On Nov 21, 12:50*pm, Roland Perry wrote:
In message
, at
03:31:31 on Sun, 21 Nov 2010, MIG
remarked:

Is there a recognised maximum percentage of the number of people capable
of using public transport - in other words discounting those in
hospital, housebound, agraphobics, and other such circumstances?

It's possibly an interesting point, but the distinction I was making
was not so much about the 100% as about the difference between "most
facilities" and "most people". *I can accept that not all facilities
can instantly be made as accessible as possible.

I accept that figures like "99%" are actually expressing a numerical
quantity, but merely mean "almost everyone".

It simply made me wonder what the actual practical limit was, given that
some people could never be taken on public transport given their
circumstances.

I recognised the practical limit that you were trying to identify, and
didn't dispute the reasoning behind it. Although at the same time
there may be advances in coping with their circumstances; see below.


I can't accept the attitude that some people are never going to be
bothered with.

Did you mean "some people aren't going to be coped with?". The law of
diminishing returns is bound to set in, and where you call it a day is a
political decision.

Both might be expressed in terms of limited funds available.

Sure. Making the Tube accessible to people permanently connected to a
dialysis machine, or inside an oxygen tent, is going to be very
expensive. You may say these are ridiculous examples, but there are many
people with issues which restrict their mobility, beyond those who are
well enough to use a wheelchair.

I accept that, but in the background there has to be general vision of
allowing such people to lead as full a life as possible. New kinds of
dialysis will be invented that don't require permanent connection etc,
but it won't happen overnight. That's not the same as saying we'll
stop looking at improvements to dialysis because most people don't use
dialysis.

On 19 Nov, 19:22, Paul Corfield wrote:
On Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:38:56 +0000, Bruce wrote:
George wrote:

Does anybody really think wheelchair users are ever going to be able
to use the tube? Val Shawcross and the like just can't grasp the fact
that many disabled people don't want to use public transport, it just
isn't a viable option for them and it never will be.

It obviously hasn't occurred to you that the main reason that disabled
people don't use public transport is that it is mostly inaccessible.

It is quite wrong to say many disabled people don't *want* to use
public transport. *They just don't want to use a system that offers
difficult and/or restricted access. *Hardly a surprise.

People like you seem to forget that the vast majority of disabled
people used to be able-bodied but have become incapacitated through
illness, accident or military service. *They aren't a different
species. *They are just like you and me, except for impaired mobility.

People like you seem to forget that accessibility issues also affect
parents with young children and people who are mobility impaired but
not in a wheelchair. *Just try taking a small child on the Tube with a
pushchair. *Or more than one child. *It's a nightmare.

You make it sound as though you would like public transport to be made
inaccessible to all but able-bodied people so you can be spared the
sight of freaks in wheelchairs, and small children. *;-)

Goodness me. Mr Polson vs Mr Manning - an undreamed of combination of
combatants. *Do have fun knocking seven bells out of each other. For
those of us who are very familiar with George's views from other places
then this will provide huge entertainment while you all decide whether
to support or deride his views.

I'll just pull up a comfy chair and grab a bag of popcorn and watch from
the sidelines * :-)

--
Paul C- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Sorry to disappoint you Paul but I think I've said all I have to say
on this subject.

Anybody who uses the tube regularly will know that the very idea of
wheelchairs on the tube is a non starter, and goodness only knows what
happens if a train has to be evacuated mid tunnel.

The obvious solution is a free to use taxi service for wheelchair
users but it just doesn't comply with the pc brigade and their bizzare
idea that wheelchair users should have to slum it with the rest of us,
all in the name of equality of course.

In article ,
George wrote:
Anybody who uses the tube regularly will know that the very idea of
wheelchairs on the tube is a non starterc[...]

At peak times, that may well be true. But there are many bits of the
tube that are accessible and, I'm sure, are regularly used by
wheelchair users.

TfL even publish a guide with detailed accessibility information:

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...-guide-map.pdf

-roy

On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 08:59:12 -0800 (PST), George wrote:
Anybody who uses the tube regularly will know that the very idea of
wheelchairs on the tube is a non starter, and goodness only knows what
happens if a train has to be evacuated mid tunnel.

