved
too - the year before last, they paid for me to get a cab in for an
early shift on January 1st, even though I could have taken the tube.

Bringing things back on topic, even though we sometimes have to work
over Christmas, and Christmas sometimes falls on a weekend, there's
never a dispute about which day attracts extra payments. Shame a
large employer like LUL hasn't got this sorted.


I dare say it is sorted as per the contractual terms, it's just that the
unions like to try and extract that bit extra - indeed, perhaps in previous
years ex-gratia payments have been made (and in a sense that wouldn't be
that different to the concept concept of there being things done outside of
the 'written policy', e.g. some management discretion, 'long standing local
agreement' etc) - and maybe the issue is that nothing of the sort is being
countenanced by LU this year (as the kitty is empty). Add onto that the
general disquiet about the future.

Perhaps the best place to find out more would be the District Dave forum -
plenty of LU staff pop in there. I might ask, if the issue isn't live there
already.

Anyhow, will they pay you for a new set of tyres if you cycle in?

In article ,
Mizter T wrote:
No - there's a few Southern and Southeastern services, plus (reduced)
airport express services.

This webpage details what happened last year (Xmas 2009):
http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/h...00/8413759.stm

Interesting, thanks. I knew about the airport services, but not the
others (nor the Scottish ones). I'm just so used to everything in
this country shutting down over Christmas...

-roy

"Roy Badami" wrote:

Mizter T wrote:
No - there's a few Southern and Southeastern services, plus (reduced)
airport express services.

This webpage details what happened last year (Xmas 2009):
http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/h...00/8413759.stm

Interesting, thanks. I knew about the airport services, but not the
others (nor the Scottish ones). I'm just so used to everything in
this country shutting down over Christmas...


You might be surprised at the number of corner shop / convenience store type
establishments that one can find open in at least some parts of London on
Christmas Day itself - to be honest, it has surprised me a bit too! A number
of public hostelries also open up, albeit generally I think only for limited
hours - plus there are those pubs that go in for the full Christmas lunch
fandango too of course.

Back on topic(-ish), the Oxford Tube runs on on Xmas day but reroutes itself
to serve Heathrow en route to Oxford (and hence misses Hillingdon), and so
that provides an alternative to the HEx bus - see:
http://www.oxfordtube.com/serviceinfo_7973.php

I think that airport coach services run from London to Luton (Greenline) and
Stansted (NX) on Xmas day too.

In article ,
Mizter T wrote:
You might be surprised at the number of corner shop / convenience store type
establishments that one can find open in at least some parts of London on
Christmas Day itself - to be honest, it has surprised me a bit too!

Yeah, that happens to some extent outside London, too, IME. There are
enough shops run by people from immigrant communities that don't seem
to celebrate Christmas at all (i.e. they wouldn't be doing anything
special even if they had the day off). As an aside, this always
strikes me as slighly odd -- I'm an atheist myself so Christmas has no
religious significance for me, but I still regard it as the
traditional time to visit family and give gifts. And most people I
know would be happy just to celebrate being given a day off work,
regardless of the reason -- but I guess if you're in business for
yourself your outlook is different.

Mainly I was thinking about public transport, though. In Cambridge,
IIRC last year there were no buses on Christmas Day, Boxing Day or New
Year's Day (other bank holidays during the year had a Sunday service),
so it's interesting to learn that the tube still runs on Boxing Day.
Does the rest of TfL run, too (DLR, Overground, TramLink, buses)? Is
it pretty much a full service?

Presumably nothing at all runs on Christmas Day itself?

-roy

In article , (Roy
Badami) wrote:

In article
,
Mizter T wrote:
No - there's a few Southern and Southeastern services, plus (reduced)
airport express services.

This webpage details what happened last year (Xmas 2009):

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/h...413000/8413759.
stm

Interesting, thanks. I knew about the airport services, but not the
others (nor the Scottish ones). I'm just so used to everything in
this country shutting down over Christmas...

They don't have Boxing Day as a holiday in Scotland, Roy. They had New
Year's Day long before England did and have the next day off as well now.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

"Roy Badami" wrote:

Mizter T wrote:
You might be surprised at the number of corner shop / convenience store
type
establishments that one can find open in at least some parts of London on
Christmas Day itself - to be honest, it has surprised me a bit too!

Yeah, that happens to some extent outside London, too, IME. There are
enough shops run by people from immigrant communities that don't seem
to celebrate Christmas at all (i.e. they wouldn't be doing anything
special even if they had the day off). As an aside, this always
strikes me as slighly odd -- I'm an atheist myself so Christmas has no
religious significance for me, but I still regard it as the
traditional time to visit family and give gifts. And most people I
know would be happy just to celebrate being given a day off work,
regardless of the reason -- but I guess if you're in business for
yourself your outlook is different.

Yeah, I think so.

Regarding my surprise - I've always been aware of it, though I think the
number of shops opening has increased over the years (what with the whole
convenience culture and all that - there'll be some demand if there's some
supply) - but I really started taking notice of it when I decided to count
the number of shops I could see open on a there-and-back cycle journey
(taking a different return route) on a Christmas day morning a few years
ago - I can't now remember how many I got to, but it was lots.


Mainly I was thinking about public transport, though. In Cambridge,
IIRC last year there were no buses on Christmas Day, Boxing Day or New
Year's Day (other bank holidays during the year had a Sunday service),
so it's interesting to learn that the tube still runs on Boxing Day.
Does the rest of TfL run, too (DLR, Overground, TramLink, buses)? Is
it pretty much a full service?

Not quite - on Boxing Day (26th) it's normally a kind of reduced Sunday
service I think, maybe take the Sunday out of that and just call it a
reduced service. Ditto on the DLR. IIRC on the buses and Tramlink it's
basically a Sunday service. No service on LO - at least, there hasn't been
thus far (LO of course is rather dependent on Network Rail - but it's
possible I suppose, given the limited mainline services running elsewhere on
the network).

I've got a PDF of last years TfL leaflet somewhere I'm sure, maybe I'll try
and dig it up - though this years info will be out fairly soon I'd think.


Presumably nothing at all runs on Christmas Day itself?

No. (Well, nothing of TfL's - GatEx and HEx offer buses instead, and the
diverted Oxford Tube provides a link to Heathrow.)

In previous years some of the bus companies have run a few special services
around central London off their own back, charging special fares - I think
London General was one of them - but nothing like this happened last year.

Actually, just had a thought - in a sense there will be a TfL service on
Christmas day, that of the Cycle Hire scheme which I imagine will be
operating. However as 'casual access' has not yet been implemented (that's
planned for sometime in the new year I think), anyone wanting to use it
would need to be a member and be in possession of a key.

I guess it's possible that the docking stations could be configured not to
allow anyone to hire a bike on Xmas day itself (whilst still allowing for
returns), with the reason being that there weren't any staff at the control
room to monitor it all - that said, given the assets that are out on the
street as part of the scheme (in other words the bikes!) I can't help but
think that the control room would be staffed, and thus I reckon it'll be
possible to hire a bike on Xmas day - we shall see what actually transpires
in good time though.

On Nov 11, 2:54*pm, "Mizter T" wrote:

Anyhow, will they pay you for a new set of tyres if you cycle in?

I daresay they wouldn't begrudge me claiming at the HMRC-recommended
rate of 20p per mile. In fact, if the weather's not too bad, I might
just do that...