Perhaps one might open up Aldwych Station as a special undeground shopping
mall or similar service, with a dedicated rejeuvanated Underground shuttle
from Holborn.

"juvenal" wrote in message
...

Perhaps one might open up Aldwych Station as a
special undeground shopping mall or similar service,
with a dedicated rejeuvanated Underground shuttle
from Holborn.

Aldwych was closed because the lift was life expired, and the passenger
numbers couldn't justify its replacement. It will never see another
passenger train, unless a huge development occurs around Aldwych which can
fund the lift replacement.

--
John Rowland - Spamtrapped
Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html
A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood.
That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line -
It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes

"John Rowland" wrote in message ...
"juvenal" wrote in message
...

Perhaps one might open up Aldwych Station as a
special undeground shopping mall or similar service,
with a dedicated rejeuvanated Underground shuttle
from Holborn.

Aldwych was closed because the lift was life expired, and the passenger
numbers couldn't justify its replacement. It will never see another
passenger train, unless a huge development occurs around Aldwych which can
fund the lift replacement.

No doubt the people who made that decision forgot that the underground is
a public service, not a for profit company. For somewhere like Ongar that
only had 3 people and a dog use the station each day I can understand closure
but aldwych had something like 500 people a day using it. Not a huge amount
but IMO enough to justify its being kept open given that there are probably
quite a few stations still open that probably get less usage that that.
The whole of the ELL springs to mind for starters plus Mill Hill East on the
northern line. But I guess in this country the bean counters rule.

B2003

"Boltar" wrote in message
om...
"John Rowland" wrote in message
...

Aldwych was closed because the lift was life expired, and the passenger
numbers couldn't justify its replacement. It will never see another
passenger train, unless a huge development occurs around Aldwych which
can
fund the lift replacement.

No doubt the people who made that decision forgot that the underground is
a public service, not a for profit company

And as with any public service choices have to be made as to where to spend
a limited budget. It is not realistic (and it wasn't so even in the
'good-old-days') that there is a bottomless pit of money to be spent on
public transport.

Considering how close Aldwych is to other tube stations and the good bus
links it has there is little loss to those getting to the area to the
closure.

But I guess in this country the bean counters rule.

They always have. Don't forget that most of the London Underground network
(as well as mainline services) were built using private money with the idea
of making a profit. The Aldwych - Holborn link wasn't built as a social
service.

Dave.

(Boltar) wrote the following in:
om

"John Rowland" wrote in
message ...
"juvenal" wrote in message
...

Perhaps one might open up Aldwych Station as a
special undeground shopping mall or similar service,
with a dedicated rejeuvanated Underground shuttle
from Holborn.

Aldwych was closed because the lift was life expired, and the
passenger numbers couldn't justify its replacement. It will never
see another passenger train, unless a huge development occurs
around Aldwych which can fund the lift replacement.

No doubt the people who made that decision forgot that the
underground is a public service, not a for profit company.

It doesn't mean they don't have to make decisions about how to spend
their limited amount of money though.

For
somewhere like Ongar that only had 3 people and a dog use the
station each day I can understand closure but aldwych had
something like 500 people a day using it.

Ongar was the only tube station in the area. Aldwych is surrounded by
tube stations and has at least 10 bus routes that go past or near it. I
regularly travel to Aldwych but if the Aldwych shuttle service were
still running I doubt I'd use it much. There are other, much more
convenient ways of getting there.

Not a huge amount but
IMO enough to justify its being kept open given that there are
probably quite a few stations still open that probably get less
usage that that.

But it wasn't just a case of keeping it open. It would have needed a
big investment to keep it open.

The whole of the ELL springs to mind for starters
plus Mill Hill East on the northern line.

I very much doubt those places are as well provided for by other
services as Aldwych.

But I guess in this
country the bean counters rule.

When beans have to be counted I'd prefer it be done sensibly.

--
message by Robin May, succeeding at failure.
Enjoy the Routemaster while you still can.

Crime is confusing.

Unless I'm very much mistaken, it was Boltar ),
in message who said:

Aldwych was closed because the lift was life expired, and the
passenger
numbers couldn't justify its replacement. It will never see another
passenger train, unless a huge development occurs around Aldwych
which can
fund the lift replacement.

No doubt the people who made that decision forgot that the
underground is
a public service, not a for profit company. For somewhere like Ongar
that
only had 3 people and a dog use the station each day I can understand
closure
but aldwych had something like 500 people a day using it. Not a huge
amount
but IMO enough to justify its being kept open given that there are
probably
quite a few stations still open that probably get less usage that
that.
The whole of the ELL springs to mind for starters plus Mill Hill East
on the
northern line. But I guess in this country the bean counters rule.