Wheelchairs don't get in the way of train evacuation in a tunnel. Bikes
do which is why they are banned from the deep tube sections.

On Nov 22, 4:59*pm, George wrote:
[snip]
Anybody who uses the tube regularly will know that the very idea of
wheelchairs on the tube is a non starter, [...]

Interesting - I'll tell that to my friend who regularly uses the Tube
(commutes in fact) in her wheelchair.

Anyhow, there's nothing like a nice high-handed dystopian utl thread
to ward off potential contributors of a more level headed nature.

Mizter T wrote:
On Nov 22, 4:59*pm, George wrote:
[snip]
Anybody who uses the tube regularly will know that the very idea of
wheelchairs on the tube is a non starter, [...]

Interesting - I'll tell that to my friend who regularly uses the Tube
(commutes in fact) in her wheelchair.

Anyhow, there's nothing like a nice high-handed dystopian utl thread
to ward off potential contributors of a more level headed nature.


I couldn't have put it better.

wrote in message

On Sat, 20 Nov 2010 08:21:57 -0800 (PST)
MIG wrote:
type of person who needs a cause to shout about - doesn't really
matter what that cause is. Which is why you get the same motley
crew turning up to every vaguely anti government demonstration
whether it be Stop the War or student demos or whatever. Its the
same with right-on topics -
you get the same sort of usual suspects whinging about everything.

B2003

Lucky that doesn't happen with right-wingers (or is that whingers?).

Apart from the occasionally BNP demo - and most people with right
wing views wouldn't associate with those muppets anyway - I don't
remember many marches about right wing topics. Probably because most
people who have right wing views are older and have grown out of the
shouting at the pigeons stage which unfortunately afflicts a lot of
left wing activists.

Perhaos this counts?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2274129.stm

"Recliner" wrote:
wrote in message

On Sat, 20 Nov 2010 08:21:57 -0800 (PST)
MIG wrote:
type of person who needs a cause to shout about - doesn't really
matter what that cause is. Which is why you get the same motley
crew turning up to every vaguely anti government demonstration
whether it be Stop the War or student demos or whatever. Its the
same with right-on topics -
you get the same sort of usual suspects whinging about everything.

B2003

Lucky that doesn't happen with right-wingers (or is that whingers?).

Apart from the occasionally BNP demo - and most people with right
wing views wouldn't associate with those muppets anyway - I don't
remember many marches about right wing topics. Probably because most
people who have right wing views are older and have grown out of the
shouting at the pigeons stage which unfortunately afflicts a lot of
left wing activists.

Perhaos this counts?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2274129.stm



Poor Boltar obviously hasn't heard of the English Defence League.

On Mon, 22 Nov 2010 20:35:08 +0000
Bruce wrote:
remember many marches about right wing topics. Probably because most
people who have right wing views are older and have grown out of the
shouting at the pigeons stage which unfortunately afflicts a lot of
left wing activists.

Perhaos this counts?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2274129.stm

Well for a start it was 8 years ago so is that really the best you can do ,
and secondly since when did country issues become right wing? Or do you
just dislike anyone who doesn't live in a squat in the inner city?

Poor Boltar obviously hasn't heard of the English Defence League.

They march often then?

B2003

On Nov 22, 8:10*pm, Mizter T wrote:
On Nov 22, 4:59*pm, George wrote:

[snip]
Anybody who uses the tube regularly will know that the very idea of
wheelchairs on the tube is a non starter, [...]

Interesting - I'll tell that to my friend who regularly uses the Tube
(commutes in fact) in her wheelchair.

Anyhow, there's nothing like a nice high-handed dystopian utl thread
to ward off potential contributors of a more level headed nature.

Well obviously I'll have to take your word that this person actually
exists but I think you'll agree that she is the exception to the rule?

BTW Have you ever asked her if she would prefer a taxi?

I mean how uncaring of me not to expect wheelchair users to have to
slum it with the rest of us, sadly I doubt whether the bigots will
ever remove their head from the sandpit of political corecness!