"Andy Breen" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 15:21:58 +0100, Peter Masson wrote:

"allantracy" wrote

The future for cars looks very bleak unless they can be persuaded to
run on electricity.

Though there was a steam car around a while ago how ironic would that
be?

Battery technology can never be made efficient,

Define the meaning you are picking for "efficient" in this context..

so even with nuclear or
other renewable generation of electricity, battery cars can never be
made efficient.

See above. What do you mean by this? Cost? Energy density? Charge cycling
efficiency? Lifespan? Charging time?

charge cycle efficiency. The other issues can in principle be overcome, but
the laws of physics will not let you charge and discharge a battery without
significant energy losses.

Peter

On Sep 17, 7:39*am, "Peter Masson" wrote:
"Andy Breen" wrote in message

...



On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 15:21:58 +0100, Peter Masson wrote:

"allantracy" wrote

The future for cars looks very bleak unless they can be persuaded to
run on electricity.

Though there was a steam car around a while ago how ironic would that
be?

Battery technology can never be made efficient,

Define the meaning you are picking for "efficient" in this context..

so even with nuclear or
other renewable generation of electricity, battery cars can never be
made efficient.

See above. What do you mean by this? Cost? Energy density? Charge cycling
efficiency? Lifespan? Charging time?

charge cycle efficiency. The other issues can in principle be overcome, but
the laws of physics will not let you charge and discharge a battery without
significant energy losses.


Are there not also weight, and size issues with batteries. Gasoline/
petrolium is fairly light and very efficient. A trunk full of
batteries is heavy, even if we are talking about the recent battery
developments.

There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 07:44:04 -0700 (PDT), 77002
wrote:

On Sep 17, 7:39*am, "Peter Masson" wrote:
"Andy Breen" wrote in message

...



On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 15:21:58 +0100, Peter Masson wrote:

"allantracy" wrote

The future for cars looks very bleak unless they can be persuaded to
run on electricity.

Though there was a steam car around a while ago how ironic would that
be?

Battery technology can never be made efficient,

Define the meaning you are picking for "efficient" in this context..

so even with nuclear or
other renewable generation of electricity, battery cars can never be
made efficient.

See above. What do you mean by this? Cost? Energy density? Charge cycling
efficiency? Lifespan? Charging time?

charge cycle efficiency. The other issues can in principle be overcome, but
the laws of physics will not let you charge and discharge a battery without
significant energy losses.


Are there not also weight, and size issues with batteries. Gasoline/
petrolium is fairly light and very efficient. A trunk full of
batteries is heavy, even if we are talking about the recent battery
developments.

There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

In message , at 16:23:49 on
Sat, 17 Sep 2011, Nobody remarked:
There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

And much of Eastern Europe.
--
Roland Perry

On 19/09/2011 07:42, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:23:49 on
Sat, 17 Sep 2011, Nobody remarked:
There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

And much of Eastern Europe.

And Mendoza in Argentina. May be unique in Southern South America.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.
Railway Miscellany at www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail

On Mon, 19 Sep 2011 08:02:56 +0100, Graeme Wall
wrote:

On 19/09/2011 07:42, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:23:49 on
Sat, 17 Sep 2011, Nobody remarked:
There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

And much of Eastern Europe.

And Mendoza in Argentina. May be unique in Southern South America.

With (at least some of their fleet) about 80 recycled Flyers from
Vancouver, BC.

They were shipped to a port in Chile, then over the Trans-Andean
Highway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybuses_in_Mendoza

On 21/09/2011 01:34, Nobody wrote:
On Mon, 19 Sep 2011 08:02:56 +0100, Graeme Wall
wrote:

On 19/09/2011 07:42, Roland Perry wrote:
In , at 16:23:49 on
Sat, 17 Sep 2011, remarked:
There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

And much of Eastern Europe.

And Mendoza in Argentina. May be unique in Southern South America.

With (at least some of their fleet) about 80 recycled Flyers from
Vancouver, BC.

They were shipped to a port in Chile, then over the Trans-Andean
Highway.

Which is famed in cycling circles as having the longest downhill section
in the world, something like 60 miles continuous downgrade travelling
west to east.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybuses_in_Mendoza

Interesting, they were still using the Solingen vehicles last time I was
there.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.
Railway Miscellany at www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail

In article ,
(Graeme Wall) wrote:

On 19/09/2011 07:42, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:23:49 on
Sat, 17 Sep 2011, Nobody remarked:
There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

And much of Eastern Europe.

And Mendoza in Argentina. May be unique in Southern South America.

Did Brazil get rid of its systems? Rio and Sao Paulo certainly had them.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In article , (Roland Perry)
wrote:

In message , at 16:23:49
on Sat, 17 Sep 2011, Nobody remarked:
There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

And much of Eastern Europe.

Europe generally. Switzerland has quite a few systems. We may be one of the
few European countries without trolleybuses in public use.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In message , at 08:35:23
on Thu, 22 Sep 2011, remarked:
There is clearly something to be said for Electric/trolley buses.
They are still very much in use in Boston, MA and San Francisco, CA.

And Seattle, WA and Metro Vancouver, BC.

And much of Eastern Europe.

Europe generally. Switzerland has quite a few systems.

My picture of one in Geneva: http://www.panoramio.com/photo/25005195

Also in Lausanne.
--
Roland Perry