It is indeed a public service, and therefore it's ludicrous to expect
everyone in the public to pay for a station used only by a tiny fraction of
people who had alternate route options available to them.

Mill Hill East and Shoreditch may well have bitten the dust long ago if they
had lift mechanisms to repair for £3 million - but they don't. It doesn't
cost a great deal to keep them open.

BTN

"juvenal" wrote in message ...
Perhaps one might open up Aldwych Station as a special undeground shopping
mall or similar service, with a dedicated rejeuvanated Underground shuttle
from Holborn.

That sounds like a really good idea - they could renovate the
half-remodelled platform 6 at Holborn and the half-destroyed platform
2 at Aldwych and turn it into a super-modern Underground store where
they sell more Underground stuff.

Too bad it would be prohibitively expensive to repair the lifts -
they'd never get their investment back.

"TheOneKEA" wrote in message
om...
"juvenal" wrote in message
...
Perhaps one might open up Aldwych Station as a special undeground
shopping
mall or similar service, with a dedicated rejeuvanated Underground
shuttle
from Holborn.

That sounds like a really good idea - they could renovate the
half-remodelled platform 6 at Holborn and the half-destroyed platform
2 at Aldwych and turn it into a super-modern Underground store where
they sell more Underground stuff.

Too bad it would be prohibitively expensive to repair the lifts -
they'd never get their investment back.

If you restored the disused station as an early Yerkes station, used the
station and the second tunnel to Holborn as a Tube museum, and redeveloped
the parts of the station that were never used as larger tunnels with small
retail outlets (along the lines of an undeground Covent Garden) with a
second Strand entrance, then you might have enough passengers to restore the
lifts (although it would be shame to remove them). If it really took off,
you could even put platforms on the JL oveerun from CX to Aldwych!

Beack in the realms of reality, though, you're probably right in thinking
that it probably wouldn't be able to pay it's way.

"juvenal" wrote in message ...
If you restored the disused station as an early Yerkes station, used the
station and the second tunnel to Holborn as a Tube museum, and redeveloped
the parts of the station that were never used as larger tunnels with small
retail outlets (along the lines of an undeground Covent Garden) with a
second Strand entrance, then you might have enough passengers to restore the
lifts (although it would be shame to remove them). If it really took off,
you could even put platforms on the JL oveerun from CX to Aldwych!

Beack in the realms of reality, though, you're probably right in thinking
that it probably wouldn't be able to pay it's way.

Its not unrealistic. Thats exactly how the NYC Transit museum is set up. Its
based in an old disused subway station on a spur from the main line and in
the platforms they've got lots of old stock that you can wander around in.
Aldwych would be a squeeze but CX would be perfect for this (well , for showing
tube stock at any rate).

B2003

"juvenal" wrote in message ...
"TheOneKEA" wrote in message
om...
"juvenal" wrote in message
...
Perhaps one might open up Aldwych Station as a special undeground
shopping
mall or similar service, with a dedicated rejeuvanated Underground
shuttle
from Holborn.

That sounds like a really good idea - they could renovate the
half-remodelled platform 6 at Holborn and the half-destroyed platform
2 at Aldwych and turn it into a super-modern Underground store where
they sell more Underground stuff.

Too bad it would be prohibitively expensive to repair the lifts -
they'd never get their investment back.

If you restored the disused station as an early Yerkes station, used the
station and the second tunnel to Holborn as a Tube museum, and redeveloped
the parts of the station that were never used as larger tunnels with small
retail outlets (along the lines of an undeground Covent Garden) with a
second Strand entrance, then you might have enough passengers to restore the
lifts (although it would be shame to remove them). If it really took off,
you could even put platforms on the JL oveerun from CX to Aldwych!

Beack in the realms of reality, though, you're probably right in thinking
that it probably wouldn't be able to pay it's way.

The problem with all of these ideas is lack of fire escape. On
several occasions I've been asked about the possibility of converting
Aldwych into some form of themed night club. The problem is that
health & safety would be a nightmare as the only access (currently) is
the spiral stair case and the lift shafts are in the same section as
that.

Currently, the only alternative exit is down the tunnels to Holborn
and this would mean crossing potentially live rails - again a big
no-no!

Conversion into a museum would be a grand idea, though I suspect
providing it with a special train only to serve the museum would
porbably be prohibitively expensive. I believe something similar
actually exists on the New York Subway, where Court Street station now
houses the New York Transit Museum.

Coincidentally, just this sort of conversion is about to be applied to
a tunnel that runs in parallel with Aldwych immediately above - the
Kingsway Tram Tunnel. I've been told that this (or at leas part of
it) is about to be converted into an art gallery which will open later
on this year.

--
Hywel Williams
http://www.starfury.demon.co.uk/uground